New Criteria for PEPs w.e.f. 1/12/2012

[zzm9980]

Notices are going out:

[sundaymorningstaple]

Read it and weep. Tis exactly as I said.

[physdude1]

I am an ex-PR interested in taking up the PEP as I feel relatively attached to Singapore having done my JC and uni there and having worked for a few years as well. I exceed the overseas salary limit but not by too much so I wonder if the ex-PR factor will work against me (my first REP renewal when I was studying overseas went fine but I needed another one when my graduation was delayed and this was denied). In general, is it a good pass to apply for or are there hidden issues that are not very obvious?

I would also like to ask what the current climate regarding foreigners is like. When I first came for my JC in 1993, I couldn't have been treated better and a hawker even gave me a free meal to get to know more about me on my first visit with my classmates to one! However, the situation seems to have changed from the news reports I see and it would be great if anyone could enlighten me on the current climate. (I am of Indian nationality if that matters.)

[sundaymorningstaple]

My gut feeling is it would be a no go if you already had PR and gave it up/lost it. No problem going from EP to PEP and then back to EP. But it is supposed to be a stepping stone to PR and the fact that you already crapped on that once, we all know that they have a pretty long memory. Good Luck.

[ecureilx]

My gut feeling is it would be a no go if you already had PR and gave it up/lost it. No problem going from EP to PEP and then back to EP. But it is supposed to be a stepping stone to PR and the fact that you already crapped on that once, we all know that they have a pretty long memory. Good Luck.

Me too thinks it's gonna be close to call.

ICA folks of late aren't fond of ex-PR ..

[physdude1]

Well, it is up to them but it seems a strange sort of logic since they denied the extension when I really wanted to be back in Singapore after my studies. In fact, the denial of the second REP extension was also odd since the Singapore government fully funded my JC and uni and they ended up denying me from coming back just as my income, and therefore their tax collection, was going to go up significantly.

I know a family friend who gave up her Singapore citizenship (for an Indian one) a fairly long time ago but has since regained it in the last few years so I suppose it is not out of the question.

[ecureilx]

In fact, the denial of the second REP extension was also odd since the Singapore government fully funded my JC and uni and they ended up denying me from coming back just as my income, and therefore their tax collection, was going to go up significantly.

Nothing odd there.

Been a while since the govt was forced to semi apologise for those funding for foreigners ... You aren't the first to lose the privilege of entitlement since the govt paid for studies

As for tax, how much would you pay for the govt to be excited about ? A million a year ?

I know a family friend who gave up her Singapore citizenship (for an Indian one) a fairly long time ago but has since regained it in the last few years so I suppose it is not out of the question.

There are exceptions but over the last few years things are tighter. Those who gained back their former status mostly got it due to family ties. Do you have family ties to swing things in your favor ?

Free hawker food etc don't mean much I believe.

As I said, it's not a NO, but don't hold your breath, in this tightening immigration policy times, you don't get the entitlement you expect.

Good luck!

[physdude1]

Nothing odd there.

Been a while since the govt was forced to semi apologise for those funding for foreigners ... You aren't the first to lose the privilege of entitlement since the govt paid for studies

As for tax, how much would you pay for the govt to be excited about ? A million a year ?

Okay, it seems I have been away for too long since I don't know about this semi-apology. Whether they give me the PEP or not doesn't make much difference for me career or pay wise (if anything, the pay is lower in Singapore in my profession especially with the currently dropping S$). The main reason why I wanted to explore the possibility was because I have some fond memories of Singapore and I obviously have a lot of old classmates still living there.

Well, if they expect every new person to contribute a million in taxes, they are going to be very disappointed. But they could have easily recovered my JC and uni fees and a bit more to spare.

And they obviously do care about the taxes that expats and new immigrants bring in as it would be difficult to see how they could have solved their demographic problems without their influx. Of course, whether they need more newcomers is a different question.

I know a family friend who gave up her Singapore citizenship (for an Indian one) a fairly long time ago but has since regained it in the last few years so I suppose it is not out of the question.

There are exceptions but over the last few years things are tighter. Those who gained back their former status mostly got it due to family ties. Do you have family ties to swing things in your favor ?

Free hawker food etc don't mean much I believe.

As I said, it's not a NO, but don't hold your breath, in this tightening immigration policy times, you don't get the entitlement you except.

Good luck!

I have no current family in Singapore. In any case, I see no harm in applying if and when it is appropriate. (The hawker example was just one of my many warm memories of welcome in Singapore - it is obviously irrelevant for immigration etc.)

[ecureilx]

Well, if they expect every new person to contribute a million in taxes, they are going to be very disappointed. But they could have easily recovered my JC and uni fees and a bit more to spare.

And they obviously do care about the taxes that expats and new immigrants bring in as it would be difficult to see how they could have solved their demographic problems without their influx. Of course, whether they need more newcomers is a different question.

Ah, you miss the point. No offence.

In simple terms, statically the ratio allocated to sub cons supposedly went through the roof, and it's culling time for Sub cons. Foreign Families split, Spouses / kids of PRs struggling to get PR is just an example of the throttling ... and I am talking of some guys I know who have been very active in community work - but when it comes to currying favor with immigration authorities, it's tough going. Because primarily the race says Sub con. If that kind of engagement receives lukewarm response ... need I say more ?

I don't expect an answer but at times when those turning up with lot of money are being cold shouldered when they apply for Entrepreneur pass and such, how much tax will your tax excite the folks who decide who stays and who goes ? Just wondering .. no, immigration authorities don't give a hoot about losing folks .. no disappointment there ... that's the truth ...

Don't misunderstand me, as I said I didn't say you have no chance, but be a bit conservative on your plans to reestablish your roots in Singapore. Don't take it wrong.

If only you weren't from sub con, it won't be that tough.

[physdude1]

This thread looks like it is seriously drifting so I will make this my last message. (Feel free to PM me.)

I don't expect an answer but at times when those turning up with lot of money are being cold shouldered when they apply for Entrepreneur pass and such, how much tax will your tax excite the folks who decide who stays and who goes ? Just wondering .. no, immigration authorities don't give a hoot about losing folks .. no disappointment there ... that's the truth ...

Well, that puts some colour on the recent fund-raising dinners my alma mater invited me to. It raises an interesting question to ask at the next one if this is indeed the current situation in Singapore and they don't really care about the contributions of outsiders.

I do know that they don't care a hoot about losing folks. A good case is the Singaporean turned Indian turned Singaporean mentioned earlier who had to leave Singapore and take up Indian nationality due to the misguided medical educational policies of the past. OTOH, they seemed pretty happy to have her back again as a Singaporean so they probably don't care too much about gaining folks as well.

[ecureilx]

Well, that puts some colour on the recent fund-raising dinners my alma mater invited me to. It raises an interesting question to ask at the next one if this is indeed the current situation in Singapore and they don't really care about the contributions of outsiders.

I hope you start reading the ground situation post 2010.

And I do hope your alma mater is more powerful than ministers who can't influence immigration staff.

Elections are won by winning the voters, and the voters spoke out loud enough.

I do know that they don't care a hoot about losing folks. A good case is the Singaporean turned Indian turned Singaporean mentioned earlier who had to leave Singapore and take up Indian nationality due to the misguided medical educational policies of the past. OTOH, they seemed pretty happy to have her back again as a Singaporean so they probably don't care too much about gaining folks as well.

Yeah, keep quoting that exception while ignoring the multitude of spouses and children who can't even gain PR. And loads of sob stories at MPS.

I do believe now that you will be able to get anything you want. Especially in view of your tax $ and past studies here. NO OFFENSE!

Welcome to Singapore!!

[sundaymorningstaple]

A good case is the Singaporean turned Indian turned Singaporean mentioned earlier who had to leave Singapore and take up Indian nationality due to the misguided medical educational policies of the past. OTOH, they seemed pretty happy to have her back again as a Singaporean so they probably don't care too much about gaining folks as well.

In this case the point is clear. If you are a rocket scientist or a good doctor, then exceptions can always be made. You will find that all of Singapore's rules and regulations ALWAYS leave a back door for the government so they can do 180's as and when needed. If you have something they really want they will open that door out on the back porch and bring you in anyway. Of that you can be assured. If you nick is a hint at what you do, yes, you may well have a way in. phys could be Physical Education Dude or a Medical Physicist or related Physicist careers. Just guessing mind you... Doubt if the former would do it but the latter might.

[sundaymorningstaple]

Maybe even a Nuclear Physicist! Could help solve Singapore's dependence on other countries gas and oil.

[physdude1]

Well, that puts some colour on the recent fund-raising dinners my alma mater invited me to. It raises an interesting question to ask at the next one if this is indeed the current situation in Singapore and they don't really care about the contributions of outsiders.

I hope you start reading the ground situation post 2010.

And I do hope your alma mater is more powerful than ministers who can't influence immigration staff.

Elections are won by winning the voters, and the voters spoke out loud enough.

I do know that they don't care a hoot about losing folks. A good case is the Singaporean turned Indian turned Singaporean mentioned earlier who had to leave Singapore and take up Indian nationality due to the misguided medical educational policies of the past. OTOH, they seemed pretty happy to have her back again as a Singaporean so they probably don't care too much about gaining folks as well.

Yeah, keep quoting that exception while ignoring the multitude of spouses and children who can't even gain PR. And loads of sob stories at MPS.

I do believe now that you will be able to get anything you want. Especially in view of your tax $ and past studies here. NO OFFENSE!

Welcome to Singapore!!

Well, I apologize in advance for the thread necromancy especially since I said earlier it will be my last post. However, since I just applied for the pass a few days ago and I remembered this post as having a bit of strange logic, I wanted to see if I misunderstood.

I can't see how denying my PEP application based on my nationality or history of being a PR is particularly bad. Sure, it would mean that the few hours I put into filling in the form and the trip to SG was wasted (not to mention the $70 application fee) but it would also mean that the environment was hostile enough to the extent that I wouldn't like working there and it would save me the grief of actually coming for work and finding this out the hard way. The worst case would be if it got approved and I found a very hostile environment since that would result in a significant waste of time effort and money.

In any case, I didn't see much hostility based on my nationality except possibly at the airport when I came to submit the application. The cost of living also seems to have declined considerably and everything actually looked really cheap (at least a lot cheaper than what I have become used to). For eg., an evening partying at the Ceylon Sports Club cost only about US$30 and that included some great Indian food and a lot of beer. In most international cities, that would be at least 3 times more expensive. S$18,000/mth or even S$12,000/mth will go a lot farther in Singapore today than most international places IMO.

[physdude1]

Another post that puzzles me above is the one stating that 8k is a lot for subcontinentals. Most of the subcontinental professionals I know who work overseas earn way above S$8k/month and the majority probably do earn close to or more than S$18k/month (actually, in my profession, the ones in India also mostly earn more than S$8k/month as well). After all, the richest ethnic community in the US is the Indian community and includes some of the most influential business people around.