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Downward pressure on condo rentals?

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beppi
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Postby beppi » Thu, 16 Aug 2012 4:57 am

Wishful thinking.
I hear the exact same arguments of an imminent an drastic decline in rents since I first set foot onto Singapore soil in 1992 - except rents never actually stopped increasing (except for a year or so during the Asian Financial Crisis 1997/98).
It won't happen now either!

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Postby wwww » Thu, 16 Aug 2012 9:16 am

beppi wrote:Wishful thinking.
I hear the exact same arguments of an imminent an drastic decline in rents since I first set foot onto Singapore soil in 1992 - except rents never actually stopped increasing (except for a year or so during the Asian Financial Crisis 1997/98).
It won't happen now either!


Not to forget the financial crisis in 08.

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Postby Brah » Thu, 16 Aug 2012 9:40 am

I got my info from a couple of colleagues who are also looking, one of our RE agents, and a couple of apartment owners who are friends.

We looked at a place that the LL reduced her price $2000 in less than a year for a prime rental.

I'm not an expert on the market and am learning the current environment, and I think it depends where one looks but there are more and more bargains out there.

Time will tell and I'll know more the closer our lease expiry gets.

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Postby Segue » Thu, 16 Aug 2012 1:11 pm

The cycles last about 10 years hear and we are in for another correction, its just a matter of when.

When I arrived in 2005, it was a buyer's market - prices were depressed relative to the years before and the LL was eager to negotiate a significant discount.

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Postby Brah » Thu, 16 Aug 2012 7:35 pm

The world we currently live in can't really be held to any previous cycles.

As I said in an earlier post, people I know who have been in business even longer than me, >25 years, all say this is the worst they've ever seen it, and that there is no indication that it will return to anything which any of us once knew.

I arrived in 2004 so I know what it was like then as well, and I'm of the opinion that this is no blip. Of course I could be wrong. I hope I am wrong.

Perhaps some of the finance guys like JR8, Aster or BillyB could chime in to yay or nay this view. I think they are finance guys....

Segue wrote:The cycles last about 10 years hear and we are in for another correction, its just a matter of when.

When I arrived in 2005, it was a buyer's market - prices were depressed relative to the years before and the LL was eager to negotiate a significant discount.

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Postby Segue » Fri, 17 Aug 2012 10:25 am

Brah wrote:The world we currently live in can't really be held to any previous cycles.

As I said in an earlier post, people I know who have been in business even longer than me, >25 years, all say this is the worst they've ever seen it, and that there is no indication that it will return to anything which any of us once knew.

I arrived in 2004 so I know what it was like then as well, and I'm of the opinion that this is no blip. Of course I could be wrong. I hope I am wrong.

Perhaps some of the finance guys like JR8, Aster or BillyB could chime in to yay or nay this view. I think they are finance guys....

Segue wrote:The cycles last about 10 years hear and we are in for another correction, its just a matter of when.

When I arrived in 2005, it was a buyer's market - prices were depressed relative to the years before and the LL was eager to negotiate a significant discount.



Kind of what they were saying in the places like the US, Ireland and Spain not too long ago. I know some investment bankers in the real estate sector they are telling me the professionals have left the market and its mainly the private speculators and hot money that have been driving the sales as of recent.

However, if we knew how to predict cycles, we could all just take our positions and retire in a couple of years!

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Postby Segue » Sat, 15 Sep 2012 3:45 pm

A bit more of some anecdotal evidence....

I met some other expats at a party and one had mentioned that his renewal came up and the landlord straight away offered $400 reduction on rent for renewal and had said the market was getting soft now.

Seems like a pretty honest landlord! Most would be out there claiming the market is still hot and trying to increase the rent.

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Postby zzm9980 » Sat, 15 Sep 2012 5:58 pm

Segue wrote:A bit more of some anecdotal evidence....

I met some other expats at a party and one had mentioned that his renewal came up and the landlord straight away offered $400 reduction on rent for renewal and had said the market was getting soft now.

Seems like a pretty honest landlord! Most would be out there claiming the market is still hot and trying to increase the rent.


Landlord must have been a foreigner himself :D :D

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Postby offshoreoildude » Sun, 16 Sep 2012 11:24 pm

Segue wrote:A bit more of some anecdotal evidence....

I met some other expats at a party and one had mentioned that his renewal came up and the landlord straight away offered $400 reduction on rent for renewal and had said the market was getting soft now.

Seems like a pretty honest landlord! Most would be out there claiming the market is still hot and trying to increase the rent.


And I, on the other hand, had an expat telling me his club st condo would go up a few hundred for sure due to demand in the area.

As a laugh, put in' beacon heights' into . and not how many units are for sale/rent! (134/84!)

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Postby revhappy » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 8:51 am

..
Last edited by revhappy on Sun, 14 Oct 2012 11:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby zzm9980 » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 9:06 am

offshoreoildude wrote:
Segue wrote:A bit more of some anecdotal evidence....

I met some other expats at a party and one had mentioned that his renewal came up and the landlord straight away offered $400 reduction on rent for renewal and had said the market was getting soft now.

Seems like a pretty honest landlord! Most would be out there claiming the market is still hot and trying to increase the rent.


And I, on the other hand, had an expat telling me his club st condo would go up a few hundred for sure due to demand in the area.

As a laugh, put in' beacon heights' into . and not how many units are for sale/rent! (134/84!)


He's in for a shock :)

I had a friend that lived on top of a shop-house on Club St. Top floor, 1200+ sq/foot, huge (200+ sq/ft) private terrace, private lift, etc. Cost? $5k/month.

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Postby BillyB » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 1:42 pm

Brah wrote:The world we currently live in can't really be held to any previous cycles.

As I said in an earlier post, people I know who have been in business even longer than me, >25 years, all say this is the worst they've ever seen it, and that there is no indication that it will return to anything which any of us once knew.

I arrived in 2004 so I know what it was like then as well, and I'm of the opinion that this is no blip. Of course I could be wrong. I hope I am wrong.

Perhaps some of the finance guys like JR8, Aster or BillyB could chime in to yay or nay this view. I think they are finance guys....

Segue wrote:The cycles last about 10 years hear and we are in for another correction, its just a matter of when.

When I arrived in 2005, it was a buyer's market - prices were depressed relative to the years before and the LL was eager to negotiate a significant discount.


Financial markets cycle = unpredictable now. The status quo has completely changed and it's nigh on possible to say with any certainty what the next year, let alone the next 5-10-25, will look like. Europe and the US is a sinking ship - the water is leaking from all over the place, yet all the Governments want to do is put sticking plaster over the holes. China is slowing and, as a result, so to is Australia. Some grim forecasts ahead in APAC. Revenue focus is now a cost focus which is worrying. Banks need to operate more efficiently to save costs. The cost of capital and how much they need to hold is being increased, although regulators can relax this (China) to stimulate activity. Rationalisation of technology and automation seem to be the key themes, as well as the 'not so cheap anymore' route of offshoring everything you can.

Housing market in SG = a lottery as to when it will top out. Common sense suggests a huge bubble - prices increasing, salaries not staying in-line with inflation and growth. How do a young couple earning 100k between them with no savings afford to buy a property costing 500-750k without taking on high risk and being leveraged up to their eyeballs? It's getting stupid. Rates are low and that is masking the potential catastrophe waiting to happen here. Jack those up to 5-8% and the local lending banks are completely fooked. The SG government won't allow this market to fall flat, so I'd imagine they'll keep intervening behind the scenes and have a back-stop in place to support a blip - whether that would be through lending policy to the banks, or some sort of ownership / grant scheme for new buyers. Singapore is only going to grow in terms of population and housing - how do you control this without making a completely false economy? Does anyone know........

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Postby revhappy » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 2:35 pm

Someone in the forum actually said something to the effect that "Like Germany is known for its world class cars, Singapore will be known for its world class condos" :lol:
Last edited by revhappy on Sun, 14 Oct 2012 11:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby ScoobyDoes » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 3:23 pm

revhappy wrote:Someone in the forum actually said something to the effect that "Like Germany is known for its world class cars, Singapore will be known for its world class condos" :lol:



Yes, unfortunately cars from Germany are built better than condos in Singapore, and typically last longer too.

My landlord is attempting to put rent up from $3000 to $3500 on a contract that is 2.5yrs old, since we managed a six month extension. All the while I am seeing similar aged condos in the area advertised around the $3000 mark, +/- $200.

We looked at one unit on Saturday, just handed back to the landlord after a contract, at $2700 and the very next day it was already down to $2600.
'When Lewis Hamilton wins a race he has to thank Vodafone whereas in my day I used to chase the crumpet. I know which era I'd rather race in.'

SIR Stirling Moss OBE

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Postby revhappy » Mon, 17 Sep 2012 3:46 pm

Wow $2600 for a condo. Now its getting into HDB territory :lol:

Which condo is this may I ask? Even one of most cheapo condos, Melville park in the east is getting rented for 3k++ for a 2 bedder.
Last edited by revhappy on Sun, 14 Oct 2012 11:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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