If you are holding similar portfolios and competing for the same positions, don't you think he would be smart enough to see through your ploy to try to gain a advantage when applying for the same type of positions?conversant wrote:I'm on my way there to find a similar role. I also have 10+ years of I.T. experience (in the U.S.). Let's keep in touch to compare notes and help each other out.
I actually spoke to a recruiter who has helped me and he found a position for which I wasn't suited since they wanted a Project Manager who had managed a different type of project before. I thought I could refer the OP to that recruiter. If not me, then possibly the OP could try since he may have the requisite type of skill set.sundaymorningstaple wrote:If you are holding similar portfolios and competing for the same positions, don't you think he would be smart enough to see through your ploy to try to gain a advantage when applying for the same type of positions?![]()
I know, you'd like to help him out. Out the door of the departure lounge at Changi to get rid of potential competition.
On a related note, if you don't mind my asking... one of the recruiters that I spoke with was hell bent on sticking to my payroll title. Since I worked in a semi-government entity in the U.S., everyone's payroll title was the same but we performed different roles over the years.Strong Eagle wrote:What kind of "IT Project Manager"? You will find it hard to come by such jobs unless you are approaching computer vendors, and even then it will be tough.
I like your sense of humor!:)sundaymorningstaple wrote:So, the help you would be giving him is those that you turned down or weren't interested in you.....Would you give him info on positions that you were still actively applying for?
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Oh, in a tight labour market, it's always possible that there IS only one position available in the whole country. Guess it depends on how high up the food chain one is, yeah?
No worries. Just 'avin' a dig this mornin'!
You have to remember that MOM is not employing Industry specialists, and they are very particular about the titles.conversant wrote: What if your function was not coding, but your job title was 'Programmer, Analyst' (which is one of the MOM's standard titles), are you gonna have a hard time getting an EP application approved for a different job function?
Thanks for your response.ecureilx wrote:You have to remember that MOM is not employing Industry specialists, and they are very particular about the titles.conversant wrote: What if your function was not coding, but your job title was 'Programmer, Analyst' (which is one of the MOM's standard titles), are you gonna have a hard time getting an EP application approved for a different job function?
For example, and IT Person knows an IT Network Engineer also qualifies to a great extent, as an IT security engineer, and so, but for MOM, it will look like a job-hop.
So, in this specific case, the person may well be suitable for the job as per the employer but MOM won't let them in?
To tell you why, from what I know atleast, a few years ago, a lot of people from the sub-continent, did that .. hence, I understand, MOM became smarter ..
100% of my work experience is from the U.S., but I --like everyone else-- won't be immune to the effects of my predecessors, I take it.
Farmers, after a 1 month Java crash course, applied as Java specialists, and started to learn stuff after getting the job here ..
Or Metallurgical engineers (now, you gonna laugh - i.e. Stone Quarry engineers), with a crash course, became Security Analaysts, and I know one guy who was fired by the employer within a month as while he was super theory oriented, had zero hands-on exposure .. At the customer site, he was trying to figure out where the console cable fits in, as all the slots were UTP, and had zero idea which is which, and then was 'trying' different options .. until the customer himself showed him which is for console and which is for the LAN ..
These things are laughable, indeed!:)
And i quoted in another forum, of an early 20 year old wonder, who had clocked years of experience .. and more .. and spent the first few days at the customer site reading the manuals .. doesn't bade well .. and the customer cancelled the contract, as they bluntly put it "we are not paying for your staff to do trial and error"
Well, employers want people who deliver, and if they want people to be trained, the job spec says so .. "training provided" .. etc
Since I have over a decade of experience, I'm just looking for a good fit for the skills I already have and am not looking to get trained, although --especially in I.T.-- learning must continue. Like an ex-colleague of mine jested, "We're in the wrong field. We should have become history teachers!":)
And, those days, since MOM was very strict on issuing EP for sales jobs, many a sales guy got their EP saying they are Engineers ..
But someone who has been purely technical should be able to get a job in technical pre-sales. Shouldn't they?
I mean, I know a guy with two CCIE's who was handling High Touch Tech Support for big clients like MCI in San Jose, but now he switched roles to be in technical pre-sales.
Or, are you saying that if you are going to switch roles to something where your transferable skills could be used, it is not going to be when you initially get employed in Singapore. You could get into that role later, but not initially.
And MOM has had such feedbacks, and even my then employer wrote a strong letter to MOM highlighting that MOM has to also ensure such 'talent' doesn't slip through ..
Didn't your employer interview this person before they made the hiring decision? How is it that they don't come to know in the technical interview round that this person isn't worth his salt!?:)
As I said, MOM has seen enough abuses, and they are wary of abuses happening .. and it the employer desperately needs such FT, they do have specific recourse - appeal personally, and submit the documents stating that without this talent, the company is in trouble, or something to that effect .. And MOM will make exceptions for such cases ..conversant wrote: So, in this specific case, the person may well be suitable for the job as per the employer but MOM won't let them in?
No, as there is a very fine line between pre-sales and being forced to clock up sales numbers .. when times are bad. I have been there .. And SME's do tend to put technical people in Sales, when the going gets tough ..But someone who has been purely technical should be able to get a job in technical pre-sales. Shouldn't they?
The above guy, we sort of 'inherited' as part of a company merger ..Didn't your employer interview this person before they made the hiring decision? How is it that they don't come to know in the technical interview round that this person isn't worth his salt!?:)
Apart from Sales, there are a host of jobs which Singapore Govt would like Singaporeans to take up ..conversant wrote:I'm not in this boat but this may help others who are in this situation know what not to pursue!:)ecureilx wrote:And MOM DOES NOT WANT NON-LOCALS to engage in sales, as that is deemed to be an area that locals should cover ..
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