Singapore Expats Forum

Malaysian Election Any impact direct/indirect on Singapore?

Discuss about any latest news or current affairs in Singapore or globally. Please DO NOT copy and paste news articles from other sources without written permission.
User avatar
ScoobyDoes
Manager
Manager
Posts: 1650
Joined: Wed, 29 Nov 2006
Location: A More Lucky Spot

Postby ScoobyDoes » Wed, 08 May 2013 10:00 am

As Lynx said (and better than I tried) 'it can only be carried out alongside the existing Syariah Court as an additional enactment. And non-Muslims are exempted from Syariah Court under existing constitution.'

We're not talking Pakistan or other quite extreme locations so, again, for me it's not a problem. If, in certain states they want to go that route, then they've voted for it amongst themselves. I doubt they would be as extreme in enforcement as the territories you've mentioned, Malaysians have tasted a great deal of freedoms and to renounce it 100% will be impossible.

Your point about capital punishment doesn't quite wash through, given where you are. Maybe the mode is different, but the principles apply.
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'

SIR Stirling Moss OBE

User avatar
zzm9980
Governor
Governor
Posts: 6837
Joined: Wed, 06 Jul 2011
Location: Once more unto the breach

Postby zzm9980 » Wed, 08 May 2013 12:23 pm

ScoobyDoes wrote:As Lynx said (and better than I tried) 'it can only be carried out alongside the existing Syariah Court as an additional enactment. And non-Muslims are exempted from Syariah Court under existing constitution.'

We're not talking Pakistan or other quite extreme locations so, again, for me it's not a problem. If, in certain states they want to go that route, then they've voted for it amongst themselves. I doubt they would be as extreme in enforcement as the territories you've mentioned, Malaysians have tasted a great deal of freedoms and to renounce it 100% will be impossible.


But if you're born a Muslim, you can't become a non-Muslim according to the same laws. And either way, it's a slippery slope. I don't trust a population willing to go down the road of enacting these types of punishments to exercise restraint once they have power. (Oh, let's not chop off his hand! or, we can't stone her! they're christian/jewish/hindu!)

We're not talking Pakistan or other quite extreme locations so, again, for me it's not a problem.


You could have said the same thing about Egypt three years ago. Don't let your comfort with your northern neighbor's current stability (or anyone) delude you into thinking something like that could 'never' happen.

Your point about capital punishment doesn't quite wash through, given where you are. Maybe the mode is different, but the principles apply.


How do you know "where I am"? And even then, does my being present in a specific somehow imply I fully support all capital punishment and any of their other policies and laws? Am I not allowed to be here if I don't implicitly support everything that happens here?

User avatar
ScoobyDoes
Manager
Manager
Posts: 1650
Joined: Wed, 29 Nov 2006
Location: A More Lucky Spot

Postby ScoobyDoes » Wed, 08 May 2013 2:58 pm

zzm9980 wrote:But if you're born a Muslim, you can't become a non-Muslim according to the same laws. And either way, it's a slippery slope. I don't trust a population willing to go down the road of enacting these types of punishments to exercise restraint once they have power. (Oh, let's not chop off his hand! or, we can't stone her! they're christian/jewish/hindu!)


It's different if people know what's happening before they get to power, that's a different rational from dictatorship or coup.


You could have said the same thing about Egypt three years ago. Don't let your comfort with your northern neighbor's current stability (or anyone) delude you into thinking something like that could 'never' happen.


Having spent years living in Malaysia, I still stick with what I said.


How do you know "where I am"? And even then, does my being present in a specific somehow imply I fully support all capital punishment and any of their other policies and laws? Am I not allowed to be here if I don't implicitly support everything that happens here?


I mean a Singapore expat website, I don't give a toss where you physically live but you're here and by statement have said you don't trust the place? 'Do you really trust a population willing to put punishments like stonings, beheadings, and amputations on the books to fairly administer justice?'

As I said, the method may be different, but the principle is the same.

With regards mode of punishment and/or capital punishment whilst I don't agree with victims being punished, I have nothing against laws laid out against criminals IF laws are known beforehand. As the Singapore courts are fond of saying; 'Ignorance is not a Defence'.
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'



SIR Stirling Moss OBE

User avatar
zzm9980
Governor
Governor
Posts: 6837
Joined: Wed, 06 Jul 2011
Location: Once more unto the breach

Postby zzm9980 » Wed, 08 May 2013 7:51 pm

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I've never lived in Malaysia so I have no innate trust like you do that a bunch of people that are voting to impose floggings for adultry/illegal sex or drinking, amputations for shop lifting, stonings, etc, to apply those punishments "fairly and justly". IMO you're saying it's OK for a population to systematically commit human rights violations, as long as the majority vote it in.

If a woman is raped, she runs a high risk of being charged with zina, particularly if she becomes pregnant. In order to prove an absence of consent, a woman is required to provide four witnesses to the rape.


Ladies, better not get raped in rural Malaysia without your witnesses. They even lay out what the witnesses must see:

[quote] For the establishment of adultery, four witnesses "must have seen the act in its most intimate details, i.e. the penetration (like “a stick disappearing in a kohl container,â€Â

User avatar
Strong Eagle
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10418
Joined: Sat, 10 Jul 2004
Location: Off The Red Dot
Contact:

Postby Strong Eagle » Thu, 09 May 2013 9:14 am

I have lived in Malaysia. Nothing good can come from these backwards steps of trying to hudud in various states.

This is nothing more than religion trying to force its brand of "morality" on the public via the legislature.

Beyond that, hudud and the who Sharia law thing hearkens back to medieval times.

Better to get religion the hell out of politics, period.

User avatar
ScoobyDoes
Manager
Manager
Posts: 1650
Joined: Wed, 29 Nov 2006
Location: A More Lucky Spot

Postby ScoobyDoes » Thu, 09 May 2013 11:50 am

zzm9980 wrote:We'll just have to agree to disagree. I've never lived in Malaysia so I have no innate trust like you do that a bunch of people that are voting to impose floggings for adultry/illegal sex or drinking, amputations for shop lifting, stonings, etc, to apply those punishments "fairly and justly". IMO you're saying it's OK for a population to systematically commit human rights violations, as long as the majority vote it in.



I'm not condoning human rights violations but what you've come up so far isn't really a violation, its punishment. A human rights violation is, let's say, for example, holding people without trial in Cuba.

As I said, I am completely against victims being penalised so your examples to me of rape and proof etc. is something I do not agree with.



This is nothing more than religion trying to force its brand of "morality" on the public via the legislature.

Beyond that, hudud and the who Sharia law thing hearkens back to medieval times.


Catholicism is equally 'old school' and religion's influence in politics is just as strong in Italy, the US and the Philippines for example, as anywhere else in the Middle East or Asia. Whilst I, like you, don't agree with it, it is an inevitability.
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'



SIR Stirling Moss OBE

User avatar
x9200
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9166
Joined: Mon, 07 Sep 2009
Location: Singapore

Postby x9200 » Fri, 10 May 2013 7:21 am

ScoobyDoes wrote:
This is nothing more than religion trying to force its brand of "morality" on the public via the legislature.

Beyond that, hudud and the who Sharia law thing hearkens back to medieval times.


Catholicism is equally 'old school' and religion's influence in politics is just as strong in Italy, the US and the Philippines for example, as anywhere else in the Middle East or Asia.

And there is nothing good in it and much worse in the places with traditional, catholic-conservative societies like Ireland or Poland where 14yo rape victim can be refused abortion or right to leave the country and pregnant women can die if any more serious medical complications arise because the doctors are afraid to intervene.

It always takes a first step and majority of the religions are very greedy to have their ethics to monopolize over the whole society and be backed up by the law. Hope Malaysia is stable enough to survive this first step.

User avatar
Barnsley
Manager
Manager
Posts: 2068
Joined: Tue, 10 Jun 2008
Location: Pasir Ris
Contact:

Postby Barnsley » Mon, 13 May 2013 11:12 am

It would appear that the election results have had quite an impact on Singapore.

A couple of gatherings appear to have broken a few rules.
Life is short, paddle harder!!

User avatar
ScoobyDoes
Manager
Manager
Posts: 1650
Joined: Wed, 29 Nov 2006
Location: A More Lucky Spot

Postby ScoobyDoes » Mon, 13 May 2013 2:25 pm

Technically even the Eagle's meetings break a few rules...... a gathering of more than 3ppl slagging off the government..... oops.

It's a difficult thing to police but all getting together around the Merlion will surely get them noticed :cool:
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'



SIR Stirling Moss OBE

User avatar
the lynx
Governor
Governor
Posts: 5239
Joined: Thu, 09 Dec 2010
Location: Midgar

Postby the lynx » Mon, 13 May 2013 2:37 pm

If you don't hear from me for the next few days/weeks or ever, you know where I had been and what I would be wearing.










Kidding!

User avatar
sundaymorningstaple
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 34273
Joined: Thu, 11 Nov 2004
Location: Still Fishing!
Contact:

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 13 May 2013 4:51 pm

Watch yer step young'un! :cool:


  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “Latest News & Current Affairs”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest