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Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

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Girl_Next_Door
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Postby Girl_Next_Door » Tue, 28 Jan 2014 8:59 am

One of my suggestions would be to try for management associates program in the major local and foreign banks (DBS, OCBC, UOB, Citibank, Standard Chartered), especially if you have outstanding grades. I can't say for other banks but there are quite a fair bit of foreigners in Citibank MA program (not easy to get in). Your exposure will also be much bigger if you can get into the MA program.

My husband is a Belgian and the only time he uses French is when he is dealing with the Luxembourg office. Depending which part of Belgian you are from and which language is your first/second language, you can also try French or German banks for junior positions. They do hire candidates who are french or german speaking but its not a prerequisite unless you have to deal with the head office frequently.

Good luck!

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Postby zzm9980 » Tue, 28 Jan 2014 9:30 am

econstudent wrote:
"They only hire new grads in areas where they cannot get locals because the technology is too new to have been taught in a local university. "


What technology can they teach in Belgium or, in my case, the US to undergrads that they cannot each in the most tech advanced city-state in the world?


I don't know about you, but we're talking about Singapore here. Have you lived here? It's quite small, not a lot of people, and only a few universities. There is lots of cutting edge research that takes place only in a few places around the world, why would Singaporean schools try to replicate every little bit?

Or, to literally interpret what you said, yes, it may be the most tech-advanced city-state in the world compared to its competition of Vatican city and Monaco.

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Postby JR8 » Tue, 28 Jan 2014 10:07 am

Girl_Next_Door wrote:One of my suggestions would be to try for management associates program in the major local and foreign banks (DBS, OCBC, UOB, Citibank, Standard Chartered), especially if you have outstanding grades. I can't say for other banks but there are quite a fair bit of foreigners in Citibank MA program (not easy to get in). Your exposure will also be much bigger if you can get into the MA program.



Interesting programmes there (I googled some banks that provide this locally). Like a 18-36 month 'management rotation programme', as it used to called long ago. Quite a commitment, though they are looking for the best. Some thoughts:

- I wonder if participants get paid.
- I wonder if they are from families already established/living here.
- If they come from abroad to participate, I wonder what kind of visa would they need?

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Postby AngMoG » Tue, 28 Jan 2014 11:16 am

JR8 wrote:
Girl_Next_Door wrote:One of my suggestions would be to try for management associates program in the major local and foreign banks (DBS, OCBC, UOB, Citibank, Standard Chartered), especially if you have outstanding grades. I can't say for other banks but there are quite a fair bit of foreigners in Citibank MA program (not easy to get in). Your exposure will also be much bigger if you can get into the MA program.



Interesting programmes there (I googled some banks that provide this locally). Like a 18-36 month 'management rotation programme', as it used to called long ago. Quite a commitment, though they are looking for the best. Some thoughts:

- I wonder if participants get paid.
- I wonder if they are from families already established/living here.
- If they come from abroad to participate, I wonder what kind of visa would they need?


- Yes, they get paid.
- Some are, some are not. But note there is no guarantee the position afterwards will be in SG.
- EP (or possibly S-Pass).

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Postby NikaAddis » Thu, 30 Jan 2014 11:24 am

Are you doing your exchange now? Then start networking! I don't know much about MOM regulations but I know that the right people will help you more to get a job than any other thing here. Also contact the Chamber of Commerce and the Association of your country. They might be able to provide valuable info/contacts. You can also contact the American Association of Singapore (http://www.aasingapore.com/), they do career counseling (also on all the paper stuff you need, etc.) and events for all nationalities.

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby ohmz52 » Thu, 30 Jan 2014 10:28 pm

Daan wrote:Hi all,

I am wondering how big the chances are for a foreigner from Europe to get a job here in Singapore straight after graduation.

My interest lays in Finance (corporate or banking) and when I will graduate I will have a master degree in Business Administration with a Major in Finance (In Belgium people go for masters straight after bachelors, so I don't have work experience related to my degree). I do realise that people from all over the world start applying here in Singapore, therefore I hope my 9 month exchange at Singapore Management University will give me an advantage when they select people for an interview.

Where should I apply? Agencies? Directly at the firm? Probably both...

How strict are those quotas with regards to the ratio of local workers versus foreign?


Looking forward to hearing from you guys!


Not impossible, but difficult.

All roles are tough nowadays; even more so for grads.

Personally, I think it doesn't matter what degree you have at a graduate level (to an extent), it matters only that you are humble, show willingless to learn and are hard working.
The grass is greener on the other side.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 30 Jan 2014 11:58 pm

But without experienc you are p*ssing in the wind as no matter HOW WELL you present yourself to the Company and no matter how bad the company may want you, you and your employer still has to get by the MOM and their criteria (of which, they care not one iota, how bad the company may want you.) Without experience you are no different than a local grad with no experience. Why would the MOM give a job to a foreigner under today's political duress instead of a local? They won't.

But if one has a thick hide, then apply, by all means, but don't get your feelings hurt if/when you are rejected. We con't sugar coat the truth here as it is counterproductive.

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Postby ohmz52 » Fri, 31 Jan 2014 12:27 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:But without experienc you are p*ssing in the wind as no matter HOW WELL you present yourself to the Company and no matter how bad the company may want you, you and your employer still has to get by the MOM and their criteria (of which, they care not one iota, how bad the company may want you.) Without experience you are no different than a local grad with no experience. Why would the MOM give a job to a foreigner under today's political duress instead of a local? They won't.

But if one has a thick hide, then apply, by all means, but don't get your feelings hurt if/when you are rejected. We con't sugar coat the truth here as it is counterproductive.



Hmm fair point.

But then again I am a grad and have no experience longer than 5 months, and I got an EP within a day. Maybe I was lucky?

It's tough but do-able I think.
The grass is greener on the other side.

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby Daan » Sun, 04 Jan 2015 7:25 am

I am currently dating my Singaporean girlfriend for 1,5 years. When I left Singapore in may she moved to Belgium to take her masters. My job search didn't really work out earlier. Had interviews at belgian banks and even they said they couldn't get me trough the MOM stage.

My plan is to stay in Belgium for a year to do several internships in corporate finance (Investment Banking). Afterwards I would like to go to Sg again. Is it possible I can get a visa trough my girlfriend? Or only through marriage (or not even possible trough this?)?

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Postby uscate » Sun, 04 Jan 2015 10:00 am

I don't know about you, but we're talking about Singapore here. Have you lived here? It's quite small, not a lot of people, and only a few universities. There is lots of cutting edge research that takes place only in a few places around the world, why would Singaporean schools try to replicate every little bit?

Or, to literally interpret what you said, yes, it may be the most tech-advanced city-state in the world compared to its competition of Vatican city and Mona
co.[/quote]

I know this is an old quote, zzm, but I just cracked up when I read it, and figured it was worth a re-quoting….LOLOLOLOL!!! Thank you!!!

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby Daan » Thu, 08 Jan 2015 4:01 pm

anyone?

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby JR8 » Thu, 08 Jan 2015 8:09 pm

Daan wrote:I am currently dating my Singaporean girlfriend for 1,5 years. When I left Singapore in may she moved to Belgium to take her masters. My job search didn't really work out earlier. Had interviews at belgian banks and even they said they couldn't get me trough the MOM stage.

My plan is to stay in Belgium for a year to do several internships in corporate finance (Investment Banking). Afterwards I would like to go to Sg again. Is it possible I can get a visa trough my girlfriend? Or only through marriage (or not even possible trough this?)?


It's not clear to me what nationality you are, and where you both live. I.e. Does Belgium have a 'MoM'?

I'm not a lawyer, but I doubt 1.5 years with, as you say, a girlfriend is enough to substantiate a claim of Common Law Marriage. You might have a right to apply for permission to work via marriage, by means of a Dependent Pass and Letter of Consent. Might, I don't know. But they will look at the length and depth of the marriage.

Do you think it might be easier to gain work experience on your home ground, and then seek to relo abroad again when your employability is more robust? I'm not sure there's much long-term opportunity in places like SG for foreigners starting out their careers whose experience is limited to being an intern. I.e. as a part of the visa petition, you need to justify why you should get a position, that locals do not have the skills or experience to fill.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby Daan » Thu, 08 Jan 2015 8:43 pm

I am a Belgian who was studying in Singapore last year. When I was there I applied to some Belgian banks and they told me MOM (singapore) is not gonna give you a visa so they can't employ me. I met my Singaporean girlfriend while I was in Singapore and in the meanwhile she's back with me here in Belgium, studying for her master degree.

I get the entire concept but I thought some companies would make an exception and push MOM in some sort of way. For example at Belgian banks I have the advantage of speaking dutch. But I guess that's not really important enough...

One of my fellow exchangers during that period did an internship (german company in sg). They said he could come back any time for a job. No problems where made about a visa.

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Re: Opportunities for a young forgein graduate

Postby the lynx » Fri, 09 Jan 2015 9:10 am

Daan wrote:I am a Belgian who was studying in Singapore last year. When I was there I applied to some Belgian banks and they told me MOM (singapore) is not gonna give you a visa so they can't employ me. I met my Singaporean girlfriend while I was in Singapore and in the meanwhile she's back with me here in Belgium, studying for her master degree.

I get the entire concept but I thought some companies would make an exception and push MOM in some sort of way. For example at Belgian banks I have the advantage of speaking dutch. But I guess that's not really important enough...

One of my fellow exchangers during that period did an internship (german company in sg). They said he could come back any time for a job. No problems where made about a visa.


I assume he is into non-banking field and that he is into engineering (being in German company). It is probably because he might have niche skill and knowledge set in his field that cannot be found locally.

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Re:

Postby brian_singapore » Fri, 09 Jan 2015 10:22 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:As an HR Manager here of a SME (200 man company) with roughly 40% foreign staff, I have around 14 years experience in dealing with MOM from an employer's P.O.V. so I speak with a fair bit of gravitas. What you have been told here is pretty much the gospel. While we do get the occasional surprise, it is fairly rare. So far, what you have told us, along with 80 cents will get you a cup of kopi and the local kopitiam, and not much else. Having European language skills here is not experience, sad to say. MOM requires around 2 years of experience minimum. They only hire new grads in areas where they cannot get locals because the technology is too new to have been taught in a local university. From what I've heard so far is nothing that would make MOM life an eyebrow. Sure you will get offers and you will get the occasional interview but at the end of the day, it's doubtful you will get an approval for something that a local can do.

If you have all those smarts, why haven't you be able to digest the virtually constant news since May 2011 regarding the tightening up of criteria here? Your degrees are nothing special, sad to say. Financial degrees are numerous here as are Masters Degrees. Unless you are fluent in both English AND Mandarin, I don't see you getting a leg up as most Europeans in the financial industries, even in your own country, speak English as a second language as well a French. Plenty of locals with those same qualifications.

Having said all of that, I'd say go for it. Learning a little humility might be a sobering experience for you. Who knows, you might even get lucky (but don't hold your breath - it could be hazardous to your health).


The funny thing is the experience requirement isn't unique to Singapore. This is something that virtually every country in the world (including the OPs current home country) requires before issueing a WP to anyone. Most require a good deal more then 2-3 years.


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