gazundering the more unscrupulous rental agents

Discuss about life in Singapore. Ask about cost of living, housing, travel, etiquette & lifestyle. Share experience & advice with Singaporeans & expat staying in Singapore.
Post Reply
west2east
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 18
Joined: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 3:14 am

gazundering the more unscrupulous rental agents

Post by west2east » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 2:51 am

We have between 4-10 weeks to find a flat

We are thinking about starting aggressively, going to a lot of agents, negotiating down the rent and trying to hammer them on the fees at the last minute

What works? How desperate are they? Have people tried the gazumping and gazundering strategies, e.g. making a deal, procrastinate for a few days, waiting for the last minute then telling them that if they don't reduce their fee from one month's rent down to $500 you walk away?

Do they take the cash rather than have nothing?

From what I've read, the agents do exactly the same things in reverse, trying to change the prices or fees even after you think you've got a deal - e.g. I heard one case where the agent recalculated the rent after the guy submitted his employment contract (with salary details) for checking.

Does anyone have any scruples about turning the tables on these people, rounding up 5 or 6 possible deals, leading them on right up to the last minute and then squeezing them on their fees?
Last edited by west2east on Fri, 15 Jun 2012 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
zzm9980
Governor
Governor
Posts: 6865
Joined: Wed, 06 Jul 2011 1:35 pm
Location: Once more unto the breach

Post by zzm9980 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 8:00 am

No scruples, but good luck. Search for the term "Kiasu" and "land lord" or (or "ll"). Then let us know how it goes!

User avatar
sundaymorningstaple
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 39577
Joined: Thu, 11 Nov 2004 1:26 pm
Answers: 10
Location: Retired on the Little Red Dot

Post by sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 8:47 am

Boy is west2east going to be in for a rude shocking learning curve. When one plays on their court, with their ball & their rules, you really don't have a whole lot of maneuvering room. The latest from CEA while helpful, still isn't what it should be. Good luck. And I hope you have lots of spare cash for the extended stay in the Serviced Apartment.

Desparate? here? I've seen them let a place stay for more than a quarter with no problem. Some have left them empty for 6 months rather than take less that what they feel it's worth.
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

User avatar
nakatago
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 8348
Joined: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 11:23 pm
Location: Sister Margaret’s School for Wayward Children

Post by nakatago » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 8:57 am

Somebody posted about successfully having the agent agree to be paid extra if he gets to lower the rental price.

On our next house hunt, we will tell the agent that he gets paid extra in his fee by the amount he gets to reduce the rent. E.g. Flat is advertised as 3000. If he gets it down to 2500 (ha; I know!), his fee will be 3500.

Haven't tried it.
"A quokka is what would happen if there was an anime about kangaroos."

x9200
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9873
Joined: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 4:06 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by x9200 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 9:31 am

You can get what you want playing fair just using common sense, securing all the important steps and not getting too enthusiastic about the places/deals you may like.
It's not about scruples, it's about positioning yourself on the same level. Besides, acting like this you may end up with nothing or with a landlord who could be otherwise a very reasonable person but just because of your approach will be turned against you for the whole duration of the contract and after, when you will try to recover your deposit.

User avatar
Saint
Director
Director
Posts: 3535
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 5:19 pm
Location: The Juban Stand, Boat Quay
Contact:

Post by Saint » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 9:35 am

Why pay any fees at all :?

User avatar
nakatago
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 8348
Joined: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 11:23 pm
Location: Sister Margaret’s School for Wayward Children

Post by nakatago » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 9:57 am

Saint wrote:Why pay any fees at all :?
I tried looking for flats once that have no agents and such. Some people's budgets don't really give them a fair shake at that option. Ironic, I know.
"A quokka is what would happen if there was an anime about kangaroos."

x9200
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9873
Joined: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 4:06 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by x9200 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 10:07 am

nakatago wrote:Somebody posted about successfully having the agent agree to be paid extra if he gets to lower the rental price.

On our next house hunt, we will tell the agent that he gets paid extra in his fee by the amount he gets to reduce the rent. E.g. Flat is advertised as 3000. If he gets it down to 2500 (ha; I know!), his fee will be 3500.

Haven't tried it.
I would rather go for a fixed budget/commission option than for the advertised price. The later always include the risk the agent will look for more highly priced places.

User avatar
nakatago
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 8348
Joined: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 11:23 pm
Location: Sister Margaret’s School for Wayward Children

Post by nakatago » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 10:39 am

x9200 wrote:
nakatago wrote:Somebody posted about successfully having the agent agree to be paid extra if he gets to lower the rental price.

On our next house hunt, we will tell the agent that he gets paid extra in his fee by the amount he gets to reduce the rent. E.g. Flat is advertised as 3000. If he gets it down to 2500 (ha; I know!), his fee will be 3500.

Haven't tried it.
I would rather go for a fixed budget/commission option than for the advertised price. The later always include the risk the agent will look for more highly priced places.
The idea was for one house. We usually end up going through several ads which have separate agents because just one agent hasn't really worked out so well.

But thanks for the reminder. We adjust our tactics to the situation.
"A quokka is what would happen if there was an anime about kangaroos."

User avatar
Saint
Director
Director
Posts: 3535
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 5:19 pm
Location: The Juban Stand, Boat Quay
Contact:

Post by Saint » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 11:07 am

nakatago wrote:
Saint wrote:Why pay any fees at all :?
I tried looking for flats once that have no agents and such. Some people's budgets don't really give them a fair shake at that option. Ironic, I know.
I've always used an Agent but I don't pay them any fees. I tell that to the Agent up front.

User avatar
zzm9980
Governor
Governor
Posts: 6865
Joined: Wed, 06 Jul 2011 1:35 pm
Location: Once more unto the breach

Post by zzm9980 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 12:55 pm

Saint wrote:
nakatago wrote:
Saint wrote:Why pay any fees at all :?
I tried looking for flats once that have no agents and such. Some people's budgets don't really give them a fair shake at that option. Ironic, I know.
I've always used an Agent but I don't pay them any fees. I tell that to the Agent up front.
So in that case, is the agent only showing you places where they also represent the seller/LL? If not, where do they get their money?

x9200
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9873
Joined: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 4:06 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by x9200 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 1:05 pm

I do the same and the agent is basically my secretary working for the opportunity I created for him and being paid by the landlord to be. Technically at the final stage he is the LL's agent.

User avatar
JR8
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 16516
Joined: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:43 pm
Location: K. Puki Manis

Post by JR8 » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 5:01 pm

x9200 wrote:I do the same and the agent is basically my secretary working for the opportunity I created for him and being paid by the landlord to be. Technically at the final stage he is the LL's agent.
Presumably this requires that the LL doesn't have his own agent, but is willing to pay for one at the last moment... [?]


p.s. I'm in the midst of a property/legal situation with a person who apparently thinks very much like the OP. I think it is in the DNA and they can't help it. I think the art is in letting them think they've 'won'. What is sure though is that trying to chip everyone rarely pays off. In my situation I'll happily welcome every opportunity to discreetly stick a knife in the other party's back. You reap what you sow.... it took me a few gray hairs to really get quite how true that is. But like I said to the OP in another thread, go for it and your fundamentally dishonest and hardball tactics, nothing ventured nothing gained... I'm just going to sit back and watch the game :)


pps And if a tenant came to me in London trying on half of what the OP proposes I'd give them the finger. End of story. I wouldn't want, and don't need people like that as tenants... they have just perfectly demonstrated what complete holes they are and are going to be. I expect the reception in SG will be similar with added 'lose face' octanes... but hey ho time to get the popcorn in.

Live For the thrill
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue, 08 May 2012 3:15 am
Location: South Africa

Post by Live For the thrill » Wed, 13 Jun 2012 10:55 pm

I've just rented out a private apartment without having to paythe agent the huge fee as well.

Tell them upfront that this is the case. I was lucky enuf to get a very good agent who explained that it is often accepted by landlords and agents that if your rent is > 3000sgd, the landlord should pay the commission??

The agent on ur behalf and the landlords agent cn then share the comm. this worked for me anyway.

The prop market is soo different here when you rent, but it seems that everything is relative. You might get an agent that agrees to this, and one that doesn't.

I think 4 -10 weeks is a good timeframe to find something.

x9200
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9873
Joined: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 4:06 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by x9200 » Thu, 14 Jun 2012 8:29 am

JR8 wrote:
x9200 wrote:I do the same and the agent is basically my secretary working for the opportunity I created for him and being paid by the landlord to be. Technically at the final stage he is the LL's agent.
Presumably this requires that the LL doesn't have his own agent, but is willing to pay for one at the last moment... [?]

The main legal restriction is for the agent not to represent both parties. I am not aware of anything that could prevent the LL or the tenant to hire as many agents as they want. In practice it still works via the old scheme so both agents are paid (here) by the LL and this is more about the agreement between the agents as the LL still pays the same money.

p.s. I'm in the midst of a property/legal situation with a person who apparently thinks very much like the OP. I think it is in the DNA and they can't help it. I think the art is in letting them think they've 'won'. What is

Exactly. Or have two parties genuinely satisfied (less frequent case).

sure though is that trying to chip everyone rarely pays off. In my situation I'll happily welcome every opportunity to discreetly stick a knife in the other party's back. You reap what you sow.... it took me a few gray hairs to really get quite how true that is. But like I said to the OP in another thread, go for it and your fundamentally dishonest and hardball tactics, nothing ventured nothing gained... I'm just going to sit back and watch the game :)

Unfortunately no live feed is going to be provided.

pps And if a tenant came to me in London trying on half of what the OP proposes I'd give them the finger. End of story. I wouldn't want, and don't need people like that as tenants... they have just perfectly demonstrated what complete holes they are and are going to be. I expect the reception in SG will be similar with added 'lose face' octanes... but hey ho time to get the popcorn in.
It is not like the market is very limited. The LL is a part of the whole puzzle and if something is fishy it's often better just to go away even if the deal seems fabulous.

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “Staying, Living in Singapore”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests