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PEP approved.

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
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PEP approved.

Postby Wd40 » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 12:09 pm

Hello guys,

Just wanted to inform that my PEP got approved today.
I had applied on 26th nov, just in the nick of time before the new rules kicked in. So I got the PEP on the basis of 2 yrs on EP P2.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 2:02 pm

So, that means you will have to be touching a minimum salary of 144K/pa by Dec 2014 then. So your PEP is only going to be valid for 25 months, the way I see it. Not sure what benes are there that would be more beneficial than the P2 you were on previously. If it's to bring in more relatives, there will be the additional expenses of repatriating them at the end of 25 months if your salary doesn't meet the minimums by the end of 2014.

But, congratulations are in order. Good Job. ;-)

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Postby Wd40 » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 6:31 pm

Thanks SMS, I agree pep is not going to give me any additional benefit over the ep p2. Not even getting relatives, as I believe the privileges are linked to what ep I was on earlier.

If anything it's going to be more of a hassle having to manage the pass issuances, tax declaration etc myself instead of my company.

The reason I applied for it was the reason what it's meant to be, i.e. an insurance to tide over a job loss.

And just like any insurance, I would hope that I wouldn't need to make use of it , but good to have nonetheless :wink:

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 7:50 pm

I don't want to vent, but that is NOT what it was meant to be. I was initially meant to be only a means to give a potential PR & future citizen the ability to move around unhindered by 30~90 visas. It was meant to be a stepping stone to PR. Unfortunately a large number of people saw it as a long term visa and protection from having to leave the country after a local usurped their job. It's just one more thing that certain people fcuked up for all the rest than were interested in it for the right purpose.

Live and learn. When you find a loophole, don't advertise it as it's the best was to have it closed quickly. Some however, never learn until a whole nation get tarred with the same brush.
[/vent]

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 7:52 pm

Rev, I don't want to vent, but that is NOT what it was meant to be. I was initially meant to be only a means to give a potential PR & future citizen the ability to move around unhindered by 30~90 visas. It was meant to be a stepping stone to PR. Unfortunately a large number of people saw it as a long term visa and protection from having to leave the country after a local usurped their job. It's just one more thing that certain people fcuked up for all the rest than were interested in it for the right purpose.

Live and learn. When you find a loophole, don't advertise it as it's the best was to have it closed quickly. Some however, never learn until a whole nation get tarred with the same brush.
[/vent]

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Postby Wd40 » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 8:33 pm

Sorry SMS, but can you substantiate your claims that it was meant to be a stepping stone for PR/citizen.

I can substantiate my claim though that it was meant as an insurance for job loss.

Read the last question in this FAQ:

http://www.mom.gov.sg/MOMDoc/FAQs_on_Changes_to_PEP.pdf

If it were what you mentioned,it would/should have been spelled out there. That's my interpretation, sorry. And it's not like I wouldn't like to have the PR, I would love to.

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Postby Wd40 » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 8:49 pm

Sorry SMS, but can you substantiate your claims that it was meant to be a stepping stone for PR/citizen.

I can substantiate my claim though that it was meant as an insurance for job loss.

Read the last question in this FAQ:

http://www.mom.gov.sg/MOMDoc/FAQs_on_Changes_to_PEP.pdf

The PEP was introduced to strengthen Singapore’s attractiveness to highly skilled foreigners and to facilitate their continued stay and contributions in Singapore.
Unlike the Employment Pass, the PEP is tied to the individual instead of a
specific employer. The PEP allows the holder to remain in Singapore for up
to 6 months in between jobs to evaluate new employment opportunities. The PEP is issued with a validity of 3 years from 1 Dec 2012, and is nonrenewable.


If it were what you mentioned,it would/should have been spelled out there.

The keyword there is "Continuity" there is no mention of words like "long term" or "commitment" That's my interpretation, sorry. And it's not like I wouldn't like to have the PR, I would love to.
Last edited by Wd40 on Wed, 19 Dec 2012 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 8:51 pm

The MOM site has been changed numerous times in the past five years. The PEP will be five years old this coming January. When it was first offered, the MOM site basically gave what I gave, albeit worded differently. I think it was in one of their press releases in last 2006. I just did a search of the MOM site but they only have from 2007 forward. It didn't take too long for abusers to figure out how to abuse the original intent. So, eventually, because the passes were good for 5 years, they changed the MOM site to reflect what it had been generally used for. Additionally, they quit automatically offering it to new P1's. (It used to be automatically offered to new FT coming in on a P1 visa).

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 9:51 pm


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Postby offshoreoildude » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 10:49 pm

I tend to agree with SMS, I also agree that the MOM web site does not really clarify the intent of the PEP and your misunderstanding is reasonable. I personally don't see the PEP lasting. The niche is getting tinier.

My view on the PEP is that you should be migrating from a PEP to a P1 or PR if you intend to stay. I suspect the Gahmen may even tighten that path as reading all that I could tonight I came away with the distinct impression that the PEP is for top flight professionals who don't intend to stay .... (a visiting surgeon, a top level academic, a high end executive who will move on). I think you moved from a relatively secure pass to an insecure pass. I know it depended a bit on your job security but you only have a 6 month breathing window there between jobs.... I think we'll be saying good bye to you in 3 years or less.
Now I'm called PNGMK

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Postby Wd40 » Wed, 19 Dec 2012 11:49 pm

Thanks SMS, for the links and I do understand, now, what you mean.

My interpretation of the PEP is, the gahmen is "hoping" or "expecting" that by giving the FTs(The real exceptional FTs) the flexibility to remain in Singapore in between job changes, they somehow build a career here and make it their home.

The key word I used here is "hope" or "wish" and thats why they used to invite P1s to apply for PEP. Its kind of a privilege extended with the hope that you get something back in return.

I have applied for the PEP and yes I mentioned that I am treating it as an insurance against job loss, but I never mentioned that at the end of it I am going to scoot away from here, in which case it could be construed as an abuse.

Also, while I am having the PEP, if I lose my job, I have no moral obligation to stay back, unless I feel I can find a suitable job here within 6 months. So its kind of a privilege, but I dont think it has enough in it to tie me down.

The PR, however, I fully agree with your stand on it. It comes with much higher levels of commitments.

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Postby Wd40 » Sun, 06 Jan 2013 8:47 pm

Well, as expected our team manager from New York just told us that our department head have decided to wind down the Singapore team by the end of this year.

We have few choices:
1) move to Hyderabad, which is where all the Singapore positions are moving to and some NY positions as well.
2) look for other internal positions, because ours is a Big MNC bank so our department moving out doesn't mean all departments moving out, yet in the current environment it's hard in our company to get matching opportunities.
3) start looking outside.

I really appreciate out manager to be so upfront and let us know so much in advance instead of waiting till the last moment and culling us. However he also expects us to keep him in the loop and let him know of our plans and not quit without notice.

Option 1 is a big no no for most of us. Option 2 is difficult to materialise although if it does, then it's fantastic because currently my salary is already quite high for my role and my company is one of the best out there in terms of work culture or work life balance so option 3 although looks like the only realistic option, life won't be the same here after. :(

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Postby vestapo » Sun, 06 Jan 2013 11:16 pm

Wd40 wrote:Well, as expected our team manager from New York just told us that our department head have decided to wind down the Singapore team by the end of this year.

We have few choices:
1) move to Hyderabad, which is where all the Singapore positions are moving to and some NY positions as well.
2) look for other internal positions, because ours is a Big MNC bank so our department moving out doesn't mean all departments moving out, yet in the current environment it's hard in our company to get matching opportunities.
3) start looking outside.

I really appreciate out manager to be so upfront and let us know so much in advance instead of waiting till the last moment and culling us. However he also expects us to keep him in the loop and let him know of our plans and not quit without notice.

Option 1 is a big no no for most of us. Option 2 is difficult to materialise although if it does, then it's fantastic because currently my salary is already quite high for my role and my company is one of the best out there in terms of work culture or work life balance so option 3 although looks like the only realistic option, life won't be the same here after. :(


This is exactly what Singapore expected and prefered, that some sectors should moved out of the country and to be replaced by other targeted sectors. IT is one those sectors that over reliance on foreigners from India and there are not much benefits in keeping those jobs here in Singapore because they do not add much value and Singaporeans do not prefer those jobs compared to accounting, biotech, finance etc.. Singaporeans also cannot compete with Indian, Fillipino IT professionals in term of costs so in the long run it is no use to keep IT onshore because sooner or later they will be dominated by the rising Indian and Fillipino IT Industry. But when these sectors move away, there are more room to add other jobs such as bio pharmaceutical R&D, risk managament, wealth management etc that may provide higher yield per manpower

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Postby vishalgupta2 » Mon, 07 Jan 2013 10:40 pm

Why is option 1 a big NO NO?

Wd40 wrote:Well, as expected our team manager from New York just told us that our department head have decided to wind down the Singapore team by the end of this year.

We have few choices:
1) move to Hyderabad, which is where all the Singapore positions are moving to and some NY positions as well.
2) look for other internal positions, because ours is a Big MNC bank so our department moving out doesn't mean all departments moving out, yet in the current environment it's hard in our company to get matching opportunities.
3) start looking outside.

I really appreciate out manager to be so upfront and let us know so much in advance instead of waiting till the last moment and culling us. However he also expects us to keep him in the loop and let him know of our plans and not quit without notice.

Option 1 is a big no no for most of us. Option 2 is difficult to materialise although if it does, then it's fantastic because currently my salary is already quite high for my role and my company is one of the best out there in terms of work culture or work life balance so option 3 although looks like the only realistic option, life won't be the same here after. :(

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Postby Wd40 » Mon, 07 Jan 2013 11:00 pm

vishalgupta2 wrote:Why is option 1 a big NO NO?

Wd40 wrote:Well, as expected our team manager from New York just told us that our department head have decided to wind down the Singapore team by the end of this year.

We have few choices:
1) move to Hyderabad, which is where all the Singapore positions are moving to and some NY positions as well.
2) look for other internal positions, because ours is a Big MNC bank so our department moving out doesn't mean all departments moving out, yet in the current environment it's hard in our company to get matching opportunities.
3) start looking outside.

I really appreciate out manager to be so upfront and let us know so much in advance instead of waiting till the last moment and culling us. However he also expects us to keep him in the loop and let him know of our plans and not quit without notice.

Option 1 is a big no no for most of us. Option 2 is difficult to materialise although if it does, then it's fantastic because currently my salary is already quite high for my role and my company is one of the best out there in terms of work culture or work life balance so option 3 although looks like the only realistic option, life won't be the same here after. :(


Because I am from Bangalore. My parents are there and its our own house.

Hyderabad I neither save money, I am also away from my parents and relatives and neither do I get the quality of life that I get in Singapore.

Worst comes worst I just go back to Bangalore and take my own time looking for a job. Btw today I got a call from Wipro for a software architect position in Bangalore offering 20 lacs inr. Not bad huh :)


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