Do I need to declare this income at all in Singapore?

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offshoreoildude
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Do I need to declare this income at all in Singapore?

Post by offshoreoildude » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 9:39 am

I work for a UK company. We have no legal entity in Singapore (I'm an SPR so I live here freely). I am the only employee here. I do not conduct any trade in Singapore although I answer emails etc. All of my business and 'work' is conducted outside of Singapore. My salary is paid without encumbrances into a Singapore bank account.

I originally thought I had to declare and pay tax on this income but a Singaporean in the same situation says I do not need to do pay tax on this income; principally as the company has no representation in Singapore and most (all) of the work and trade is conducted outside of Singapore.

Can anyone advise on this? I have written to IRAS with the same question.
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Post by offshoreoildude » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 10:04 am

Now I'm called PNGMK

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Post by x9200 » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 10:05 am

IMHO you still earn this income in Singapore (as opposite to earning it overseas) so you should pay taxes here. I understand that this is not your main income (so you don't need it for the REP renewal).

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Post by x9200 » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 10:08 am

offshoreoildude wrote:http://www.iras.gov.sg/irashome/page.aspx?id=8502

I think I'm good to go!
How? This says you should pay in SG unless it is shorter than 60 days.

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 10:09 am

OSOD, in theory, you are correct. However, it is the IRAS presumption that you will have to either pay tax in your home country/employer's country (if not the same) or in Singapore. So, provided you are paying taxes to the UK or to Aust on that income then the information you received is correct.

However, there is another thing you need to prepare for. If you are here as a PR on the PTS scheme as opposed to the family ties scheme, then you will still need to show tax returns to enable the REP renewal. This could be a double edged sword. Again, you could file nil returns, but whether or not this would satisfy the letter of the law regarding tax assessments is another guess that I'm not about to hazard a guess on. The technical wording might be the clincher. At least three tax assessments or tax returns? A nil return would probably not have a tax assessment, but a letter from IRAS saying you are not required to file. Something to chew on, yeah?
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Post by offshoreoildude » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 12:38 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:OSOD, in theory, you are correct. However, it is the IRAS presumption that you will have to either pay tax in your home country/employer's country (if not the same) or in Singapore. So, provided you are paying taxes to the UK or to Aust on that income then the information you received is correct.

However, there is another thing you need to prepare for. If you are here as a PR on the PTS scheme as opposed to the family ties scheme, then you will still need to show tax returns to enable the REP renewal. This could be a double edged sword. Again, you could file nil returns, but whether or not this would satisfy the letter of the law regarding tax assessments is another guess that I'm not about to hazard a guess on. The technical wording might be the clincher. At least three tax assessments or tax returns? A nil return would probably not have a tax assessment, but a letter from IRAS saying you are not required to file. Something to chew on, yeah?
Thanks. 2012 is ok as I had other income and my UK company has just been bought (to be concluded in 2013) so I suspect 2013 will show income when I am moved (or fired) into the new local structure.

(And my REP is good til 2017 as I was in the lucky group that got 10 year renewals in 2007 - however an unemployed SPR friend has been stuck here for a year unable to leave because of the exact scenario you've outlined as his REP has expired!).
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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 1:25 pm

offshoreoildude wrote: (And my REP is good til 2017 as I was in the lucky group that got 10 year renewals in 2007 - however an unemployed SPR friend has been stuck here for a year unable to leave because of the exact scenario you've outlined as his REP has expired!).
I was in exactly the same position as your friend was in. I went for 15 months without leaving the country between 2004 & 2005. When I took up my current position, I renewed my REP (and I was also given a 10 year one, but it looks like I've only got around 2 more years or so now.) However, as I'm a PR based on Family Ties, AND sadly I'm over 55 (good point REP wise) I don't have to have a job to get renewed now. (I didn't know it at the time, but I didn't need a job in 2005 when I finally renewed. The officer at ICA told me that-for the future. I don't think that goes for the PTS scheme though.
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Post by offshoreoildude » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 6:28 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
offshoreoildude wrote: (And my REP is good til 2017 as I was in the lucky group that got 10 year renewals in 2007 - however an unemployed SPR friend has been stuck here for a year unable to leave because of the exact scenario you've outlined as his REP has expired!).
I was in exactly the same position as your friend was in. I went for 15 months without leaving the country between 2004 & 2005. When I took up my current position, I renewed my REP (and I was also given a 10 year one, but it looks like I've only got around 2 more years or so now.) However, as I'm a PR based on Family Ties, AND sadly I'm over 55 (good point REP wise) I don't have to have a job to get renewed now. (I didn't know it at the time, but I didn't need a job in 2005 when I finally renewed. The officer at ICA told me that-for the future. I don't think that goes for the PTS scheme though.
How do I establish which scheme I was originally under?

Some facts: I was married to an SC at the time I applied but also had a good high paying job in a EDB funded company designing you know what.
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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 7:15 pm

Good question. I really don't know the answer to that one, short of looking at a copy of your original application (I don't have a copy of mine either!) However I knew I would not qualify under the PTS scheme but was already married for 10 years and had two SC kids and it still took 2 tries and one appeal (after the 1st try). Second try I didn't make the mistake of using a lawyer (I've mentioned on here about not using lawyers with ICA before - for good reasons which were also confirmed by the original officer who did give me PR. albeit it was 12 or 13 years later when he told me this.) If you were qualified for both, I reckon you were probably given the FT approval with the backup of the fact you were additionally qualified for the PTS scheme. But I don't know which way the weightage goes. Probably that something you would have to approach ICA for.
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Post by offshoreoildude » Sat, 13 Apr 2013 8:35 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Good question. I really don't know the answer to that one, short of looking at a copy of your original application (I don't have a copy of mine either!) However I knew I would not qualify under the PTS scheme but was already married for 10 years and had two SC kids and it still took 2 tries and one appeal (after the 1st try). Second try I didn't make the mistake of using a lawyer (I've mentioned on here about not using lawyers with ICA before - for good reasons which were also confirmed by the original officer who did give me PR. albeit it was 12 or 13 years later when he told me this.) If you were qualified for both, I reckon you were probably given the FT approval with the backup of the fact you were additionally qualified for the PTS scheme. But I don't know which way the weightage goes. Probably that something you would have to approach ICA for.
Mmmm, ok well when I have reapplied for REP it seems they need both proof of income as well as family ties...!
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Post by PNGMK » Tue, 25 Jun 2013 4:32 pm

The IRAS has asked me to register as a "Regional Representative" and to record the number of days I was out of Singapore. I have done so and in return received a HEFTY discount on my taxes.

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 25 Jun 2013 4:39 pm

noice! :D
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Post by PNGMK » Tue, 25 Jun 2013 4:48 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:noice! :D
Yes. I thought so. I even paid my taxes ASAP in return.

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