Choosing a Race

[therat]

Not nearly as offensive as Ang Moh! Actually, I rather like the term as it's mostly used affectionately rather than as a derogatory term (although that has been changing here in the past 2 years as the citizenry gets progressively more and more xenophobic).

Really? I thought "Ang Moh" means "yellow hair". Or does it mean something else?

Ang Moh (hockkien) is red hair.

[zzm9980]

Not nearly as offensive as Ang Moh! Actually, I rather like the term as it's mostly used affectionately rather than as a derogatory term (although that has been changing here in the past 2 years as the citizenry gets progressively more and more xenophobic).

Really? I thought "Ang Moh" means "yellow hair". Or does it mean something else?

Red hair, actually, but it is used colloquially to mean caucasian.

[x9200]

For some 'aww' factor:
There was a Western expat who used to live opposite my house back in home town. One day, I was in a neighbourhood florist and this guy came in to buy some flowers.

The florist was at the back of the shop while her little girl was playing around in the shop.

So the Ang Moh dude went over to the intrigued girl (probably never seen a foreigner before) and told her in these exact words, "Please go and tell mommy that red-haired monkey wants to buy some flowers."

LOL moment!

And everybody knows that the red hair monkey is orang-utan. And as there is nothing derogatory in calling someone a person from the forest so nothing pejorative in Angmoh as well.

[the lynx]

For some 'aww' factor:
There was a Western expat who used to live opposite my house back in home town. One day, I was in a neighbourhood florist and this guy came in to buy some flowers.

The florist was at the back of the shop while her little girl was playing around in the shop.

So the Ang Moh dude went over to the intrigued girl (probably never seen a foreigner before) and told her in these exact words, "Please go and tell mommy that red-haired monkey wants to buy some flowers."

LOL moment!

And everybody knows that the red hair monkey is orang-utan. And as there is nothing derogatory in calling someone a person from the forest so nothing pejorative in Angmoh as well.

Well the Hokkiens in my home town refer to Caucasians as Ang Moh Kau (loosely translated as red-haired monkey). So I don't think they picture orang utan in their mind when they say it.

Still I was very impressed by that guy's sense of humour and his ability to understand the colloquial nuances on the local community.

And orang utans are soooooo adorable!

[JR8]

I used to study Anthropology 101 back in university and we used those terms (Caucasian, Sino-Asian, Austronesian, Hispanic, Polynesian, Negro) very frequently as part of our academical studies and assignments.

If anyone finds it offensive, they are obviously narrow-minded.

Or a communist. I mean we are all the same and equal aren't we?

[beppi]

I usually state my race as "Human".
Everything else is narrow-minded in my opinion!

[sundaymorningstaple]

I used to study Anthropology 101 back in university and we used those terms (Caucasian, Sino-Asian, Austronesian, Hispanic, Polynesian, Negro) very frequently as part of our academical studies and assignments.

If anyone finds it offensive, they are obviously narrow-minded.

Or a communist. I mean we are all the same and equal aren't we?

Of course! Albeit some are more equal than others......b

[JR8]

Or a communist. I mean we are all the same and equal aren't we?

Of course! Albeit some are more equal than others......b

Ah well, that will be the leaders of the communist party. Wouldn't want to have to mix with the proletarian riff-raff would they lol.

Reminds me of when I went to Cuba back in the '92. Air Cubana. Even they had a single front row of big 'luxury' seats for the Commissars...

[offshoreoildude]

IF asked for my race (i.e. for a new NRIC) I always ask for 'white'. When they confusingly respond it's not available I ask for 'Ang Moh', when that doesn't turn up I ask for 'Matt Salleh', when that doesn't turn up they offer 'Caucasian' but I explain that I am certain my line does not come from the Caucus region of Russia.

So... since this is highly confusing to you... mark BLACK... after all we all have ancestors in Africa.

To be upfront; I usually am trying to push back gently against this whole 'race' malarkey by answering in such a way. As many have pointed out, we are all of the 'human race' first and foremost.

[Brah]

So this puts a whole new spin on the supposedly innocuous term Ang Moh, which I have always hated for a number of reasons:

- it serves only to divide people

- it serves only to state the obvious (that someone is different from the speaker)

- it's often superfluous and adds nothing meaningful to a conversation

- it's usually incorrect (as most or many Caucasians don't have red hair)

And now we learn that, for some at least, Ang Moh / Red Hair is the short form for Ang Moh Kau / Red Haired Monkey. So it's the unspoken slur / inside joke that poses as something else.

So what's "black" in Hokkien?

For some 'aww' factor:
There was a Western expat who used to live opposite my house back in home town. One day, I was in a neighbourhood florist and this guy came in to buy some flowers.

The florist was at the back of the shop while her little girl was playing around in the shop.

So the Ang Moh dude went over to the intrigued girl (probably never seen a foreigner before) and told her in these exact words, "Please go and tell mommy that red-haired monkey wants to buy some flowers."

LOL moment!

And everybody knows that the red hair monkey is orang-utan. And as there is nothing derogatory in calling someone a person from the forest so nothing pejorative in Angmoh as well.

Well the Hokkiens in my home town refer to Caucasians as Ang Moh Kau (loosely translated as red-haired monkey). So I don't think they picture orang utan in their mind when they say it.

Still I was very impressed by that guy's sense of humour and his ability to understand the colloquial nuances on the local community.

And orang utans are soooooo adorable!

[sensei_]

So this puts a whole new spin on the supposedly innocuous term Ang Moh, which I have always hated for a number of reasons:

- it serves only to divide people

- it serves only to state the obvious (that someone is different from the speaker)

- it's often superfluous and adds nothing meaningful to a conversation

- it's usually incorrect (as most or many Caucasians don't have red hair)

And now we learn that, for some at least, Ang Moh / Red Hair is the short form for Ang Moh Kau / Red Haired Monkey. So it's the unspoken slur / inside joke that poses as something else.

So what's "black" in Hokkien?

every language has their names for different races. here in australia it isnt uncommon to hear chink, gook, slanty eyed people, ching chong, etc. to me its no different to me calling the whites "ang moh kau"

btw black is "orh"

[Brah]

There's always going to be those kinds of people who use those words, and we can't do much about it but at least we know where they are coming from.

While those are obvious and ugly slurs, Ang Moh is used pretty flippantly and quite often unblinkingly right to one's face.

Passing off a label, which many on this forum have said was not considered a slur, and it having this full meaning behind it revealed, really puts that stance in a very different, and shocking, light.

At least that what I think I'm getting from this info which is new to me.

[sensei_]

to me no big deal afterall, countries use all sorts of names to describe people who are foreign to them.

and its not limited to asians either. we have "nigger" to describe the blacks, "coons" to describe indigenous australians, "ranga" for the redheads, etc

[the lynx]

There's always going to be those kinds of people who use those words, and we can't do much about it but at least we know where they are coming from.

While those are obvious and ugly slurs, Ang Moh is used pretty flippantly and quite often unblinkingly right to one's face.

Passing off a label, which many on this forum have said was not considered a slur, and it having this full meaning behind it revealed, really puts that stance in a very different, and shocking, light.

At least that what I think I'm getting from this info which is new to me.

Sorry for shattering the glass for explaining the real meaning of that. And like I mentioned, I was saying as a matter-of-fact.

The thing about slurs is that it always started as an innocent attempt by the uneducated locals (of a specific location) to perceive and identify foreigners whom they would have not otherwise see in their entire lifetime if it wasn't for globalisation and mass media.

Of course times have changed, but the uneducated ones (being unable to grasp the concept of identification by country/nationality instead of racial slurs) don't seem to understand that it is time to change that too.

[Strong Eagle]

to me no big deal afterall, countries use all sorts of names to describe people who are foreign to them.

and its not limited to asians either. we have "nigger" to describe the blacks, "coons" to describe indigenous australians, "ranga" for the redheads, etc

These words would be considered highly derogatory in the US, along with chink, gook, slanty eyed people, ching chong you referenced in your other post. All of these names are considered derogatory.

I don't know where you are getting your information but most Australians I know are well aware that the names you posted are derogatory and would not use them.

Racists use those terms. Bigots use those terms. Ignorant fools use those terms. They are not appropriate in today's society.