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Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
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Mad Scientist
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Postby Mad Scientist » Thu, 12 May 2011 11:04 am

^^^^^ + 1

ON THE DOT !!
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Postby revhappy » Thu, 12 May 2011 11:22 am

antonio_eggb wrote:I have only spent about 30+ days here. I find this thread very interesting. I have always thought racism (some form of it) here is somewhat institutionalized and widely accepted. I am not sure how else to explain/define this behavior. I have also noticed this while renting apartments. This type of behavior will make press headlines back home.


Can you explain what type of behaviour? I wouldn't call renting out apartment to your own kind of people as racism. Its a very personal thing. Its often tied with customs and religion. For eg. Indians(Hindus) wouldn't want beef eaters in their house. Malays(Muslims) wouldn't want pork eaters in their house and so on.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 12 May 2011 3:04 pm

Rev, you sound like a windup artist. We've had that discussion on here sooooo many times. You should know better. Look up the definition of racism.

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Postby revhappy » Thu, 12 May 2011 3:25 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Rev, you sound like a windup artist. We've had that discussion on here sooooo many times. You should know better. Look up the definition of racism.


No, seriously, I have heard of racism and racist attacks and bullying in many developed western countries. Yet to hear of such a thing here. The poster is talking about racist "behaviour". Hence the question.

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 12 May 2011 3:42 pm

revhappy wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:Rev, you sound like a windup artist. We've had that discussion on here sooooo many times. You should know better. Look up the definition of racism.


No, seriously, I have heard of racism and racist attacks and bullying in many developed western countries. Yet to hear of such a thing here. The poster is talking about racist "behaviour". Hence the question.


Used to see in ads for HDB rentals: "No Indians."

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Postby revhappy » Thu, 12 May 2011 3:56 pm

nakatago wrote:
revhappy wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:Rev, you sound like a windup artist. We've had that discussion on here sooooo many times. You should know better. Look up the definition of racism.


No, seriously, I have heard of racism and racist attacks and bullying in many developed western countries. Yet to hear of such a thing here. The poster is talking about racist "behaviour". Hence the question.


Used to see in ads for HDB rentals: "No Indians."


I have already said thats personal and related to customs and religion. If you were to sell your house and then you say "No Indians" then I would call that as racism

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 12 May 2011 4:11 pm

What do you call the HDB policy?

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Postby revhappy » Thu, 12 May 2011 4:13 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:What do you call the HDB policy?


Are you talking about racial quotas in HDB blocks? If yes, where is the racist angle in that? The reasoning behind that is to avoid communal ghettos. Which is a good thing towards promoting racial harmony. The quotas are in line with the actual ratios of the various races here. So its not like any one race is being favoured.

In any case, I am sure the poster is not referring to that. With just 30 days in SG and not even in the market to buy an HDB, I am sure he wouldn't know it.
Last edited by revhappy on Thu, 12 May 2011 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby singaporeflyer » Thu, 12 May 2011 4:18 pm

The thread has deviated a lot ! :???:

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 12 May 2011 4:41 pm

(shrug)

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Postby antonio_eggb » Thu, 12 May 2011 5:02 pm

Hi,

I have used the HDB/Apartment rental ads as a visible example of things that I consider racism. I understand that its a loaded word and it means different things to different people. Back in my country I have seen racism too but they are not institutionalized like in Singapore -- the message I get from locals is -- this is how we do it here.

Example 3 years ago in Sweden immigrants were having trouble renting property (south of sweden) after getting about 10 such reports a journalist decided to make a story. Bingo the company was heavily fined and some folks lost their jobs. There are many such stories across europe and no country is immune to racism. Also to clarify my comment about singapore wasn't about my country is better then yours etc. It is something I observed and this thread gave me some missing clue and I started to dig deeper about it.

Back to Singapore -- it feels to me that its a tabu to discuss race issues maybe I am wrong here. In Singapore you have race-based social welfare groups such as Mendaki for Malays, Sinda for Indians and CDAC for Chinese. This is what Singapore knows how to and its their intention to segregate in every aspect. Easier to control when you breakdown to smaller portion. Pretty much science in terms of implementation than anything else. We can see this segregation from HDB flat allocation and our educational system.

I have also heard that (never seen one) in the ID card you have items such as "race".. is that information really necessary? isn't nationality - singaporean enough? .. maybe not. Again my observation is limited but what I have seen so far. yeah institutionalized racism is widespread.

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Postby Mad Scientist » Thu, 12 May 2011 7:00 pm

antonio_eggb wrote:Hi,


Example 3 years ago in Sweden immigrants were having trouble renting property (south of sweden) after getting about 10 such reports a journalist decided to make a story. Bingo the company was heavily fined and some folks lost their jobs. There are many such stories across europe and no country is immune to racism. Also to clarify my comment about singapore wasn't about my country is better then yours etc. It is something I observed and this thread gave me some missing clue and I started to dig deeper about it.

That is complete bollocks !! That news is half truth. I lived there in Motala. The one that screw the immigrant is the immigrant themselves. Get your facts right !!
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Postby antonio_eggb » Thu, 12 May 2011 7:38 pm


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Postby revhappy » Fri, 13 May 2011 11:42 am

antonio_eggb wrote:Hi,

I have used the HDB/Apartment rental ads as a visible example of things that I consider racism. I understand that its a loaded word and it means different things to different people. Back in my country I have seen racism too but they are not institutionalized like in Singapore -- the message I get from locals is -- this is how we do it here.

Example 3 years ago in Sweden immigrants were having trouble renting property (south of sweden) after getting about 10 such reports a journalist decided to make a story. Bingo the company was heavily fined and some folks lost their jobs. There are many such stories across europe and no country is immune to racism. Also to clarify my comment about singapore wasn't about my country is better then yours etc. It is something I observed and this thread gave me some missing clue and I started to dig deeper about it.

Back to Singapore -- it feels to me that its a tabu to discuss race issues maybe I am wrong here. In Singapore you have race-based social welfare groups such as Mendaki for Malays, Sinda for Indians and CDAC for Chinese. This is what Singapore knows how to and its their intention to segregate in every aspect. Easier to control when you breakdown to smaller portion. Pretty much science in terms of implementation than anything else. We can see this segregation from HDB flat allocation and our educational system.

I have also heard that (never seen one) in the ID card you have items such as "race".. is that information really necessary? isn't nationality - singaporean enough? .. maybe not. Again my observation is limited but what I have seen so far. yeah institutionalized racism is widespread.


If you want to call it Institutionalised racism. You may call it so. But I dont think there is even a hint of discriminatory or negative vibes about it. I think it gives space to all the 3 major races to flourish and give a sense of pride to each of the races for what they are. Instead of painting everyone with the same brush. We have public holidays for festivals for each of the races and the festivals are celebrated with equal vigour. You also see all 4 languages used widely.

So call it what you want but this works here even poeple from the minorities feel much more comfortable here than say an Afro American in the US or a Punjabi in Canada. :-|

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 13 May 2011 12:07 pm

Rev, you obviously missed the point. Racism, regardless of the usefulness of it, is, by definition, still racism. Nobody said the HDB policy wasn't good or didn't serve a useful purpose. The question was, is there racism here. And the HDB policy, telling you where you can and cannot live depending on your skin colour, is racism. Pure and Simple. Using the term "Mandarin Speaker only" when the position is in an English speaking Orchard Road or the CBD, is racism when used in want ads when they are using English as the medium of business. And, in most developed countries it is illegal. You just learn to swallow the bile, that's all.


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