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xenophobia on the rise

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movingtospore
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xenophobia on the rise

Postby movingtospore » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 3:02 pm

Is Sing becoming a xenophobic little red dot? I am so sick of this kind of nonsense:

http://sgentrepreneurs.com/singapore-en ... -response/

Do these nitwits really believe they weren't given the better seat because they're local? You've got to be f'ing kidding me. The only thing I would give them is that it's probably entirely the possible the white guy was more forceful about getting what he wanted.

If this sort of thing keeps up Singaporeans are going to find themselves quite happily alone and retreating backwards economically and in every other way.

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Postby AndyWillie » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 3:32 pm

I think we have to 'walk a mile in their shoes'. How would you feel if you were treated like this in your own country? I agree that many of them have over-reacted to this whole situation but given that the entire country is over-populated and teetering on the verge of Singaporeans being the minority group in their own country, such sentiments are hardly surprising.

And let's not kid ourselves. The reason why we're here is because our companies saw Singapore as a great place to set up shop, high quality of labor at lower costs, and a base from which to target customers from the APEC region. Companies didn't come here because they were well-liked.

P.S Calling them 'nitwits' doesn't exactly help your case.

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x9200
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Postby x9200 » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 3:33 pm

your link: xenophobic - not, paranoid - yes

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Postby movingtospore » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 5:08 pm

Point taken. But honestly, if you take a look at their response to what in this case was likely a completely innocent action - I think it's deeply troubling. That's my point really. You see this more, and more and more, and it shows a troubling inability to separate their own racist tendencies from frustration with their own government. Whether it's stuff like this, or the never-ending whining about FTs taking their jobs. What jobs? Really? I don't think so. I've yet to see a Singaporean line up for a construction crew.

Starting to wonder if this place is coming apart at the seams.

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Postby the lynx » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 6:09 pm

I actually have to agree to OP in this respect. If the grouse is against the WP holders, then the locals should look at themselves why they are here in the first place. Whenever I hear a Singaporean whining about having a lot of PRCs and Bangladeshi around, my retort would be, "That is because there is no local willing to do those works so that is why your government have to allow them in. Your choice, their opportunity."

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Postby movingtospore » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 8:22 pm

To be fair I think we are mixing issues. There is the gripe they have against the work permit holder - they seem to want them to work but don't want them actually here - and then the gripe against higher-paid FTs - and the perception that they get preferential treatment. As in getting a table in a restaurant (And I still say, give me a f-ing break!! I think I will definitely be sure to drop by and give that place some business for putting up with this crap).

Do foreigners get hired over locals for some highly paid jobs? Sure, but it's almost always because a local can't or won't do the job. If a company could find a qualified local they would hire them as it would cheaper and easier. There aren't enough Singaporeans with the skills and capabilities to fill a job that would require them to manage teams across countries and cultures.

I actually think the real problem is that there isn't enough of a home-grown economy here to provide interesting and innovative opportunities for locals at growing SMEs etc. - or to teach them the skills necessary to compete. But instead of thinking about that, or putting the heat on their government to help change that, they seem to jump on the "blame the foreigner" bandwagon without any real thought. I don't think this bodes well for their future.

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Postby poodlek » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 9:07 pm

Personally I'm a little baffled and disgusted that the guy would rather play the race card all over Facebook while still sitting in the restaurant than settle the matter directly with the hostess and the manager in person. Isn't that what a sensible person would have done?

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Postby carteki » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 9:10 pm

movingtospore wrote: If a company could find a qualified local they would hire them as it would cheaper and easier. There aren't enough Singaporeans with the skills and capabilities to fill a job that would require them to manage teams across countries and cultures.


Not necessarily true with the "middle class" workers - ie not on an expat package. Few companies pay out the CPF to the foreign employee's and where they do, its at a lower percentage than their contribution rate for locals. SMS can confirm, but I think there is also a difference in the statutory maternity leave between locals and foreigners and foreign men don't get paid leave to do NS each year.

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Postby zzm9980 » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 9:35 pm

carteki wrote: SMS can confirm, but I think there is also a difference in the statutory maternity leave between locals and foreigners and foreign men don't get paid leave to do NS each year.


My current company only offers the six annual child care leave days when the child in question is a Singspore citizen, so that sounds accurate. My previous company gave it to everyone, which I assumed was the norm, but now know isn't.

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Postby the lynx » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 9:39 pm

Don't mean to get side tracked, but I re-read the link and I can't help but noticing another link in that article which points out another good case to study about doing PR in business. Here is the related link highlighted in OP's link: -

http://kitchentigress.blogspot.com/2010/01/ocbcs-birthday-cake.html

Have fun! :P

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:02 pm

carteki wrote:
movingtospore wrote: If a company could find a qualified local they would hire them as it would cheaper and easier. There aren't enough Singaporeans with the skills and capabilities to fill a job that would require them to manage teams across countries and cultures.


Not necessarily true with the "middle class" workers - ie not on an expat package. Few companies pay out the CPF to the foreign employee's and where they do, its at a lower percentage than their contribution rate for locals. SMS can confirm, but I think there is also a difference in the statutory maternity leave between locals and foreigners and foreign men don't get paid leave to do NS each year.


No foreigner, unless a PR, get paid CPF. Especially by SME's. Or even an uplift equal to the employers portion. Some MNCs do with the proviso that if the employee take up PR then the uplift will be taken away. If a foreigner takes up PR, then CPF is contributed at graduated rates for the first & second year and full rates from the third year thereafter.

There are substantial differences in Maternity benefits and child care leave which was raised from 2 days to 6 days around two years ago.

A little correction on the NS thing. Singaporeans don't get paid leave to do NS. In fact, they are on Unpaid Leave while on NS duties. Mindef pays them their salaries but the employer has to pay the CPF on the salaries that are paid by the military (the military doesn't pay any CPF - it's all stomached by the employer.) This is a double whammy as the employer has to find somebody to do the guy's job (and pay that guy and his CPF AND has to pay the CPF on the military's payment to the NS man, with no production in return.

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Postby poodlek » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:22 pm

the lynx wrote:Don't mean to get side tracked, but I re-read the link and I can't help but noticing another link in that article which points out another good case to study about doing PR in business. Here is the related link highlighted in OP's link: -

http://kitchentigress.blogspot.com/2010/01/ocbcs-birthday-cake.html

Have fun! :P


I read that too...she sounds like a tw@t.

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Postby nakatago » Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:41 pm

poodlek wrote: Isn't that what a sensible person would have done?


:roll:

also

poodlek wrote:
the lynx wrote:Don't mean to get side tracked, but I re-read the link and I can't help but noticing another link in that article which points out another good case to study about doing PR in business. Here is the related link highlighted in OP's link: -

http://kitchentigress.blogspot.com/2010/01/ocbcs-birthday-cake.html

Have fun! :P


I read that too...she sounds like a tw@t.


Article commenter wrote:I can't believe that you actually tried that, no one else would have taken it seriously that OCBC would give you a cake. I'm not surprised they took so long to cave in.

Sadly, this just shows how kiasu Singaporeans can get... It's just a cake.

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ecureilx
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..

Postby ecureilx » Wed, 25 Apr 2012 11:28 am

movingtospore wrote: ...


Let's say, I know enough local FnB staff who had to switch to other trade since they got edged out by cheaper FT !

Personally I could count a dozen ... from former Restaurant Managers to chefs to Bartenders to Waiters and waitresses ... and such

A lot of Service crew / FT work for half the salary of the locals .. if the bosses are to be believed .. and even come cheaper than the traditional source - Malaysia ..

Well, some took up other jobs, some did try "up-skilling" and when they did those heavily subsidised courses and went back to their employers, they found the employers found even cheaper staff .. and decided to re-skill and leave the FnB industry, including one guy, at the age of 45 was finding it hard to compete with (his words -> not mine) foreigners -who are always ganging up and protecting their own .. and went to take up courses in SCM and is working in a warehouse .. On the bright side, his employer sent him to Vietnam, and he is on 'expat terms' overseas ..

And a former bar manager called me to help on some Firewall stuff, seems he did a crash course and is managing a small company's IT division ..

And few decided to venture out overseas on their own, and a couple are working in Shanghai .. again, on Expat terms.

And another very good friend of mine went back to take up a sales course, and is working for a company selling sanitary stuff, and over a drink once she commented - in a jovial way - that she has come the stage of selling toilet stuff .. at the age of 40's !! From managing service crew, she is selling sanitary appliances.

and another couple, wisely, took up cashing on the demand - Supplying for the trade .. they are now running an agency and supply foreign service crew to Singapore and Malaysia .. and they are out of talents to meet the local demand for Service Crew.

The general opinion is, the older you get in Singapore, the lesser your pay becomes, so you have to downgrade to a lower paying job and stay employed .. that's what goes for the middle-class people I know ..

Oh, I know twice as more who are firmly entrenched and are happy doing their FnB work ..

I guess it all comes down to adapting or not .. for the others ..


A disclaimer: I don't know the 3 Million or so Singaporeans .. just a few only ... so what I know and see is not a conclusion of the current state of affairs I guess

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Postby movingtospore » Thu, 26 Apr 2012 12:15 pm

I think it's fair enough S'poreans are peeved at their current state of affairs. But I think the growing hostility towards foreigners is misguided, the poor schmuck who took a job in FnB or whatever here because it's better than what he get in KL or the Philippines isn't to blame.


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