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Any other requirements after NS liability is completed?

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danz75
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Any other requirements after NS liability is completed?

Postby danz75 » Thu, 06 Oct 2011 12:46 am

I found this forum while searching for information and thankful for the wealth of knowledge and helpfulness. I recently joined so that I can ask a question.

Background.
- Finished NS liability.
- Went to USA to study shortly after ROD.
- Met my wife (USC) while studying and got married after graduation.
- Applied and received greencard.
- Have young sons(born in USA and are USCs).
- Recently applied and received my USC through naturalization. (Decided to apply for USC because my entire family are USCs and through some recent events, found out how easily PRs can be easily deported so I made a decision to become a USC to keep the family together just in case).
- I have not yet formally renounced my singapore citizenship and would do so if forced to, otherwise, i would just leave it as it is. I don't have any plans at the moment to move the family to Singapore.
- Exit permits have been extended every year since I have left the country.
- Have never been called up for reservist duty. (I'm on some reserve holding list I'm told)

-Question.
My passport is still valid from the last time i applied(before I was granted naturalized USC) but I don't intend to use it or to re-apply. Am planning to make a trip back to Singapore to visit and use my US passport.

Through some of the posts that I've read recently, it appears that I have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change? I am not aware if this is a law and have not been able to find out more.

I am not planning to renounce my singapore citizenship formally during this trip but am prepared to if forced to.

Will there be any issues at immigration using my US passport especially since I have not informed MINDEF of my citizenship status?

Thanks in advance for your help.

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Re: Any other requirements after NS liability is completed?

Postby Mad Scientist » Thu, 06 Oct 2011 9:07 am

danz75 wrote:I found this forum while searching for information and thankful for the wealth of knowledge and helpfulness. I recently joined so that I can ask a question.

Background.
- Finished NS liability.
- Went to USA to study shortly after ROD.
- Met my wife (USC) while studying and got married after graduation.
- Applied and received greencard.
- Have young sons(born in USA and are USCs).
Did they apply for SG citizenship. If not remain as status quo if you do not have intention to let your children educate here in SG

- Recently applied and received my USC through naturalization. (Decided to apply for USC because my entire family are USCs and through some recent events, found out how easily PRs can be easily deported so I made a decision to become a USC to keep the family together just in case).
- I have not yet formally renounced my singapore citizenship and would do so if forced to, otherwise, i would just leave it as it is. I don't have any plans at the moment to move the family to Singapore.
- Exit permits have been extended every year since I have left the country.

Exit Permit can be extended as per One , Three or Five Year. State overseas employment as reason will be easier. Supplement proof of employment in US
- Have never been called up for reservist duty. (I'm on some reserve holding list I'm told)

-Question.
My passport is still valid from the last time i applied(before I was granted naturalized USC) but I don't intend to use it or to re-apply. Am planning to make a trip back to Singapore to visit and use my US passport.

Through some of the posts that I've read recently, it appears that I have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change? I am not aware if this is a law and have not been able to find out more.

I am not planning to renounce my singapore citizenship formally during this trip but am prepared to if forced to.

Will there be any issues at immigration using my US passport especially since I have not informed MINDEF of my citizenship status?

SG Nationals can only hold ONE citizenship after the age of 21. You have to renounce SG citizenship if you have acquired US citizenship. You do not have to inform them about your family tree as it will complicate matters if you intend to reside in US permanently. Yes, you may have issue while entering SG with US PP due to this. Why don't you use your SG PP ? Another issue is you have to serve at least three in camp prior renounce if you are below 40. All cases will be judge on their merits

Thanks in advance for your help.
The positive thinker sees the invisible, feels the intangible, and achieves the impossible.Yahoo !!!

danz75
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Re: Any other requirements after NS liability is completed?

Postby danz75 » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 12:07 am

MS, thanks for your response.

Mad Scientist wrote:Did they apply for SG citizenship. If not remain as status quo if you do not have intention to let your children educate here in SG

I have no intention of moving my family to SG and therefore have no plans to apply for SGC for my sons.

Exit Permit can be extended as per One , Three or Five Year. State overseas employment as reason will be easier. Supplement proof of employment in US

My EPs are based on a 3 years renewal based on overseas employment and MINDEF has never asked for any documentary proof of employment.

- Have never been called up for reservist duty. (I'm on some reserve holding list I'm told)

-Question.
My passport is still valid from the last time i applied(before I was granted naturalized USC) but I don't intend to use it or to re-apply. Am planning to make a trip back to Singapore to visit and use my US passport.

Through some of the posts that I've read recently, it appears that I have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change? I am not aware if this is a law and have not been able to find out more.

SG Nationals can only hold ONE citizenship after the age of 21. You have to renounce SG citizenship if you have acquired US citizenship. You do not have to inform them about your family tree as it will complicate matters if you intend to reside in US permanently. Yes, you may have issue while entering SG with US PP due to this. Why don't you use your SG PP ? Another issue is you have to serve at least three in camp prior renounce if you are below 40. All cases will be judge on their merits

I made a few trips back to Singapore before I acquired USC and everytime when I leave, the airline counter staff at the airport always asks for my passport + greencard. Since I now have a US PP, I no longer have a greencard so am not sure how to circumvent that requirement.

I did think about it a little further and realize that the counter staff are not immigration officials so technically, they do not care which PP I gave them. The potential issue I see is if when I go through immigration and give them my SG PP, will it show in any system that the airline counter staff documented my use of a US PP?

The other thing is that my SG PP has 3 years before it expires and I do not intend to renew it due to the questions being asked on the application form. So that's the reason why I think I might as well just start using my US PP.

Like I stated before, although I have no intention of renouncing my SG PP during my upcoming trip, I will if forced to. However, I understand that SG govt may not accept my renounciation anyway because I have not fulfilled any of my reservist duties at this time even though I've never been called up . I have only 3 more years before I turn 40 so unless i return to SG to live, there's no way I'm going to be able to fulfil those obligations anyway.

I did see some previous posts inferring that I may have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change? There is no question asking for that information that when I renew my EP. Where would I find this requirement(if any).

I'm also curious about the statement you made above. "You do not have to inform them about your family tree as it will complicate matters if you intend to reside in US permanently. "

My wife and sons are born USCs so although I was(am) a SGC at the time of their birth, I was under no obligation to notify the govt of their births or apply for SGC for them. And I have no intention to do so. Just curious why would this be an issue if we were to reside in the US permanently?

Thanks.

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Postby Mad Scientist » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 4:08 am

OP,

I am no longer young enough to read thru questions and the paste you did on my previous post. My eyesight is failing me faster than the bullet train

Could you please repose your questions with only what you want me to reply ? Do not cut and paste as it makes my eyesight goes blurry
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Postby danz75 » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 10:22 am

MS, no problem.

1. I have never been called up for reservist duty. (I'm on some reserve holding list I'm told). Through some of the posts that I've read recently, it appears that I have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change(which I read as renounciation)? I am not aware if this is a law and have not been able to find out more. Is this true?


2. My passport is still valid from the last time i applied(before I was granted naturalized USC) but I don't intend to use it or to re-apply when it expires in 3 years. We're(whole family) planning to make a trip back to Singapore to visit and I plan to use my US passport since I no longer have a green card that the airport counter staff always asks for when I leave again. Since I now have a US PP, I no longer have a greencard so am not sure how to circumvent that requirement if I use my SG PP.



3. You mentioned "You do not have to inform them about your family tree as it will complicate matters if you intend to reside in US permanently." I don't understand why this would be an issue since I've already completed my NS obligation and my whole family are born USCs.

4. Like I stated in the original post, although I have no intention of renouncing my SG PP during my upcoming trip, I will if forced to(family comes first and we are settled in the USA). However, I understand that SG govt may not accept my renounciation anyway because I have not fulfilled any of my reservist duties at this time even though I've never been called up . I have only 3 more years before I turn 40 so unless i return to SG to live, there's no way I'm going to be able to fulfil those obligations anyway.

Thanks.

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Postby Mad Scientist » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 11:02 am

danz75 wrote:MS, no problem.

1. I have never been called up for reservist duty. (I'm on some reserve holding list I'm told). Through some of the posts that I've read recently, it appears that I have an obligation to inform MINDEF of my citizenship change(which I read as renounciation)? I am not aware if this is a law and have not been able to find out more. Is this true?

Yes, this is under ICA guideline and the law. Renunciation is done via ICA. ICA will inform Mindef/CMPB. If you have not been release by Mindef then you are liable for NS reservist. Why don't you wait till you turn 40 and get the release letter at the turn of your 40th birthday. Once you have that renunciation is a breeze

2. My passport is still valid from the last time i applied(before I was granted naturalized USC) but I don't intend to use it or to re-apply when it expires in 3 years. We're(whole family) planning to make a trip back to Singapore to visit and I plan to use my US passport since I no longer have a green card that the airport counter staff always asks for when I leave again. Since I now have a US PP, I no longer have a greencard so am not sure how to circumvent that requirement if I use my SG PP.

You leave US using US PP and enters SG using SG PP. Your family leaves and enter using US PP. The green card is only needed at the ticketing booth not the ICA border control. Hence show your US PP if need be. Anyway SG PP holders is under a US Visa Waiver program


3. You mentioned "You do not have to inform them about your family tree as it will complicate matters if you intend to reside in US permanently." I don't understand why this would be an issue since I've already completed my NS obligation and my whole family are born USCs.

Never inform ICA about your children as it may complicate your renunciation. Question will be ask why you did not apply for dual citizenship for your kids. Going forward if they wish to come over to SG to look for work, they will not be able to get Work Pass as ICA has your family details when you filled up your renunciation paper. In conclusion, is not about you but is about all of you. When you recieve the renunciation papers , you will understand what I meant.

4. Like I stated in the original post, although I have no intention of renouncing my SG PP during my upcoming trip, I will if forced to(family comes first and we are settled in the USA). However, I understand that SG govt may not accept my renounciation anyway because I have not fulfilled any of my reservist duties at this time even though I've never been called up . I have only 3 more years before I turn 40 so unless i return to SG to live, there's no way I'm going to be able to fulfil those obligations anyway.

As I said, come back for a vist and make it the last time before you turn 40. Get the release letter from Mindef once you turn 40. Only then renounce. Your family tree keep it low profile. If they do not know, please do not tell. Capisce ?

Thanks.
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Postby danz75 » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 11:22 am

MS, thanks for the response. Really good information here. I get what you're saying about not providing more information about my family than necessary.

One more clarification though, so you're saying it's better for me to enter SG using my SG PP and my family their US PP. When we leave, I show my US PP to the ticketing booth but my SG PP to the ICA counter. Will this cause any potential issues?

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Postby Mad Scientist » Fri, 07 Oct 2011 1:50 pm

danz75 wrote:MS, thanks for the response. Really good information here. I get what you're saying about not providing more information about my family than necessary.

One more clarification though, so you're saying it's better for me to enter SG using my SG PP and my family their US PP. When we leave, I show my US PP to the ticketing booth but my SG PP to the ICA counter. Will this cause any potential issues?


I do not see how it will pose an issue unless you do it on purpose. ICA only records your SG PP. The ticketing side will need to confirm with their flight manifest and get approval from Homeland on all flight arrival of all potential individual or should undesirable. Hence a US PP will be wise
It has nothing to do with ICA border control
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Postby danz75 » Sat, 08 Oct 2011 12:22 am

Mad Scientist wrote:I do not see how it will pose an issue unless you do it on purpose. ICA only records your SG PP. The ticketing side will need to confirm with their flight manifest and get approval from Homeland on all flight arrival of all potential individual or should undesirable. Hence a US PP will be wise
It has nothing to do with ICA border control


Got it. MS, thanks for your help. I was none the wiser evenafter spending the first 26 years of my life there. The more I read, the more I learn and the more I fear that the general population has no clue until they're put into a position where they have no options.

NS was enjoyable for me and I had no problems doing it but I am peeved that I'm binded to the country for 40 years(50 if OCS) even after fulfiling my NS oligations.

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Postby Mad Scientist » Sat, 08 Oct 2011 5:57 am

Hey no worries, Once you have those doc , throw a line if you need help
The positive thinker sees the invisible, feels the intangible, and achieves the impossible.Yahoo !!!


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