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How often can an European enter without a visa?

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
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zzm9980
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Re: Same situation....

Postby zzm9980 » Fri, 28 Sep 2012 8:45 am

rabete1 wrote:It looks like there is a lot more information to be shared "offline" or "unofficially" than I will find in public forums.)


No, there really isn't, we discourage that here.

If you're looking for someone to give you the unofficial guidelines as to how often you can visit Singapore before arousing suspicion, it's already been posted in other threads: Six months out for every three months in. (Of course that's subject to change at any time at ICA's whim, and may not even be accurate completely. They don't publish such things) If you push that, you may succeed with varying degrees of success based on the country your passport was issued in, your skin color, and the ICA agent's mood the day you land. Nothing else is set in stone, and there is no sure-fire way to flout the system any other way.

If you want to stay more, go register for classes that will entitle you to a student visa. Can't afford that? Then you probably can't afford to stay in Singapore for longer than you're legally entitled to (if that).

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You clearly don't understand my request

Postby rabete1 » Fri, 28 Sep 2012 4:48 pm

Zzm9980,

You are clearly way off on your assumptions. I was requesting help on how to get my legally married Same sex partner into Singapore with me Legally. I am coming as an expat and am making a VERY high salary working for an American company that is investing Billions of dollars into the Singapore economy by building a global hub center here. I make WAY more than enough to live wherever I feel like I'm this country, drive whatever I want and support my husband.

There are many accounts of same sex partners getting dependent passes and I want to know the best way to help my company go through the most effective process. The official line from sing gov is no, but if they want to continue to draw on foreign money to boost their economy then you and everyone else in this country are going to have to accommodate the needs of those companies and their employees. My company recognizes him as a legal spouse and provides health care benefits no matter where I live. In other words he will only be bringing money to this country not drawing anything from it. The fact that there are government barriers to this is antiquated and makes life difficult for people like me. THUS I was looking for help for anyone who has successfully solved this dilemma. (which I know there are)
BTW:
I personally value the ably to seek first to understand before seeking to be understood.

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Re: You clearly don't understand my request

Postby JayCee » Fri, 28 Sep 2012 5:06 pm

rabete1 wrote:Zzm9980,

I am coming as an expat


Is there any other way for a person to move from their own country to a foreign one, or is an EXPAT some kind of superhero?

and am making a VERY high salary working for an American company that is investing Billions of dollars into the Singapore economy by building a global hub center here. I make WAY more than enough to live wherever I feel like I'm this country, drive whatever I want and support my husband.


Bully for you, with that kind of attitude you'll fit right in with the locals (do a search for Kiasu). I believe ZZM's question was rhetorical, I'm surprised a highly paid Master Of The Universe such as yourself didn't realise that


The official line from sing gov is no, but if they want to continue to draw on foreign money to boost their economy then you and everyone else in this country are going to have to accommodate the needs of those companies and their employees.



You really fancy yourself don't you? If you think the Singapore government is about the kowtow for you and a few foreigners to bring their partners here then you're in for a real rude awakening, they don't even let some of their own citizens have their other-sex partners here (SMS's nephew being an example). Yes, there may be a way for a same-sex partner to get here as others have found but you talk like it's your right. This ain't America, not by a long way, if the government here let is happen it's because they want to, not because they have to or should recognise what a wonderful person you are and how lucky they would be to have you
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 28 Sep 2012 5:54 pm

We had another "couple" like you on here a while back as well. I think they found out the "hard" truth here. Unless your "union" is recognized in the country you are from (not state). It will not be recognized in Singapore, which means that the most you can hope for is a LTVP (or if it is, it will be contingent on both of you keeping you mouths shut about it on the threat of losing it - the do get creative but get very vindictive once somebody puts egg on their faces). On the other hand, if your country has legalized the partnership, then I do believe that Singapore will give a DP as long as the EP holder's company will sponsor it. I cannot point to this in black & white, nor can I guarantee that even if a DP was acquired, that the DP holder would be able to work. The only anecdotal evidence I have is a single case where the company "had" to sponsor the partner, unfortunately I cannot locate the thread.

Oh, and as was pointed out, Singapore is coming down hard on foreigners and it really doesn't matter how much money one has, they still have their own ethnic sensibilities. Have a read up on Section 377A of the Penal code to get a drift of what I'm talking about. So, flouting your "wealth" is wasted here (both here on the forum and here in Singapore, where nobody really cares considering there are more millionaires per capita here than anywhere else in the world.

Additionally, a little humility will go a lot further both here and in Singapore in general.

sms

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Re: You clearly don't understand my request

Postby zzm9980 » Fri, 28 Sep 2012 8:09 pm

rabete1 wrote:Zzm9980,

You are clearly way off on your assumptions. I was requesting help on how to get my legally married Same sex partner into Singapore with me Legally.


Then you shouldn't post such cryptically silly questions.

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Such a Nice Group of Posters

Postby rabete1 » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 4:59 pm

What a NICE group of folks this thread seems to have attracted. I was merely pointing out, or rather correcting a lot of the missassupmtions of a previous post that made it sound like i was trying to come here surrepticiously and didnt have the right or means to do so. I will not go into the difference to come as an expat because it is a separate topic altogether, but YES it is a very different arrangement than coming as a local with a work permit and costs the COMPANY sending you about 3-4X/year in total costs (that ALL end up in the singapore economy) than would have been contributed by a local.

I was soliciting feedback from the forum members I stated in my original post but got all kinds of dialogue from everone else. The point on resources was NOT to brag like the insecure posters seem to have assumed but to point out that a conuntry that produces almost nothing natrually in terms of resources yet is growing at an amaizing rate, relies on attracting business from elsewhere and those businesses are going to want their people to be treated fairly by the singapore laws. SOOO - if Singapore wants US and European corporations money it will need to take the corporate needs into acount OR it will start causing businesses to look elswhwere (especially in the R&D sectors they have recently been courting). Its just the price for becoming a globally diverse country. I think the NUMEROUS posts on this topic are evidence of that.

So - THANK YOU for those that have offered such incredible personal advice. I came with a simple request for help from a few posters that seemed to have some experience on this topic and got everything but that. But I see feedback as I gift and really appreciate the time that so many unsolicited members have taken to help me become a better person. Peace.

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Re: Such a Nice Group of Posters

Postby v4jr4 » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 5:28 pm

rabete1 wrote:What a NICE group of folks this thread seems to have attracted. I was merely pointing out, or rather correcting a lot of the missassupmtions of a previous post that made it sound like i was trying to come here surrepticiously and didnt have the right or means to do so. I will not go into the difference to come as an expat because it is a separate topic altogether, but YES it is a very different arrangement than coming as a local with a work permit and costs the COMPANY sending you about 3-4X/year in total costs (that ALL end up in the singapore economy) than would have been contributed by a local.

I was soliciting feedback from the forum members I stated in my original post but got all kinds of dialogue from everone else. The point on resources was NOT to brag like the insecure posters seem to have assumed but to point out that a conuntry that produces almost nothing natrually in terms of resources yet is growing at an amaizing rate, relies on attracting business from elsewhere and those businesses are going to want their people to be treated fairly by the singapore laws. SOOO - if Singapore wants US and European corporations money it will need to take the corporate needs into acount OR it will start causing businesses to look elswhwere (especially in the R&D sectors they have recently been courting). Its just the price for becoming a globally diverse country. I think the NUMEROUS posts on this topic are evidence of that.

So - THANK YOU for those that have offered such incredible personal advice. I came with a simple request for help from a few posters that seemed to have some experience on this topic and got everything but that. But I see feedback as I gift and really appreciate the time that so many unsolicited members have taken to help me become a better person. Peace.


:roll:

The context "offline" or "unofficially" may vary, yet may lead to a very serious offense. As far as I know, this site is monitored. Should you feel offended, that's because of your initial ambiguous statement.

rabete1 wrote:Hi,

This is to avoid starting another duplicate thread, but if JR8, ClaraLara, or Sundaymorningstaple have any more insights they could share privately I would appreciate it if you could send me a PM.

It looks like there is a lot more information to be shared "offline" or "unofficially" than I will find in public forums.

I am a newbie still so cant initiate a PM yet.
Thanks
Thomas (rabete1)


Yet, you set fire to the rain :P
I am coming as an expat and am making a VERY high salary working for an American company that is investing Billions of dollars into the Singapore economy by building a global hub center here. I make WAY more than enough to live wherever I feel like I'm this country, drive whatever I want and support my husband.


Well, it's your right to mention about the very high salary. I'm not Gandalf the White, but it doesn't take a genius to know that some people dislike "show-off".
Last edited by v4jr4 on Wed, 03 Oct 2012 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Such a Nice Group of Posters

Postby JayCee » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 5:30 pm

How to make friends and influence people :roll:
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Postby nutnut » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 6:44 pm

Thomas,

This is an Expat forum (read the site name) the majority of us are Expats.

There is no reason you can't bring your husband over here and apply for the relevant passes in the proper way, but, think about your attitude, did you come here to provoke a reaction or to ask for advice?

As this is a public forum, the advice given remains public so everyone can benefit, should you have specific questions, why don't you just ask them and we can try and help?

One thing I will say though, what with your altercation with some of the regulars due to you attitude (the regulars who are usually the first to help humble visitors and newcomers) you may find that getting advice is a little difficult. How about you swallow your pride and ask politely for help off some people who are in a position to assist, or, don't bother coming back, there are plenty other expat forums who would be happy to fight with you until you are blue in the face, this is certainly the most friendly and informative forum I've found.

Good Luck in your move, I am sure your company will set up successfully with or without you in Singapore, I hope you make lots of money and you are happy wherever you end up.
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Re: Such a Nice Group of Posters

Postby zzm9980 » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 8:52 pm

rabete1 wrote:What a NICE group of folks this thread seems to have attracted. I was merely pointing out, or rather correcting a lot of the missassupmtions of a previous post that made it sound like i was trying to come here surrepticiously and didnt have the right or means to do so. I will not go into the difference to come as an expat because it is a separate topic altogether, but YES it is a very different arrangement than coming as a local with a work permit and costs the COMPANY sending you about 3-4X/year in total costs (that ALL end up in the singapore economy) than would have been contributed by a local.

I was soliciting feedback from the forum members I stated in my original post but got all kinds of dialogue from everone else. The point on resources was NOT to brag like the insecure posters seem to have assumed but to point out that a conuntry that produces almost nothing natrually in terms of resources yet is growing at an amaizing rate, relies on attracting business from elsewhere and those businesses are going to want their people to be treated fairly by the singapore laws. SOOO - if Singapore wants US and European corporations money it will need to take the corporate needs into acount OR it will start causing businesses to look elswhwere (especially in the R&D sectors they have recently been courting). Its just the price for becoming a globally diverse country. I think the NUMEROUS posts on this topic are evidence of that.

So - THANK YOU for those that have offered such incredible personal advice. I came with a simple request for help from a few posters that seemed to have some experience on this topic and got everything but that. But I see feedback as I gift and really appreciate the time that so many unsolicited members have taken to help me become a better person. Peace.


You're making a lot of assumptions yourself buddy on just how nice you think your shit smells to the locals and how much they actually care if you come here. Since you're so intelligent and would be such a strong asset to Singapore, surely you know how to use Google and the forum's search function. The former will educate you on the locals' (and the government's stance) on homosexuality. It's not quite Ahmadinejad bad, but this ain't Holland either. Any use of the latter and you'd see numerous examples of people with cryptic posts just like your original one trying to skirt regulations, you'd see our general response to those requests, and lastly you'd see how we respond to people soliciting private replies (even when their inquiry doesn't come across with dubious legality).

Feel free to start over, register with a new ID, and post your questions openly and without acting like a drama queen or conceited prick. I promise I'll answer you honestly and with the best quality information I have, forgetting this thread.

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Postby rabete1 » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:11 pm

My goodness. I hope that we can all look at ourselves and how we are acting as well as those that we are respondng to. My intention was to make one point of saying that is relying heavily on western money to grow their economy and as such it will be important to understand the needs of those corporations and their people.

I full admit that I got defensive from the original poster that misinterpreted my request (polite I think) for assistance. I should have waited a bit, read it and rewrote it. However I think the agression that has been directed back is equally offensive. So I apologize for the defensive (and offensive) post. It comes from a lifetime of battling just to get equal rights and I am overly sensitive to any implication that I am looking to buck systems or get " special rights" that are basic to heterosexuals.

I hope that some of the more homophobic undertones that are coming through in the name calling and borderline bullying are not a reflection of the majority of people on this forum. I have spent a lot of time in Singapore
for he last few years and I have previously not had concerns that anyone really cared how I live my private life. I know the las but they are a holdover from the Brits and they have clearly done a 180 since.

My point of seeking to understand before seeking to be understood would be good for all of us (including me) to take to heart in forum settings. After all none of us could possibly know the depth of experiences and intentions behind a few sentences. I wiill assume that no one (unless they are psychic) can' possibly know someone from a few sentences of information. So I will hope that I am not unreparably judged by a few poorly written replies (i take full resposibility for that) and likewise I will give the benefit of the doubt to those that have responded equally as viscerally.

[/b]
Last edited by rabete1 on Thu, 04 Oct 2012 6:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 03 Oct 2012 11:45 pm

That is a good start. Definitely one that I can live with. I don't think you will find a homophobic person on the board at all, truth be known. The one thing we ARE known for, though, is that we tend to call a spade a spade. I, for one, am an old farmboy, and am not a polished sapphire, but more like a lump of granite, agricultural, but honest. I say what needs to be said and tend to not worry about niceties, but rely on the facts if possible.

The fact that Singapore is backward on the issue of same sex couples is that the more that they let in, the harder it is to keep down the clamouring of the locals who are in, or desire to be in, similar relationships but are constrained by culture/and antiquated laws. While it's a forward thinking country, it is only on the economic front that it is so. The rest is hung up on culture and they WILL cut off the own noses to spite their faces if they have to. NOBODY here is not expendable. Likewise, nobody here should think that they are indispensable as it's a good way to add a new "learning experience" should they think otherwise.

Here's another thread that also started off badly for similar reasons. People in your situations create most of your own problems. You'll see by this thread, she also came here with an attitude. We know you all have problems, but you need to realize that not everybody is out to thwart you. Unfortunately, we do not know the ultimate outcome in the following thread.....

ftopic86350.html

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Postby zzm9980 » Thu, 04 Oct 2012 9:17 am

rabete1 wrote:I hope that some of the more homophobic undertones that are coming through in the name calling and borderline bullying are not a reflection of the majority of people on this forum. I have spent a lot of time in Singapore
for he last few years and I have previously not had concerns that anyone really cared how I live my private life. I know the las but they are a holdover from the Brits and they have clearly done a 180 since.



The only homophobic undertones are those you're projecting into our replies. As SMS said above, we say it like it is. Singapore (as a nation/culture) is overall homophobic, racist, and profiles everyone. Do I agree with that? No, not at all. But I will call it like I see it and tell you the absolute truth.

And anyway, just use the forum search and let this topic die. There are quite a few posts from other gay couples on how to get their partners into the country. Good personal friends of mine did exactly this and had no problem at all. They even met each other here while one was a PR and the other was just visiting, and were able to work it all out.

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Postby nutnut » Thu, 04 Oct 2012 9:29 am

Thanks for the apology, it's received with thanks. In regards to your situation, it will be difficult, don't expect to be greeted with open arms by the country, it could be the case they are interested in having you here, although, it could be difficult to bring your husband in, so bear that in mind. No one on the forum is (as far as I know) aligned to the government so much that we can offer you absolute advice, the collective knowledge has been built over years of experience in many different job sectors and personal positions as well as our reading and contributing to the forum here, so be understanding that there will be a minority of those willing to contribute who are in the same situation, but, you may just get it.

As SMS says, almost all the regulars are a hardened bunch, we have seen the fleeting newcomers demanding information, soliciting for private messages to find out additional information and seen people come - take - and leave without giving back, also deleting original posts so people in similar situations don't even have the chance to benefit from their findings.

No one is paid to give you advice, nor are they obliged to do so by any authority other than their own kindness. You would do well to keep this in mind when asking questions, it may explain what you are currently seeing in response to your sharp messages, we don't know you, all we see is what you write in the forum, we don't owe you (or anyone else new) anything, if you weren't here then we would just function as we are, but, we are helpful people who give to people who ask politely.

You know what they say, ask a silly question, expect a silly answer! We can have a twisted sense of humour (some of us) sometimes.

Oh and in regards to homophobia, I agree with SMS, I think you won't find anyone homophobic on this forum, we are all (mainly) intelligent folk, homophobia tends to be the trait of stupid people. You should get over yourself, you can't be so sensitive in Singapore, there will be locals who will be a lot more blunt than anyone here and if you can't deal with it then maybe this ain't the right place for you.
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Postby v4jr4 » Thu, 04 Oct 2012 10:58 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:That is a good start. Definitely one that I can live with. I don't think you will find a homophobic person on the board at all, truth be known. The one thing we ARE known for, though, is that we tend to call a spade a spade. I, for one, am an old farmboy, and am not a polished sapphire, but more like a lump of granite, agricultural, but honest. I say what needs to be said and tend to not worry about niceties, but rely on the facts if possible.

The fact that Singapore is backward on the issue of same sex couples is that the more that they let in, the harder it is to keep down the clamouring of the locals who are in, or desire to be in, similar relationships but are constrained by culture/and antiquated laws. While it's a forward thinking country, it is only on the economic front that it is so. The rest is hung up on culture and they WILL cut off the own noses to spite their faces if they have to. NOBODY here is not expendable. Likewise, nobody here should think that they are indispensable as it's a good way to add a new "learning experience" should they think otherwise.


On the other hand, I don't know whether Singapore will fully accept LGBT people. Perhaps this little red dot will accept pink dot little by little.
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