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Do you find this strange?

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x9200
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Postby x9200 » Fri, 22 Nov 2013 12:24 pm

JR8 wrote:
x9200 wrote:Isn't the intention the key?


Perhaps. Just I don't think 98% of 'the accused' think about it.

This could be, but how this make the whole thing positively vulgar? It is not that people get magically transformed by having more money. It is what was in them before they got the money. You can move people out from the kampong but you can not move kampong out from the people.

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Postby PrimroseHill » Fri, 22 Nov 2013 4:01 pm

I don't think that it is the nouveau rich. I think that it is a chinese thing. Not a kampung thing either.
They like new car. New house. New clothes. Everything new.
They always have that competitive edge. Some people do. These people are always afraid that you maybe cleverer, more itelligent, richer, drives a better car etc etc.
1. I don't know why your daughter bother to come back to this part of the world. She is better off in London. I bet you that she can't make it thats why she is back here. You know, Mrs. Wong's daughter got given a MYR1m recently to buy a place in London. You know, Vincent just bought a yacht. He has a BMW 3 series and a big house in Taman Tun. Your daughter must be a failure thats why she is back here with her tail behind her legs.
2. You know LC's brother bought a commercial unit at One Borneo? And he just built a great big house in Kingston? 5 bedrooms, you know. And you know that LC owns a huge Victorian house? Yes, Brits generally believe that it is vulgar to discuss money. However, it is not the general consensus
3. Seriously, your ah girl only has 8A s for SPM. Ah Boy did so well that he is now in NUS, straight through no need to do STPM.

4. You know every year, ah boy give me MYR10k to go on tour . So good boy

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Postby JR8 » Fri, 22 Nov 2013 4:58 pm

@x9, I agree entirely with your last sentence :)

Perhaps the perception is a part and parcel of social practice. It can be complex: ‘Old money has no need to shout’, as they say. It can be remarkably subtle, and at times hypocritical, in what is being signalled (consciously or not). But then you cross a border and all the rules change. Back home, I don’t think I have a single friend/relative who owns a Swiss watch, whereas here in singapore, it appears almost compulsory (often a big shouty gold one. What do you think one should make of that? The perception will be in the eye of the beholder I’d have thought).

When I worked in banking, I was amongst a lot of ‘new money’ 12hrs a day, but also a lot of fantastically intelligent young people (unlike me, I just worked double-time to try and keep up!) who came from often pedestrian or humble backgrounds, but had a killer-will to make it. Pay a 25 year old $5 million (20yrs ago)? That chap, Andy, was a humble valet-parker at the Dorchester Park Lane 5 years earlier ... you can see the heady cocktail. Many people were like that, almost everyone had some back-story going on. Very few people came out of an orthodox background and education, those that did tended to be proprietary or swaps traders (and we all hated them lol).

No, most people IME don’t tend to get ‘transformed’ via money. But to an extent I think it depends how they make it. Those who make it by accident are those most likely to go and blow it. A ‘classy’ example from today amply illustrates :) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... tible.html On the flipside, do it methodically as part of a lifelong plan and I don’t think it changes you one iota.

My parents never have and likely never will discuss money. You could say it is a dirty or vulgar topic to them. I grew up with few treats, and through a meritocracy where I have (ultimately) seen extremes of wealth, the likes of which I’ll never experience again. Wealth seems of little importance of itself, it is more a facilitator of ones expectations [and around and around we go]..... lol....

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Re: Do you find this strange?

Postby zzm9980 » Fri, 22 Nov 2013 7:06 pm

Addadude wrote:A couple of considerations:

1. You can't really get a fair gauge on local interior design preferences from ads for apartments to rent. Those places are always going to be furnished as cheaply as humanly possible with Ikea and/or cast off, hand-me-down furniture.

This is based on my visiting various locals' HDBs, and their condos. Auntie that lives near me as a nephew that bought a 1.8mil condo about two years ago. I've visited 3 times since then, and the furnishings have not increased at all.

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Re: Do you find this strange?

Postby JR8 » Fri, 22 Nov 2013 7:15 pm

zzm9980 wrote:This is based on my visiting various locals' HDBs, and their condos. Auntie that lives near me as a nephew that bought a 1.8mil condo about two years ago. I've visited 3 times since then, and the furnishings have not increased at all.


SG is truly weird. The logic seems to be tell the people they're going to be a $million richer next year (directly or indirectly), and they'll keep voting for the Lee dynasty. But, ah, stop, and thing otherwhise, and everythink spoilt and gon--to-pot ah!

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Postby earthfriendly » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 2:07 am

In USA, people don't usually talk about money. I have a divorced MIL and we don't know her financial situation and whether she has enough funds to cover her retirement. Probing about others' salary and "how much does that cost" is annoying. But the inability and avoidance to talk about money is also unhealthy.

As for me, I raise my kids to view money as an "equal". Money has a lot of power (over people) but only if you allow it to. Don't let it underwhelm or overwhelm you. It is great if you get to enjoy all the riches but if you have less of it, just learn to spend less and budget more. Humans are actually quite flexible, you know.

As for SG, it is a young nation/culture going thru all the growing pain. As it grows and mature, the people will start to find its own footing and feel less need to be so material-bound or exam-bound. It will take more than one generation.

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Re: Do you find this strange?

Postby earthfriendly » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 2:20 am

Addadude wrote:2. In my experience Asians are perfectly comfortable sitting or lounging around on floors so having lost of plush sofas and chairs to sprawl on is not really necessary. (I used to attend a small church group in Simei. The group leader's semi-detached was very comfortably furnished but whenever he had a large group over, the chairs and sofa would be pushed back and everybody would sit on the floor. As the only Westerner in the group I was the guy who was always shifting around as various part of my nether regions went to sleep from the prolonged contact with the hard floor.)



T'is :love: . We go to a place that that teaches "mindfulness" to families. We sit in a circle on the floor without shoes. And we all pull up a cushion. It is very comfortable and the kids are engaged. Have to restrain my daughter who couldn't stop raising her hand and wanting to give her input. Wheras in school, several teachers have told me she is reluctant to contribute to class discussion.

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Re: Do you find this strange?

Postby JR8 » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 2:27 am

earthfriendly wrote:T'is :love: . We go to a place that that teaches "mindfulness" to families.


In my experience, these things only happen where people are naturally seriously deficient. I would prefer to be in a place where ''''graciousness''' [being civil, at a most basic level] comes naturally.

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Postby earthfriendly » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 2:35 am

T'is true. I have come across characters like you mentioned. Looking for a way out or escape from the reality of life, thinking that a magic potion can cure the ills in their lives. Although I would not make a blanket statement that everyone who goes that route are like that. There are people who use it as a tool for inner cultivation and believes in self-reliance and self-sufficiency. And for me, I hope my kids learn to be not so reactive and the skill to impose self-time-out. Ability to take a step back.

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Postby JR8 » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 2:54 am

Move to somewhere like suburban Stockholm. Carry on as you might here. See how well it goes down :-D


p.s. that's perhaps the most tolerant country in Europe.

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Postby x9200 » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 8:19 am

PrimroseHill wrote:I don't think that it is the nouveau rich. I think that it is a chinese thing. Not a kampung thing either.
They like new car. New house. New clothes. Everything new.
They always have that competitive edge. Some people do. These people are always afraid that you maybe cleverer, more itelligent, richer, drives a better car etc etc.

Sounds like over the kiasu line and perhaps it has its share, but I would not rule out the kampong and NR things completely. I don't have any experience with Malaysia but for Singapore the reality is that this is a society that got rich only recently and over relatively short period of time. There is not like a solid track of sustained, also cultural growth for the majority of the population. Compare to Western Europe where such growth was enjoyed since the end of WWII. Compare to post-communistic European states where this growth was not enjoyed. There are some clear tendencies and similarities. When this growth is present longer time people eventually move their focus from basic needs (money, food, tv) to more sophisticated ones.

Money is an important component of Chinese culture so this probably adds up to the end effect but it is also clear that more educated Chinese (in broader, also cultural sense) don't show (openly?) this obsession towards money. Is it because of the Western culture they have been exposed to? I doubt it. IMO, this the shift in priorities.

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Re: Do you find this strange?

Postby x9200 » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 8:25 am

earthfriendly wrote:T'is :love: . We go to a place that that teaches "mindfulness" to families. We sit in a circle on the floor without shoes. And we all pull up a cushion. It is very comfortable and the kids are engaged. Have to restrain my daughter who couldn't stop raising her hand and wanting to give her input. Wheras in school, several teachers have told me she is reluctant to contribute to class discussion.

Sadly I have never seen anything like this in any of these half empty flats around. All I see every time is people sitting on the sofa/chairs and watching TV.

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Postby earthfriendly » Sat, 23 Nov 2013 11:21 am

This is not is a resident. It is in a center. I was just commenting that sitting on the ground can make people feel more settled in.

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Postby aster » Thu, 28 Nov 2013 7:56 pm

bgd wrote:Like the drivers who park just before the ERP waiting for the clock to click over so they can save 0.50c :???:


I didn't think much of this until I actually saw a nice, shiny Jag pull over to wait along with a handful of other cars... whose combined value was probably less than 1/10 of the Jag. :)

I believe it was something like 3 mins to save 50 cents. I wonder if that same person would wait an hour to save $10...

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Postby kookaburrah » Mon, 02 Dec 2013 12:44 pm

JR8 wrote:
PrimroseHill wrote:My extended family; paternal and maternal are like that, materialistic and competitive. I hate this keeping up with the Joneses stuff - your son has how many As? 20? Wah, your Ah Boy so clever, my son has 39As now in Oxford reading Classic.
Or as soon as they walk into the house, how much is your house worth? Wah Ashley Cole is your neighbour meh?
How much is your salary? How much is your bonus?


Thanks for the genuine LOL PH :lol:

Doesn't it all reek of 'new money'. To get it, you need to compete, and gauge your success against others. When you have it, it no longer matters, to the point that discussing it is positively vulgar.


Sorry JR8, I could not resist

http://forum.singaporeexpats.com/ftopic95785.html


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