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Leaving Singapore nicely: 2 scenarios

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vink2
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Leaving Singapore nicely: 2 scenarios

Postby vink2 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 5:54 pm

Okay, say you have 2 scenarios:
a) you are foreigner (EP holder) and your company fired you.
If you leave Singapore, will the company pay taxes on your behalf?

b) you are foreigner (EP holder) and you decide to leave company and move abroad. What if you fail to pay taxes? Say, you just don't have enough money.

What are consequences if you fail to pay taxes in both cases?

Thanks.

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Postby Sergei82 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 6:32 pm

No, compiny will just file a police report and you will deal with the police on your own.

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Re: Leaving Singapore nicely: 2 scenarios

Postby offshoreoildude » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 6:43 pm

vink2 wrote:Okay, say you have 2 scenarios:
a) you are foreigner (EP holder) and your company fired you.
If you leave Singapore, will the company pay taxes on your behalf?

b) you are foreigner (EP holder) and you decide to leave company and move abroad. What if you fail to pay taxes? Say, you just don't have enough money.

What are consequences if you fail to pay taxes in both cases?

Thanks.


a. Perhaps - but probably not. Income taxes are a personal debt.
b. I've known people to scoot - the IRAS sends demands and then sits and waits for them to pop back up on the radar. Some of those people (the smarter ones) negotiate from overseas with IRAS and pay it off. You're probably not that smart.
Now I'm called PNGMK

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Postby JR8 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 6:44 pm

Your company will estimate any part-year tax liability and with-hold it from your salary.

This happened to me. They calculated it wrongly/low, and they were made to pay the additional sum.

I was working for another subsidiary half a world away and three years later they were still chasing me. Finally when they started escalated it via my local management, I had no choice but to pay up.

p.s. Another danger was that it was their mistake but my liability. A summary judgement against me from court would have hindered my return/transit @ SG in the future. Best to do the right thing in the first place so it doesn't come back and bite you in the a*** later. If needs be try and see if you can pay any liability in increments over say 6-12 months.

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Postby offshoreoildude » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 6:51 pm

JR8 wrote:Your company will estimate any part-year tax liability and with-hold it from your salary.

This happened to me. They calculated it wrongly/low, and they were made to pay the additional sum.

I was working for another subsidiary half a world away and three years later they were still chasing me. Finally when they started escalated it via my local management, I had no choice but to pay up.

p.s. Another danger was that it was their mistake but my liability. A summary judgement against me from court would have hindered my return/transit @ SG in the future. Best to do the right thing in the first place so it doesn't come back and bite you in the a*** later. If needs be try and see if you can pay any liability in increments over say 6-12 months.
OP isn't that smart. He's basically going to ask next how to break the law.
Now I'm called PNGMK

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Postby vink2 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 7:11 pm

offshoreoildude wrote:OP isn't that smart. He's basically going to ask next how to break the law.


I'm not going to break the law. I want to understand the worst scenario.

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Postby vink2 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 7:12 pm

JR8 wrote:Your company will estimate any part-year tax liability and with-hold it from your salary.

This happened to me. They calculated it wrongly/low, and they were made to pay the additional sum.

I was working for another subsidiary half a world away and three years later they were still chasing me. Finally when they started escalated it via my local management, I had no choice but to pay up.

p.s. Another danger was that it was their mistake but my liability. A summary judgement against me from court would have hindered my return/transit @ SG in the future. Best to do the right thing in the first place so it doesn't come back and bite you in the a*** later. If needs be try and see if you can pay any liability in increments over say 6-12 months.


Thanks, as I understood in the worst case they will not be able to transit via Singapore in the future, is it right?

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Postby zzm9980 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 7:26 pm

vink2 wrote:
offshoreoildude wrote:OP isn't that smart. He's basically going to ask next how to break the law.


I'm not going to break the law. I want to understand the worst scenario.


vink2 wrote:
JR8 wrote:Your company will estimate any part-year tax liability and with-hold it from your salary.

This happened to me. They calculated it wrongly/low, and they were made to pay the additional sum.

I was working for another subsidiary half a world away and three years later they were still chasing me. Finally when they started escalated it via my local management, I had no choice but to pay up.

p.s. Another danger was that it was their mistake but my liability. A summary judgement against me from court would have hindered my return/transit @ SG in the future. Best to do the right thing in the first place so it doesn't come back and bite you in the a*** later. If needs be try and see if you can pay any liability in increments over say 6-12 months.


Thanks, as I understood in the worst case they will not be able to transit via Singapore in the future, is it right?


Worst case you will be a fugitive. You will be at risk to visit any place Singapore has jurisdiction and/or extradition agreements now or in the future. There is no telling what the future may hold. You may have to pay a fine, or you may find yourself on a prison boat from wherever you live with a bunch of NS defaulters.

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Postby Mi Amigo » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 7:34 pm

The other aspect to this, which I would argue is the most important for your self esteem, is to do the right thing and meet your obligations. I for one am sick of hearing of people who leave Singapore owing money to IRAS, banks, landlords, phone companies, SP Services, etc. IMO the only scenario you should consider is to leave the country owing nothing. Or, if you didn't have the foresight (or common sense) to plan for an event like this, have an agreed payment schedule in place and then stick to it.
Be careful what you wish for

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Postby offshoreoildude » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 7:53 pm

Mi Amigo wrote:The other aspect to this, which I would argue is the most important for your self esteem, is to do the right thing and meet your obligations. I for one am sick of hearing of people who leave Singapore owing money to IRAS, banks, landlords, phone companies, SP Services, etc. IMO the only scenario you should consider is to leave the country owing nothing. Or, if you didn't have the foresight (or common sense) to plan for an event like this, have an agreed payment schedule in place and then stick to it.


OP - you never know where life will lead you. What happens if you discover a previously untapped pool of talent (or connections) and land a mega job in Singapore only to be told you can't get an entry permit because of a default judgement and criminal record?
Now I'm called PNGMK

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Postby Mi Amigo » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 8:04 pm

Sorry JR8, I didn't completely read your earlier post and I realise I've just reiterated what you already stated.
Be careful what you wish for

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Postby beppi » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 8:52 pm

When an EP holder leaves a company (no matter if you resigned or were fired), the company has to (by law) withhold your last salary until IRAS has calculated your tax due, which is then deducted from that salary and only the remainder paid out to you.
Thus the only way to leave Singapore with a tax liability is by absconding without giving proper notice to the company. That involves two criminal offenses - in lay terms: cheating the company and cheating IRAS - for which you will most likely be pursued even overseas, which means you cannot ever travel to Singapore or any country it has an extradition treaty with.

When in Singapore, it is better to follow the rules!

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Postby vink2 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 8:57 pm

beppi wrote:When an EP holder leaves a company (no matter if you resigned or were fired), the company has to (by law) withhold your last salary until IRAS has calculated your tax due, which is then deducted from that salary and only the remainder paid out to you.
Thus the only way to leave Singapore with a tax liability is by absconding without giving proper notice to the company. That involves two criminal offenses - in lay terms: cheating the company and cheating IRAS - for which you will most likely be pursued even overseas, which means you cannot ever travel to Singapore or any country it has an extradition treaty with.

When in Singapore, it is better to follow the rules!


Okay, nice, so, basically, I need to work for my company, give them a notice period, work almost one moth for free and they will fix this. Is it right?

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Postby Mi Amigo » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 9:04 pm

vink2 wrote:Okay, nice, so, basically, I need to work for my company, give them a notice period, work almost one moth for free and they will fix this. Is it right?

Why do you consider it to be working 'for free'? You've worked here for a while, therefore you (presumably) owe income tax to IRAS and that has to be paid. It's not a fine, it's an obligation that you (should) have been aware of all along.

It's unfortunate for you that you were fired*, but you need to face the consequences. You might consider them unfair, but they are only going to get you to pay what you owe (unless you're unlucky like JR8 was).

* One question - originally you talked about being fired; now you've mentioned about giving the company a notice period. So which is it?
Be careful what you wish for

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Postby vink2 » Mon, 14 Jan 2013 9:09 pm

Mi Amigo wrote:
vink2 wrote:Okay, nice, so, basically, I need to work for my company, give them a notice period, work almost one moth for free and they will fix this. Is it right?

Why do you consider it to be working 'for free'? You've worked here for a while, therefore you (presumably) owe income tax to IRAS and that has to be paid. It's not a fine, it's an obligation that you (should) have been aware of all along.

It's unfortunate for you that you were fired*, but you need to face the consequences. You might consider them unfair, but they are only going to get you to pay what you owe (unless you're unlucky like JR8 was).

* One question - originally you talked about being fired; now you've mentioned about giving the company a notice period. So which is it?


Thanks, but I'm not fired. I'm trying to understand what to do if I need to leave my company or something bad happen.


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