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A day off per week for Domestic Helpers.

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Tigerslayer
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Postby Tigerslayer » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 12:07 am

She is being treated like a slave, regardless of your definitions. One can only hope in your next life you come back as a FDWS in your next life and have one of these employers. Then maybe you will see the light, but as blinkered as you seem to be, I kind of doubt it.


:???:

Refuses contact with the outside world? Locks a maid on the property? 18 hours day?

What are you seeing in my posts that I am obviously missing?

To quote myself:-

i do not disagree that abuse of maids should be addressed.


ensure the maid is being looked after properly


I despise the stories of ill treated maids


I dunno what it is you are trying to make out I support but don't let the facts get in the way of your moral high ground :roll:

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Postby Tigerslayer » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 12:13 am

And by the way SMS / Strong Eagle can you please tell me how giving a Maid 3/4 extra days off in a month will solve all of these evils since this is what both the thread and my original posts are discussing...

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Postby x9200 » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 8:29 am

Many problems are self-induced. Many maids misbehave or do their job badly (as per ethical standards) because they are mistreated. You are not loyal to your employer if (s)he does not show you any respect and treat your like a property. Days-off are a part of this package. Not the only element of it of course but a part.

To add to some earlier points.
By nanny, babysitter or a caregiver in the maid context people normally mean a person who can do her duties on a rather basic level. It is more about the scope the the skills. Every "normal" parent can do this job. This is important because the maids are replaceable by any adult member of the maid hosting family. So in the majority of the cases it is not that there is nobody around who would be able to take care when a day off for the maid is granted. It is not about the nurses giving hypodermic injections or cleaning the wounds where you need a professional.
The problem lays in a different place. Majority of people around understands quality time with their own families as watching TV and eating and doing nothing else. In the background the maids take care of everything: food, playing with the children, washing them etc. If they go outside, there is always a maid carrying the kid or pushing the stroller. It is beyond the imagination of these people that they can move their a***s and take some active care of their own kids or elderly parents for one day a week only. What is probably worse, they seem not to feel any need to do anything in person with their kids/parents. IMHO this is a pathology.

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x9200
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Postby x9200 » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 8:51 am

Why actually the maids can not be treated (by the Government) as a regular, just a different class of employees giving them more independence but also more responsibilities. An sub-S-pass holders equivalent.
- it should be based on a flexible contract
- the employers should not be responsible for their misconducts or mishaps - this can be covered by mandatory insurance
- the employers should take care of the boarding and accommodations

The direct expenses for having a maid vary between 1000 and 1800. The maid gets out of this 300-700. For 700-1100 a month you definitely can arrange a package including medical and liability insurance plus pay same taxes if necessarily.

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Postby nakatago » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 8:59 am

x9200 wrote:Why actually the maids can not be treated (by the Government) as a regular, just a different class of employees giving them more independence but also more responsibilities. ... For 700-1100 a month you definitely can arrange a package including medical and liability insurance plus pay same taxes if necessarily.


Political will or the lack thereof.

:-|

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Postby earthfriendly » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 9:14 am

Tigerslayer wrote:I really wonder how many maids will thank you when they get their day off each week enforced by law and find their earning potential cut by a seventh.

I then wonder how many families (regardless of how you twist it to exaggerated work loads) thank you for enforcing a day off that the maid wants to work on and can't when they really need the help.



WTF! This kind of mentality has to change and it starts with me. A person will not be productive if he has to work all year round. The employer has to do the right thing even if govt policies encourage him to be abusive. A day off per week is a very reasonable request. The employer can offer to pay the maid for her day off. Over 90 % of the world population does not hire domestic full time maid. Yes it is a hard life especially with 2 working parents and school age kids. But somehow people around the world have learn to cope. Life is inherently hard and it takes a lot of effort to maintain.

[size=200][b]“Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.”

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Postby boffenl » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 11:33 am

x9200 wrote:The problem lays in a different place. Majority of people around understands quality time with their own families as watching TV and eating and doing nothing else. In the background the maids take care of everything: food, playing with the children, washing them etc. If they go outside, there is always a maid carrying the kid or pushing the stroller. It is beyond the imagination of these people that they can move their a***s and take some active care of their own kids or elderly parents for one day a week only. What is probably worse, they seem not to feel any need to do anything in person with their kids/parents. IMHO this is a pathology.


+1 \:D/

I thought my head was going to explode last night when I read Tiger's comment, hence the reason I didn't reply right away. One other analogy--just as slavery with a "good" master is unnaceptable, depriving maids of their own salary, personal id, etc, etc, etc is NOT o.k. There are many more cases of maid abuse which are never reported, people just disappear, return home or live in the sewer or forest. It's a shame. Yes, all our home countries have similar shameful activities BUT we're talking about Singapore here.

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Postby intime0 » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 12:41 pm

Just my 2 cents...if you are having to work 12 hour days so you can afford to pay your maid to care for elderly (or children) in your home, maybe your priorities are a little off. Maybe you could consider lowering your living standards, staying at home and caring for your family by yourself.

Could YOU imagine caring for the elderly or children EVERY SINGLE DAY and NIGHT with no breaks?

Good heavens, I love my children and even homeschool them. But my husband gives me a date once a week. He'll also stay home with the kids if I want to get out and go shopping. I could not do it 7 days a week! No one could pay me enough. And they are mine and I love them dearly.

No one should have to work 7 days a week.

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Postby Tigerslayer » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 6:14 pm

No one should have to work 7 days a week.


What a utopian view of the world...

Well perhaps less than 5% of the world has this luxury... Only 95% to go then... :roll:

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Postby boffenl » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 7:55 pm

Wow Tigerslayer, where did you pull that statistic? Lemme guess--it fits your argument................ :oops!:

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 8:59 pm

TS, there are a lot of people/families around the world that lower their expectations and material yearnings in favour of their families. Oddly enough, while the memememe generation, that you are apparently a member of, finds it difficult thinking about loved ones, when they only love themselves, there are a majority of families that put their loved ones first, in some cases, this even extends to the larger family and not just kids/parents/grandparents but in some cases, nieces & nephews and grand neices & nephews when trouble befalls their parents. You and yours occupy a pretty good sized percentage, but still, kind of like the percentage that Mac have in the PC world.

I know, I'm one of them. And no, we don't have a maid/domestic/nanny or nurse. We do it all ourselves.

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Postby Tigerslayer » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 10:58 pm

the memememe generation, that you are apparently a member of, finds it difficult thinking about loved ones, when they only love themselve


I think it very self sacrificial to work for your loved ones. When your dad has had a stroke and only your mum and you are left to look after him.

You and your mum are not educated and haven't any relevant qualifications to your name you suddenly can't pick and choose your jobs and working hours.

So you are a taxi driver and have to cover the rent of your taxi 7 days a week. You share that burden with someone else and each work 12 hour shifts overnight.

Your mum has to work in retail which means irregular shifts and weekends. Between the two of you you can just about afford the medical bills, pay the house bills and put food on the table. Medical bills being the obvious big spend.

Now tell me what is left to give up from this lifestyle of excess?

The one thing you can count on is your live in helper who can help your dad walk to the bathroom, change his clothes, eat and ensure that he is taken care of while you and your mum have to work.

You and your mum assist the helper in every free hour you have and do the main things like helping your dad shower etc and look after your dad while your maid takes her breaks.

Now a moral army decide to cast their judgement and enforce a day off on your helper.

Suddenly you cannot work one day a week since someone has to look after your dad full time. When life is hard enough you lose your willing and well treated maid because you can no longer afford her.

One of you have to quit your job to look after your dad every day which then means you can no longer afford the medical bills etc...

Long story slightly shorter... its a down hill spiral....

Still sound very 'mememe'?

Some families genuinely depend on their helper for more reasons than pure gluttony and sloth. They enter mutual agreements based on both the needs of the family AND the willingness of the maid.

My word some people on here sound hysterical for a population of helpers who were forced to come to Singapore with knives to throat where every employer barricades them in to their dungeon laughing maniacally... what a sensationalist bunch


:roll:

To anticipate at least part of the inevitable backlash... I again deplore abuse and believe that where it exists (Which clearly some of you seem to believe is 100% of helper employers) it should be exposed and rectified.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 05 Aug 2011 11:55 pm

No, it's sound like you have dug yourself hole and are trying to shovel the dirt in on top of you. May as well go up on the roof or out on the balcony and P*ss in the wind. If your example were true, hiring a maid would be out of the question wouldn't it. Working a low end job just to pay for the maid? Kinda stupid I think. It would be better to find some piecework to do from home and take care of the family member there. Then there would be no necessity about worrying about hours alone, or being mistreated or ignored by the maid because you couldn't afford all the hightech CCTV's that would be necessry. That would also cut down on the transportation expense, additional food expense (the maids & your when you are working) and a host of other incidental expenses that would no longer be necessary, like work clothing if uniforms are not provided, etc., etc., But that's okay. You haven't found one supporter yet, so I'm thinking you really are wandering aimlessly and shooting from the hip, not hitting anything at all. You started off on the wrong foot, and are still marching out of sync.

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Postby Tigerslayer » Sat, 06 Aug 2011 12:02 am

The initial scenario actually a true story. Not looking for supporters just airing my views just like you :)

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 06 Aug 2011 12:04 am

I suggest 12/7 for 6 months and see how long you last but you have to stay at your employers place of business and can only use the phone and go out with friends IF your employer feels like letting you. Then maybe you might have a better handle of the problem. Your simplistic views are why they finally break down and either jump off the roofs or slice their wrists or p*ss in your soup and spit in your food when you aren't looking. And you know something? You probably deserve it if that's actually how you treat your maid. Personally? I think it's all a wind-up and you are our latest troll. :wink:


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