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How big a risk

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Steve1960
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How big a risk

Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 11:39 am

So my wife would like her good friend to be our maid. Putting aside the issues of whether or not that is a good idea in itself there are other problems.

The lady is Filipina currently living in Manila. In 2011 she was refused exit from the Philippines when try to visit a boyfriend in Jakarta. Unsure of the reason immigration gave her.

More recently she was refused exit from the Philippines last month when trying to visit us for a vacation. Immigration refused on the basis that my wife and I are not 1st to 4th generation relatives and therefore could not sponser her.

Add to that the bad press Philippines immigration has received in recent months and the firing of their Director.

Add to that the strained situation between the Philippine Embassy and Singapore employment agencies over who should be paying the fees.

Even if I pay out S$2,600 to get all the correct documentation to bring her in as a direct maid am I wasting my money? Looking for anyone who could offer a little guidance as I am visiting the agency here on Saturday.

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Postby bgd » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:05 pm

You know the personalities involved but I guess if you are asking here you suspect trouble.

From the outside looking in it does sound like a disaster in the making. Employing a friend is one thing but having her live with you 24/7 is really asking for trouble. What happens if your wife and her fall out, you will be stuck in the middle. An unhappy maid in the house can be a disrupting influence, just read these forums.

I’m looking forward to your “Maid Behaving Badlyâ€Â

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Postby Hannieroo » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:09 pm

I think if you have your name on her previously intended visit and then put it on transfer papers you'll be refused. Just basing that on common sense, really. For good reason, really. It's really hard to tell a friend or relative not to do cash in hand jobs or stay out all night.

And I know you don't want opinions on whether it's a good idea or not. But, dude? Seriously?

ETA this post is brought to you by the word "really". It really is.
Last edited by Hannieroo on Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Hannieroo » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:11 pm

Or if they don't fall out and you end up with a 3 way marriage where you have no privacy and any arguments are two against one? That would be living the dream. Two wives! Double the nagging and probably half the sex.

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Postby bgd » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:17 pm

Good point! What does she look like. 8-)

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Re: How big a risk

Postby nakatago » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:41 pm

Steve1960 wrote:The lady is Filipina currently living in Manila. In 2011 she was refused exit from the Philippines when try to visit a boyfriend in Jakarta. Unsure of the reason immigration gave her.

More recently she was refused exit from the Philippines last month when trying to visit us for a vacation. Immigration refused on the basis that my wife and I are not 1st to 4th generation relatives and therefore could not sponser her.
.


Philippine immigration sets a really low bar for women going to neighboring countries that don't require visas from Filipinas. They would usually require an invitation letter from the Philippine embassy (for a fee, of course!). It's about human trafficking fears and the government taking advantage of an opportunity for another revenue stream.

If you'll take her as your maid, you'll have to jump through so many superfluous and unnecessarily complicated hoops, most of which involves paying. You know, to prevent human trafficking primarily and line some pockets secondarily.

As an aside, to illustrate how ridiculous things can get: a Filipino who acquires a valid residency visa in another country would be required to attend seminars (for a fee) and purchase some documents before being allowed out of the country and into another country that requires nothing more than the passport and the already-granted visa.

They have the right intentions but the execution is severely misguided.
Last edited by nakatago on Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Steve1960
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Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:43 pm

Hannieroo wrote:Or if they don't fall out and you end up with a 3 way marriage where you have no privacy and any arguments are two against one? That would be living the dream. Two wives! Double the nagging and probably half the sex.


That is scary enough to put me off the idea!

Your previous comment is probably more significant though. Yes my name was associated with her previous refusal at immigration. It is quite possible (even likely) they would refuse her exit again even with all the correct foreign worker documents.

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:48 pm

Hannieroo wrote:Or if they don't fall out and you end up with a 3 way marriage where you have no privacy and any arguments are two against one? That would be living the dream. Two wives! Double the nagging and probably half the sex.


You DO NOT want a Filipina nagger!

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Re: How big a risk

Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:50 pm

nakatago wrote:[Philippine immigration sets a really low bar for women going to neighboring countries that don't require visas from Filipinas. They would usually require an invitation letter from the Philippine embassy (for a fee, of course!). It's about human trafficking fears and the government taking advantage of an opportunity for another revenue stream.

If you'll take her as your maid, you'll have to jump through so many superfluous and unnecessarily complicated hoops, most of which involves paying. You know, to prevent human trafficking primarily and line some pockets secondarily.

As an aside, to illustrate how ridiculous things can get: a Filipino who acquires a valid residency visa in another country would be required to attend seminars (for a fee) and purchase some documents before being allowed out of the country and into another country that requires nothing more than the passport and the already-granted visa.


Yes I am very familiar with Philippine red tape and bureaucracy :-(

Had it not been for the two refused exits I would only be contending with the current Philippine vs Singapore maid fee issues. I guess I just hoped that if she had all the overseas workers documentation in place there would be no grounds for exit refusal but I don't think it would be that straightforward.

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Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 12:52 pm

nakatago wrote:[You DO NOT want a Filipina nagger!


haha or any race of nagger! My wife is wonderful which means maybe I should not tempt fate!!

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Re: How big a risk

Postby nakatago » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 1:14 pm

Steve1960 wrote:Yes I am very familiar with Philippine red tape and bureaucracy :-(

Had it not been for the two refused exits I would only be contending with the current Philippine vs Singapore maid fee issues. I guess I just hoped that if she had all the overseas workers documentation in place there would be no grounds for exit refusal but I don't think it would be that straightforward.


That's the irony. All of a sudden, entering a more developed country as a migrant is more straightforward than exiting the Philippines as a tourist. When I was still working there, whenever I had to go out of the country for business trips, I need an extra binder of documents just to clear departure immigration!

Heck, it extends to a lot of things too: getting police clearance, renewing a driver's license, having parcel shipped in...

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Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 1:22 pm

I have built up a huge file of documentation over the last four years and I hand carry it every time we visit the Philippines just in case we need to get some kind of official paperwork for something.

My success rate so far has been 99%. I only got caught out once. On a business trip to Manila I told my wife I would collect our daughters 'legitamised' birth certificate (she was originally born before we were married). I didn't take the file with me only the documents the NSO said they needed on their web site.

Huge mistake.......huge. They asked to see my decree absolute from a previous marriage and I didn't have it with me :x

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Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 1:27 pm

..................and it does make me smile because when I first met my wife her NSO birth certificate said she was 2 years younger than she actually was and was male!!

No lady boy jokes please she has given birth to our daughter haha

But really, all that red tape and actually form what I know of my wife and her friends quite a high percentage of the docuements are actually incorrect!!!

I still love the Philippines though :-)

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 1:37 pm

The NSO is stupid; whenever you request a document from them (which they certify as true), they put an EXPIRATION date.

How the hell in the world does a birth certificate expire? And said document is only a low-res copy of the original on paper with a funky pattern printed on it! As in feed special paper into those really cheap photocopiers not capable of producing grayscale tones.

Good thing other countries ignore the expiration date because it's stupid.

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Postby Steve1960 » Thu, 25 Jul 2013 1:43 pm

I never noticed that my god! I must take a look later.

The NSO is also crowded, baking hot (after all its a tin roof with no walls!) and inefficient.

At least City Hall, Municiple Hall and the DFA are actually proper buildings with air con!

Anyway getting off topic.

We will go visit the employment agency Saturday and see what they say but it looks like I could be wasting my money on this and potentially halving my sex life if Hanni is right


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