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UK Driving licence problems

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martincymru
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Postby martincymru » Sun, 20 Jan 2013 10:10 am

So I am correct....... there is no rational/cost effective answer.

All the replies have not provided any solution to my specific problem.

Put simply I want to renew my UK licence but cannot due I think to stupid European Union legislation.

Btw - UK licence is not for life, every 10 years need to renew the photo card.

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Postby Mi Amigo » Sun, 20 Jan 2013 4:14 pm

I still don't see why my solution wouldn't work for you, i.e. follow the principle that wherever you are resident, that's where you should get a driving license issued. If you're no longer resident in the UK, why is it so important to you to have a UK driving license? A Singapore driving license (at least in my experience in several countres) is a perfectly good alternative. Is there some other reason that you feel you need a UK license, apart from renting / driving cars there?
Be careful what you wish for

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Postby offshoreoildude » Sun, 20 Jan 2013 5:25 pm

Mi Amigo wrote:I still don't see why my solution wouldn't work for you, i.e. follow the principle that wherever you are resident, that's where you should get a driving license issued. If you're no longer resident in the UK, why is it so important to you to have a UK driving license? A Singapore driving license (at least in my experience in several countres) is a perfectly good alternative. Is there some other reason that you feel you need a UK license, apart from renting / driving cars there?


+1 - I thought Quantity Surveyors were smarter than this.

ID - use your passport.
DL - use your Singapore one - you've had plenty of expats here state this will work.
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Postby JR8 » Sun, 20 Jan 2013 7:14 pm

JR8:
[i]“A UK license if for ‘life’. Or put it another way it is valid until you are c.70 (IIRC), whereupon you need a doctors medical to renew it for each further five years.”

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Postby Mi Amigo » Sun, 20 Jan 2013 7:51 pm

Fair enough, but my point is: why waste time and energy doing battle with the DVLA (or whatever they're called this week) bureaucracy when there's a perfectly good alternative, i.e. get a Singapore license? Anyway, it's up to the OP; each to their own.
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Postby ScoobyDoes » Mon, 21 Jan 2013 11:47 am

My UK license is valid till I'm 70 so I still have around 30yrs left on the paper one issued back when. I don't have a photo ID driving license so I am fully assuming my paper one is valid.

I never got notification that it would be cancelled if not converted to a photo license.

I am fortunate my 'home' address of 40-something years ago is still where my parents live and is my 'home' address for everything except paying taxes, which I don't. The address on my paper licence, then, is still valid.

I have had letters, and very recently recently, letting me know how much pension I am entitled to when the time comes so it is likely my case is different, in that I have a family address? I'm not entirely sure the UK government is as organised yet as to cross-check from DVLA to HMRC? That would/does require an ID number which, as we know, is not a legal requirement and may not be for an exceedingly long time if the privacy lobby has its way. The state of the UK economy these days as well likely means each and every department will be pleased for any money that comes in, almost no questions asked.
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Postby martincymru » Mon, 21 Jan 2013 12:22 pm

Thanks ScoobyDoes, your reply is addressing my point. but see my comments below in " ..... " :-

My UK license is valid till I'm 70 so I still have around 30yrs left on the paper one issued back when. I don't have a photo ID driving license so I am fully assuming my paper one is valid.

" Not correct. Need photocard and paper; both to be non expired " .

I never got notification that it would be cancelled if not converted to a photo license.

" you do not convert. it is in addition to paper ". " you will get reminder for photocard every 10 years ".

I am fortunate my 'home' address of 40-something years ago is still where my parents live and is my 'home' address for everything except paying taxes, which I don't. The address on my paper licence, then, is still valid.

" citizen address not your actual residence ". " but how do HMRC know these facts when DVLA contact them and say that your "home" address is uk and therfeore you are liable for income tax? ". " That's my very point ".


I have had letters, and very recently recently, letting me know how much pension I am entitled to when the time comes so it is likely my case is different, in that I have a family address? I'm not entirely sure the UK government is as organised yet as to cross-check from DVLA to HMRC? That would/does require an ID number which, as we know, is not a legal requirement and may not be for an exceedingly long time if the privacy lobby has its way.

" you must have ID to apply for photocard ! "


" without a .govt ID, life in Uk is becomming increasingly difficult". " In other words it's only a matter of time before you are "forced". "

The state of the UK economy these days as well likely means each and every department will be pleased for any money that comes in, almost no questions asked

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Postby JR8 » Mon, 21 Jan 2013 11:00 pm

martincymru wrote: " Not correct. Need photocard and paper; both to be non expired " .


Well, that's the first time I've heard that.

Can you clarify what the 'photocard' is that you say you need in addition to the paper license?

If you could find a link at DVLA to clarify this all, I think it would be great use to a number of members here.

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Postby martincymru » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 8:12 am

extract from the link:-

" If you have a photocard driving licence [which I have and so do 2million other people ! ], you must renew your licence every 10 years - you’ll receive a reminder before your current licence ends. "

if dont renew = no licence !!

see https://www.gov.uk/change-photo-driving-licence

note also " be a resident of Great Britain
provide addresses of where you’ve lived over the last 3 years ... "

Effectively if you live overseas you cannot renew your UK licence. That's the point. Mention of why do I want to or suggesting I obtain a Sg licence is not addressing the issue. Maybe I do not want to get Sg licence, maybe next year I retire back to UK, maybe my UK licence expires next month and the following month I need to hire a car in UK bla bla bla

As my initial post intimated, thousands of UK expats are expressing concern

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Postby offshoreoildude » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 8:58 am

I see your concern but I think you're over reacting. We have a similar issue in Australia but at the end of the day what our DOT wants is an address to send summons and fines to.

Your other alternative is to cancel your license and re-instate it when you permanently move back.

The UK sounds similar to Australia in that if you're not resident you should not be holding a driving license for that jurisdiction. The principal reason being how do they contact you.
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Postby ScoobyDoes » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 10:53 am

martincymru wrote:extract from the link:-

" If you have a photocard driving licence [which I have and so do 2million other people ! ], you must renew your licence every 10 years - you’ll receive a reminder before your current licence ends. "

if dont renew = no licence !!

see https://www.gov.uk/change-photo-driving-licence



That's the issue...... I've never had a photo ID licence, I've never been told to apply for one and I don't have the intent to get one. So long as you've never had one, at this moment there is no legal requirement to get one and 'convert' the paper one. Once you've got/had one, though, you are stuck in the cycle.

Consider you say 2m other people....... it's ONLY 2m other people, around 2/3 the current population of Wales.

With regards my taxes etc. the left hand doesn't yet know what the right hand is doing in the UK. I've not paid UK taxes in nearly 20yrs but, as I said, I've recently had mail telling me how much my pension would be at today's rates.

At this moment the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing in the UK at the moment. For example, eventhough DVLA can request information from other European countries with regards drivers, licence plates details etc. for issuing fines and tickets, they can't even be bothered to do that and that would bring in far more funds. I very much doubt they'll give a stuff about contacting HMRC to see if you even live in the UK since that's hardly the first thing to go through somebody's mind.

OSOD is right, they only will look for an address to send you the licence and any tickets.
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Postby martincymru » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 12:17 pm

ScoobyDoes wrote:
martincymru wrote:extract from the link:-

" If you have a photocard driving licence [which I have and so do 2million other people ! ], you must renew your licence every 10 years - you’ll receive a reminder before your current licence ends. "

if dont renew = no licence !!

see https://www.gov.uk/change-photo-driving-licence



That's the issue...... I've never had a photo ID licence, I've never been told to apply for one and I don't have the intent to get one. So long as you've never had one, at this moment there is no legal requirement to get one and 'convert' the paper one. Once you've got/had one, though, you are stuck in the cycle.

Consider you say 2m other people....... it's ONLY 2m other people, around 2/3 the current population of Wales.

With regards my taxes etc. the left hand doesn't yet know what the right hand is doing in the UK. I've not paid UK taxes in nearly 20yrs but, as I said, I've recently had mail telling me how much my pension would be at today's rates.

At this moment the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing in the UK at the moment. For example, eventhough DVLA can request information from other European countries with regards drivers, licence plates details etc. for issuing fines and tickets, they can't even be bothered to do that and that would bring in far more funds. I very much doubt they'll give a stuff about contacting HMRC to see if you even live in the UK since that's hardly the first thing to go through somebody's mind.

OSOD is right, they only will look for an address to send you the licence and any tickets.



Correct, photocard licence only issued when update certain change(s) at DVLA. Some 30m people now have photocards. Old paper still valid till updated.

Please see extract:

"Thousands of motorists are at risk of being fined up to £1,000 because they are unwittingly driving without a valid licence.
They risk prosecution after failing to spot the extremely small print on their photo card licence which says it automatically expires after 10 years and has to be renewed - even though drivers are licensed to drive until the age of 70.
" The fiasco has come to light a decade after the first batch of photo licences were issued in July 1998, just as they start to expire. Motoring organisations blamed the Government for the fiasco and said 'most' drivers believed their licences were for life. "

Real point is, yes all ok if you live in UK but if you do not live in UK then you cannot renew your driving licence. There is no way round that unless you break the law and give a false UK residence address !

I do not want to give the licence back and then have to take a new driving test at my age when I return to UK!

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Postby ScoobyDoes » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 12:44 pm

martincymru wrote:Real point is, yes all ok if you live in UK but if you do not live in UK then you cannot renew your driving licence. There is no way round that unless you break the law and give a false UK residence address !



I assume you can no longer use the address that was registered on the licence otherwise a simple postal application would suffice?
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'



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Postby martincymru » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 3:25 pm

Scooby you can use any UK address you like as long as it is your residential address. I think you have missed the point to ask this though. Forgive me.
//
Mention has been made of .gov UK ID and no need for it. This is same as Singpass; imagine functioning in Sg without Singpass. Fast becomming same situation in UK. No wonder the Big Brother issue is being raised. But that is another story....

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Postby JR8 » Tue, 22 Jan 2013 3:33 pm

martincymru wrote: " Not correct. Need photocard and paper; both to be non expired " .


So, you're no longer saying the above?


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