Renouncing Permanent Residency status..

[enemi]

Hi guys,

I've been reading around the forums for a couple of days and have seen numerous threads regarding my particular topic.

However, from whatever information I've gathered, the findings are inconclusive.

Firstly, a little background on myself;

1) Born in Hong Kong, British Citizen at birth.
2) Both parents are also born in Hong Kong, British Citizen at birth.
3) Whole family migrated to Singapore when I was 6 years old, enrolled in Primary school and obtained Permanent Resident status (My parents and myself).
4) Represented Singapore at National level in sports - however, resulting in diminishing education results and therefore, parents made the decision to move me abroad for studies.
5) Parents renounced my PR-status (not up for debate at that point of time, asian parents)
6) Studied in the UK, obtained Bachelor degree and then Masters degree.
7) Contacted local Singaporean firm and a job offer was received along with proposed Employment Pass application.
8) After a couple of months - finally received notice from MoM that my application has been rejected.
9) Appealed 2 times and rejected on both counts - even with supporting letter from a National Governing Body.

Thoughts on my particular situation and also the "blacklist" rumor?
Thank you for your advice.

Regards

[sundaymorningstaple]

Couple of things pop into mind.

1) When was your PR renounced? At what age specifically.

2) Did you ever hold a Blue NRIC?

3) While you have a B. & M degree, how much actual work experience do you have?

If the answer to 3) is none or less than two years. That's probably the reason for rejection.

else

The government has a long memory of those who leave the country after abusing the government. (if you left here after the age of 11 (at that time) and you did not follow protocol, you may well never get an employment pass here.

[enemi]

Hi there,

Sorry for the late response
Here are some more details for your information;

1) PR renounced at age 15 - I'm aware that if I did not renounce PR before 12/13, there seems to be some implication in future work pass application process.

2) Never held a Blue NRIC AFAIK, just one of the simple brown/malt colored student IC cards - with NIRC number.

3) 1 year of actual work experience with a recognised foreign institute while doing my MSc at the same time.


Thank you for your information and help, if the reason for non-approval is due to lack of experience, I may have to venture out to gain said experience, before trying again.

Also, would you say that there is a whole world of difference when applying for a S-pass or Employment Pass?

I believe there are some sort of quota system in place..

[sundaymorningstaple]

When you apply for a job, an application will be filled out by the hiring company on your behalf (they will be your sponsor). There is a tick box on the application that says, in effect, if you are not "deemed" eligible for an EP do you want to be considered under an S pass.

If you tick that box NO then if you are found ineligible for the EP, you are rejected. Full Stop. However, if you ticked the box YES then if ineligible for the EP they will then consider you under the guidelines for an S pass. This is not to say that it's guaranteed that you will get either however. It just means that it opens all options. If you don't tick it yes and are rejected for the EP, you CANNOT reapply for an S pass, as you already made your election. So be very careful on how you answer the questions to the HR Manager when applying for a working permit.

If you renounced at the age of 15 without doing the preliminary notification of pending renouncement before 11 then you may well have issues. Not so much with Employment Passes (although some DO have problems) but PR would be out of the question. I'd say it's a calculated gamble and you shouldn't quit your other job beforehand.

[Mi Amigo]

As NS hasn't been mentioned, should I assume that means the OP is female?

[enemi]

Thank you once again for your kind help.

The situation is as follows;

The HR from the company that has offered me a position in Singapore is actually applying for a S-pass to begin with.

However, the application has been rejected twice, and thus, the HR has mentioned that the management are willing to essentially "upgrade" the package and apply for the EP instead (due to possible quota restriction).

As such, I was just trying to find out if there was any big glaring differences between applying for the S-pass or the EP.

Therefore, if according to what you said SMS, is it true that if I already applied for S-pass and have been rejected - the company will not be able to upgrade the application or make a brand new application for an EP?

PR is out of the question I'm aware, as I did not serve the obligatory NS having only renounced at the age of 15.

I appreciate your help and knowledge in helping me with this matter, thanks

Regards

[Mi Amigo]

So if you are male and did not renounce PR at the relevant time, does this open up the question of 'defaulting'?

[sundaymorningstaple]

If an S pass was applied for originally and came up short, applying again for an EP is likely to be rejected as well but for a different reason. I am assuming here that your original salary offering was sufficient for an S pass but not for an EP. If the S pass was rejected, then the new application for an EP would mean the employer would have to pony up more basic salary to meet the EP requirements. This would raise flags as MOM will figure that there is a cash back scheme or you would have been offered that salary in the beginning. It's okay to go one way but not the other.

You might have to apply with a different company. If that doesn't work, then probably Singapore's long memory has come into play.

[enemi]

Thank you for your patience and understanding SMS for explaining in detail.

You are correct in stating that the previous application for S-pass was due to salary offered - however, due to the importance of the proposed project that are in plan, the organisation has offered to increase basic in order to meet EP application.

I suppose I shall speak to HR to see if anything can be done to submit a new application for an EP with the new basic salary range, however, should that be rejected too then I shall switch my focus and commit to a different option.

Regards

[sundaymorningstaple]

So if you are male and did not renounce PR at the relevant time, does this open up the question of 'defaulting'?

That also is a very valid consideration and is something that enemi should weigh carefully as it could land him in the brig for a spell or a healthy fine of around $3-5K. He would do well to read some of the threads in the Strictly Speaking Forum before he does anything rash.

[enemi]

So if you are male and did not renounce PR at the relevant time, does this open up the question of 'defaulting'?

That also is a very valid consideration and is something that enemi should weigh carefully as it could land him in the brig for a spell or a healthy fine of around $3-5K. He would do well to read some of the threads in the Strictly Speaking Forum before he does anything rash.

Thank you, I will keep that in mind and read further to gain more knowledge in this area.

Just to add on, my PR was renounced when I was 15; and if I remember correctly from my parents, they told me that they went through the necessary procedures of informing all parties (MINDEF, ICA etc).

At the time, we were told that the cut-off age of renouncing was 16 - e.g. once past 16 years old, you would have to pay a bond in order to leave the country and STILL serve NS when you come back in the future to Singapore.

However, my parents' decision was to completely remove my PR status, therefore, rendering any need to serve NS unnecessary.

Please do clarify and correct me if I'm wrong, as this is a very vague memory from quite a long time back.

Thank you!

[sundaymorningstaple]

If protocol was followed, as it was at that time, and renunciation was affected successfully, then you have nothing to worry about on that note. Today, it's not quite that easy and the cut-off is earlier at 13. Sigh of relief time!

[enemi]

Thank you SMS!

I shall proceed with the chat with HR and hope that I receive good news

Have a nice day!

Regards