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Renounce Citizenship

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
siqkicks
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Renounce Citizenship

Postby siqkicks » Mon, 29 Aug 2011 2:30 pm

Hi ,
My name is Daniel and i moved from Singapore to America at the age of 14 upon finishing high school i fulfilled my military obligations and ORDed last year August. I am a green card holder and am currently back in America ,enrolled in a 4 year university. My question is , i would most likely be eligible for citizenship in a couple years and am seriously thinking of taking up American citizenship. I understand that singapore do not allow dual citizenship and taking up the american citizenship would require me to renounce my citizenship in singapore. Do i have to pay the singapore govt any fee for using public education til the age of 14? Will i still be able to travel to singapore for social visits? What do i have to do?
Thank you alot in advance and i apologise if i posted this in the wrong category.
Yours sincerely Daniel

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 29 Aug 2011 4:25 pm

You came back to Singapore to do your NS or you did military service in the US? As we don't ORD in the US, I'm assuming you meant Singapore NS. If you have completed your NS and take up US citizenship, are over the age of 21 and renounce your Singapore Citizenship, you have already paid you dues to the Singapore government (NS). So, yes, you can travel to Singapore with no problems. If you were talking about doing your military in the US, then you would have a definite problem as you may well be considered a deserter by Singapore.

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Postby traderwu » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 7:13 am

I would against taking US citizenship. I am a US citizenship and see absolute no benefit for being one. USD is going downhill and will become toilet paper in the next few years.

US is the greatest debtor in the history of the world.

US is the the only country in the world that tax worldwide income. Has the most complicated tax in the world. Worst, they hired the most stupid tax personnel to work in the IRS. (Smart people would have their own firms or work for private sector that pay 3 or 4 time more).

You are regulated on everything. What you can eat and cannot eat, etc.

Worst, they are passing law and regulations every year to make denouncing US citizen very costly or next to impossible.

The congress don't even read the law they pass. You have to pass it to read what is in it.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 2:51 pm

traderwu wrote:I would against taking US citizenship. I am a US citizenship and see absolute no benefit for being one. USD is going downhill and will become toilet paper in the next few years.

US is the greatest debtor in the history of the world.

US is the the only country in the world that tax worldwide income. False, so does Indonesia. Has the most complicated tax in the world. Worst, they hired the most stupid tax personnel to work in the IRS. (Smart people would have their own firms or work for private sector that pay 3 or 4 time more). Worse still, they have people who use these tax firms. In fact H&R Block is the world's largest Tax Preparation firm. In fact, they used to have an H&R Block here in Singapore. It used to be at Liat Towers. You can also find them in Australia, Canada & the UK

You are regulated on everything. What you can eat and cannot eat, etc.

Sounds just like Singapore, but here you are regulated on what you can say as well.

Worst, they are passing law and regulations every year to make denouncing US citizen very costly or next to impossible.

Sounds like what Singapore does to Singaporeans who take their male children out of the country to immigrate to another country doesn't it.


The congress don't even read the law they pass. You have to pass it to read what is in it.


I hope they let you leave.

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Postby traderwu » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 7:21 pm

No. Indonesia does not tax worldwide income. It tax on all income if you live there. However, the US tax worldwide income, that's it, you have to pay tax to the US government regardless where you live. New HEROES Act of 2006 also make US permanent resident pay too. (I think PR was exempt from world wide income until the pass of HEROES act of 2006)

HR Block is a joke. They can only handle the most basic tax. The tax preparers who work there pay $200 for a 2 weeks training. There is a test at the end of the training, which you must pass before HR block makes you an offer to work there for the tax season, which last from February to April 15. They have branches all over the country, most if not all of them are located in the poor and under educated area. The people who are live there are willing to pay a 3 to 5% interest for a 7 days loan. So they can get the refund (most of it is credits that could add up to 6 to 8k) today.

In Singapore, do they regulation what you MUST eat? For example. order to drug your children?

For free speech, are you talking about defamation?

I think the male children part is because of the require military services. I think it is a good thing as it give them survival skills and more discipline. I was in the USMC fresh out of high school.

Of course, for anyone who is thinking of joining in the USA military now, I will advise them not to because US government just love sending our troops to wars, and station them there indefinite. All these wars have one purpose, to popup the military industrial complex, who are the highest political contributors behind Wall Street.

Yes, I hope I am able to leave soon. But really difficult decision when all my family are here.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 8:09 pm

They probably won't miss you at all...... :roll:

Whoopee! You were in the Marines. You didn't have too many smarts either did you, jar head. sounds like you make a good yank.

the rest of your post, nonsense. You must be a Glen Beck devotee.

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Postby traderwu » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 8:46 pm

I don't even like Glen Beck.

I am a Ron Paul supportor. He talks about things like private property right; you have to take care of yourself; get the government off your back, sound money, etc. I know, nonsense for most people.

The post just my personal opinions. I always advise people do their due diligence instead of follow other people opinions blindly.

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Postby nakatago » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 8:50 pm

traderwu wrote:I am a Ron Paul supportor.


Aah...

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 9:23 pm

Well, at least he got one thing right. :wink:

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Postby nakatago » Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:25 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Well, at least he got one thing right. :wink:


Personally, the only Beck I listen to got two turntables and a microphone. :wink:

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Postby traderwu » Thu, 01 Sep 2011 8:07 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Well, at least he got one thing right. :wink:


Glad we have something we can agreed on :cool:

I do have a question for you. I have read that you have been living in Singapore as PR for 30 years, what is holding you back for applying the citizenship?

I assume you are US citizen as well.

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Postby chandra19998 » Fri, 02 Sep 2011 4:50 pm

[quote="traderwu"][quote="sundaymorningstaple"]Well, at least he got one thing right. :wink:[/quote]

Glad we have something we can agreed on :cool:

I do have a question for you. I have read that you have been living in Singapore as PR for 30 years, what is holding you back for applying the citizenship?

I assume you are US citizen as well.[/quote]

Guess what? A typical PR abuser that want to have a cake and it eat too

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 02 Sep 2011 5:00 pm

The ONLY reason I'm still here is because I have been taking care of my MiL & FiL and my son needed to do NS (he's currently in the Navy). I personally have had my fill for over a decade, but my MiL (FiL passed on a couple of years ago) would never leave and there is no one else to take care of her. But most don't understand moral obligations nor want to. Had I been from a third world country I would have taken up citizenship years ago, but until Singapore allows me to keep my birthright, I'll not give up 1st world citizenship for developing country citizenship. If the USA will allow dual citizenship, and Singapore doesn't, well, I've donated 3 decades to this country, one son to it's miltary, so I doubt I can be considered a PR abuser. :wink:

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Postby chandra19998 » Fri, 02 Sep 2011 6:53 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:The ONLY reason I'm still here is because I have been taking care of my MiL & FiL and my son needed to do NS (he's currently in the Navy). I personally have had my fill for over a decade, but my MiL (FiL passed on a couple of years ago) would never leave and there is no one else to take care of her. But most don't understand moral obligations nor want to. Had I been from a third world country I would have taken up citizenship years ago, but until Singapore allows me to keep my birthright, I'll not give up 1st world citizenship for developing country citizenship. If the USA will allow dual citizenship, and Singapore doesn't, well, I've donated 3 decades to this country, one son to it's miltary, so I doubt I can be considered a PR abuser. :wink:


So in the long run, you will return to your motherland and enjoy all the retirement, welfare benefits there leaving Singapore behind without a fuss, and not to mention that you will also taking away 2 Singapore citizens with u, ur wife and ur son! It is sad that many people who do not want to live here permanently taking up a spot that those who love the country and want to sink root here deserve to but denied. Singapore should abolish the PR system and instead grant citizenships to long term EP holders who really determine to stay here for good. I bet your son is also retaining his US passport and just wait till he can get a good job and move to USA. Everybody condemn Indians, Indonesians, Pinoys, Pinays for abusing the system but given it a chance, Westerners who always complain also will abuse it without even think twice. Men are all greedy, just that some has a better chance to take advantage than others.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 02 Sep 2011 8:35 pm

Actually, my job was just to get them to adulthood and through the military in my son's case. After that, they are on their own. I don't believe in taking care of kids till they are 35 years old. I daresay, I've given much more here than I've taken. In fact, I haven't taken anything here that I'm not leaving when I go. Plus I've left a legacy of giving a lot of knowledge to this country as well.

The only reason I ever took up PR in the first place was for the benefit of a citizen who was being deprived of HER rights as a citizen. By being married to a Singaporean, my wife was not afforded the normal protection of the government insofar as she could not always depend on her husband being allowed to return home at the end of the job. The government wouldn't give those of us who worked in the offshore oil industries PR (we, who kept all their money making refineries in crude oil - I worked offshore for 20 years) or any kind of residency status as we didn't actually work in Singapore, neither, of course, did we pay taxes.

This works out in a rather strange fashion if one thinks about it. The whole scenario borders on stupidity on the governments POV. Back in the early '80's there must have been close of 10K of us here who were married to local women. Back then there were around 60-80K offshore oilfield workers here. A lot of us had children by those women, and those children were all citizens by birth due to their mother's being citizens. Most of us were more than willing to take up PR, contribute to CPF and pay our share of taxes. But, for some reason the gahmen didn't/wouldn't see it. Back then, their reasoning was they didn't want us taking singaporean jobs (sound familiar?) and they would take up much needed housisng. Crap. Who would want their jobs? We worked in the oilfields where a similar job paid 4-8x as much. Take up additional housing? We lived with our Singaporean wives & children who still required housing themselves. :???:

At any rate, to give my wife some peace of mind, I found a job in Singapore and quit working offshore (I hated the job) in order to get an EP. After gaining an EP, I worked for a couple years and then couldn't stand it any longer so I went back offshore (where the money was). That lasted around 2 years and then family anxieties played into it again and I found another job in Singapore. So, to cut to the chase, I applied for PR, was rejected, appealed, was rejected, waited two more years, applied again, was approved.

What did I tell the Immigration officer at my PR interview? (Back then you had an actual interview with two ICA officers - not the interview to finalize your PR like you have today). I told 'em that the gahmen were shortsighted (myopic I believe it the world bandied about today). Both of their jaws dropped and their eyes widened. Then Why? So I told them what I related above about the numbers of oilfield workers who were married to local girls with families, the fact that we were willing to pay CPF & taxes. BUT, for some reason, the gahmen did not want our money (at salaries that produced LOTS of taxes) AND if that wasn't enough, I told him that i's okay though, because the spouse & children are Singaporeans, but the breadwinner isn't allowed residency here and that just means other Singaporeans have to paid the taxes to support my families subsidies, e.g., medical, schooling, housing, etc, etc. You coulda knocked the officer over with a feather! And, his eyes went ka-ching, ka-ching like a cash register. I also told him about all the funny looks I got when I told them "I've already been here 11 years on a tourist visa (between hitches offshore) and have had 1 Singaporean Wife, 2 Siingaporean kids and three cars. Eye's even bigger! Then he told me I will be granted PR AND he was going to look into what I told him. Oh, I had my PR two weeks later and about a hundred of my cronies that I knew personally in similar situations received, within 6 weeks, letters inviting them to apply for PR.

So, as a result of my blunt honesty with ICA officers, I also created another Tax revenue stream for the government as well. Been filling their coffers every since. But, I've never applied for PR in any other country as I planned to stay here for the duration of my working life. I don't, however, intend to be a drain on the economy and take up space here unless I am productive. Once I've outlived my usefulness here I will retire to the US and free up the space I used to occupy here for somebody who will also contribute to this little red dot, and not just line their pockets for a few years until a better offer comes along. What my children do it their business. My daughter is engaged to a Singaporean PhD and will probably stay here (he's working in the Oilfield as well now! ;-) And so does my daughter! My son? Good question, he has his band which, while local indie type, as toured China 2x and Canada once. He also has a local girlfriend. I've stayed through thick and thin and weathered 5 full recessions. I'm definitely not a quitter.

So, until you have walked a mile in my shoes. Think before you end up like this:
Image

:lol:
Last edited by sundaymorningstaple on Fri, 02 Sep 2011 11:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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