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zzm9980
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Postby zzm9980 » Thu, 12 Sep 2013 9:16 pm

Barnsley wrote:"In his commentary, Mr Putin maintained his steadfast support of Syrian President Bashar al Assad, writing there was "every reason to believe" it was not the regime, but rebel forces who used sarin nerve gas in an attack on August 21"

:shock:


Putin sees him as necessary to maintain stability. I think Iraq is proof enough you need a brutal thug in charge of some places to prevent further massive slaughter. All of those rebel groups are just going to turn outward a few years after they remove Al-Assad and the dust settles there. Putin sees this, the US seems to have forgotten already.

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Strong Eagle
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Postby Strong Eagle » Thu, 12 Sep 2013 9:45 pm

zzm9980 wrote:
Barnsley wrote:"In his commentary, Mr Putin maintained his steadfast support of Syrian President Bashar al Assad, writing there was "every reason to believe" it was not the regime, but rebel forces who used sarin nerve gas in an attack on August 21"

:shock:


Putin sees him as necessary to maintain stability. I think Iraq is proof enough you need a brutal thug in charge of some places to prevent further massive slaughter. All of those rebel groups are just going to turn outward a few years after they remove Al-Assad and the dust settles there. Putin sees this, the US seems to have forgotten already.


The UN has said that it has "unequivocal" evidence that Syria used the chemical weapons... and I'm sure Putin would never lie, would he?

Having said that, as much as it stinks, I agree that a dictator is required to hold the warring factions in control. There is a great book called Spiral Dynamics whose basic premise is that you cannot drag a society from a stone age culture to modern democracy... it must go through 4 or 5 phases.

Iraq is failing because those is power have failed to heed to lessons in Spiral Dynamics... they might have had a chance if they had embraced the theories and attempted to put them to work.

rdueej
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Postby rdueej » Thu, 12 Sep 2013 9:57 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:
zzm9980 wrote:
Barnsley wrote:"In his commentary, Mr Putin maintained his steadfast support of Syrian President Bashar al Assad, writing there was "every reason to believe" it was not the regime, but rebel forces who used sarin nerve gas in an attack on August 21"

:shock:


Putin sees him as necessary to maintain stability. I think Iraq is proof enough you need a brutal thug in charge of some places to prevent further massive slaughter. All of those rebel groups are just going to turn outward a few years after they remove Al-Assad and the dust settles there. Putin sees this, the US seems to have forgotten already.


The UN has said that it has "unequivocal" evidence that Syria used the chemical weapons... and I'm sure Putin would never lie, would he?

Having said that, as much as it stinks, I agree that a dictator is required to hold the warring factions in control. There is a great book called Spiral Dynamics whose basic premise is that you cannot drag a society from a stone age culture to modern democracy... it must go through 4 or 5 phases.

Iraq is failing because those is power have failed to heed to lessons in Spiral Dynamics... they might have had a chance if they had embraced the theories and attempted to put them to work.


I was under the impression that the report by the UN inspectors has not yet been filed. It has only been 'western' diplomats who have been making those claims.

Russia has a lot to gain by having Assad remain in power. Russian weapons account for 50% of Syria's arms imports, so yes, Putin does have a motivation to lie (or rather support the Syrian regime to the fullest).

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Postby earthfriendly » Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:18 am

http://gma.yahoo.com/vladimir-putin-pen ... ories.html

Beautifully written "Putin said, "It is extremely dangerous to encourage people to see themselves as exceptional, whatever the motivation." "

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Strong Eagle
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Postby Strong Eagle » Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:44 am

rdueej wrote:I was under the impression that the report by the UN inspectors has not yet been filed. It has only been 'western' diplomats who have been making those claims.

Russia has a lot to gain by having Assad remain in power. Russian weapons account for 50% of Syria's arms imports, so yes, Putin does have a motivation to lie (or rather support the Syrian regime to the fullest).


It is Foreign Policy magazine that has filed the report.

http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts ... cal_attack

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Postby rdueej » Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:05 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:
rdueej wrote:I was under the impression that the report by the UN inspectors has not yet been filed. It has only been 'western' diplomats who have been making those claims.

Russia has a lot to gain by having Assad remain in power. Russian weapons account for 50% of Syria's arms imports, so yes, Putin does have a motivation to lie (or rather support the Syrian regime to the fullest).


It is Foreign Policy magazine that has filed the report.

http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts ... cal_attack



The magazine is trying to pull a quick one with the title. The very first paragraph inside reads

U.N. inspectors have collected a "wealth" of evidence ... , according to a senior Western official


It continues to quote this anonymous source, and does not provide any other confirmation of the news.

While I agree that the Assad regime is guilty of numerous human rights violations, I just want to avoid a repeat of Colin Powell's WMD speech (10 yrs ago at the UN), which got us in the mess that is Iraq.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:45 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:All calculated and choreographed.


I'll say one thing, they are really choreographing this one extremely and convincingly well with Putin's NYTimes Op-Ed piece.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opini ... .html?_r=0

http://publiceditor.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ... imes/?_r=0

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wor ... t-checked/


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