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The BillyB, Aster & JR8 roundtable!

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Postby JR8 » Fri, 29 Jul 2011 9:33 am

There seems to be no concept of 'No, you cannot keep on spending money that you do not have!'. As I read last week, 'borrowing is simplly deferred taxation'. It is surprising the people are not angrier about their currrent and future wealth and wellbeing being abused like this.


Meanwhile back in Greece, it seems that bail-out#2 will in fact increase their debt. That's genious that is...lol..
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[i]The European Commission has published more details on the new bail-out settlement. It shows that Greece’s debt will be cut by €26bn, or 11.6pc of GDP. But once a complicated “credit enhancement measure”

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Postby JR8 » Fri, 29 Jul 2011 6:59 pm

Interesting comment on article re: US budget

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I see cstan11, Mike Dunford and Villarreal are long on abuse and short on analysis.

For Villarreal's information, I have four degrees, including science and economics, and a PhD, plus more than 40 years working in and observing the real world. That makes me rather more confident in my own informed judgement than most journalists, commentators and politicians have any right to be.

cstan11 is right when he says the debate over the debt ceiling is not an economic crisis. The actual crisis is that the US federal government is now borrowing 40% of what it spends each year, except there is no one able to lend it the money (and the command over real goods and services money implies), so instead the Fed has been printing money and buying US government debt, thereby stealing from everyone who has earned their money honestly.

The real US economic crisis is that perhaps 30%-40% of its working age population is gainfully employed. By "gainfully" I mean making products or providing services for which customers are willing to freely pay. Once you take out the huge number of real unemployed (16%+ in the US), the ones on lifetime welfare, a large proportion of public servants, the large numbers of students (and their professors) doing degrees that are proving worthless, the proportion of the private sector ("green industry, etc") that exists solely because it is paid by the government or performing jobs mandated by the government, you are left with about 30% - 40% of working age Americans productively employed. And everyone else lives off them.

That is the real economic crisis (mirrored in most other Western countries) and all brought about by the corrupt depredations of government over many decades. It was long hidden by the combination of government borrowing (consuming now what should have been productive investment for the future, and thus stolen from future retirees), an expanding working age population and, for a time, the desire of China and other Asian countries to grow their industry by providing loans to Western countries to buy the output (loans, which they now realize, will not be repaid). All of those ameliorating factors have now reversed and the grand ponzi scheme of post WWII Western governments is fully exposed.

That is the real crisis.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... grows.html

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Postby JR8 » Thu, 04 Aug 2011 6:26 pm

'On Saturday, the European President, Herman Van Rompuy wrote an unintentionally hilarious piece in The Guardian in which he chided the markets for not doing what they were told. “Astonishingly, since our summit the cost of borrowing has increased again for a number of euro area countries.”

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Postby JR8 » Sat, 06 Aug 2011 8:43 am

'In a nutshell, unless the ECB is willing to step in – I mean really step in, not piss in the wind – until such a time as the revamped EFSF bail-out is ratified by all parliaments and is ready to take the baton (say November), and unless the EFSF itself is quadrupled in size and given a €2 trillion mandate without all the German-imposed ifs and buts, then the game is up.

If the EU authorities refuse to do this, it is best for everybody that it is recognized immediately and that arrangements are made for the orderly break-up of monetary union… not next year, or next month, but next week.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/am ... -break-up/


It is as regrettable as it is costly that politicians fail to grasp the above.
[/i]

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Postby JR8 » Sun, 07 Aug 2011 7:10 am

The White House have announced that they intend to explore opening their own credit ratings agency.





;)

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 07 Aug 2011 12:04 pm

The Dumocrats will do what ever is necessary to fudge their position. :-|

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Postby JR8 » Sun, 07 Aug 2011 9:36 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:The Dumocrats will do what ever is necessary to fudge their position. :-|


The sad thing is that European politicians are proposing the equivalent.... that is how deluded they are it seems.

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Postby BillyB » Sun, 07 Aug 2011 11:37 pm

JR8 wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:The Dumocrats will do what ever is necessary to fudge their position. :-|


The sad thing is that European politicians are proposing the equivalent.... that is how deluded they are it seems.


Clinton says jump, Blair says how high.........what's changed??!!

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Postby JR8 » Mon, 08 Aug 2011 8:44 am

BillyB wrote:Clinton says jump, Blair says how high.........what's changed??!!


Trouble is... where is Obama?

What is he doing this week to 'lead the free world'?

Does anyone know, he seems to have lost his voice?

Edit to add:
And this from Merkel's office on Friday: “Markets caused the drama. Now they have to make sure to get things straight again.”

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Postby BillyB » Mon, 08 Aug 2011 10:27 am

JR8 wrote:
BillyB wrote:Clinton says jump, Blair says how high.........what's changed??!!


Trouble is... where is Obama?

What is he doing this week to 'lead the free world'?

Does anyone know, he seems to have lost his voice?

Edit to add:
And this from Merkel's office on Friday: “Markets caused the drama. Now they have to make sure to get things straight again.”

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Postby aster » Wed, 10 Aug 2011 5:27 am

Long time no see, fellas. :)

Does Goldman have anything else still left to float that's big or semi-big, like Groupon, or have they offloaded everything already?

I think the bubble will burst and we'll see a repeat of the crash that brought shares down to silly levels, but not just yet. It'll happen closer to election time, or soon after, and will probably be triggered by Europe or Japan bending in.

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Postby JR8 » Wed, 10 Aug 2011 7:40 am

Morning Aster,

You're back in time for round#2 of the fireworks! :)

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Postby aster » Wed, 10 Aug 2011 4:07 pm

More like the trailer for the real event which is scheduled for future release. :)

Shit is going to hit the fan, but not just yet. Speculators are pounding the Swiss Franc, but sooner or later it will come tumbling down just as quickly.

As for having your own currency just so that you can control it... I think the Swiss example shows that a country has zero control over its currency, which is why the Euro has been so good for Europe (apart from the over-spenders who went berserk like some shopping junkie who just received a handful of pre-approved credit cards in the post!). :)

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Postby aster » Wed, 10 Aug 2011 4:08 pm

You still in Germany btw?

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Postby BillyB » Wed, 10 Aug 2011 4:19 pm

aster wrote:More like the trailer for the real event which is scheduled for future release. :)

Shit is going to hit the fan, but not just yet. Speculators are pounding the Swiss Franc, but sooner or later it will come tumbling down just as quickly.

As for having your own currency just so that you can control it... I think the Swiss example shows that a country has zero control over its currency, which is why the Euro has been so good for Europe (apart from the over-spenders who went berserk like some shopping junkie who just received a handful of pre-approved credit cards in the post!). :)


You're taking the piss aren't you??!!! I don't want this to go to ding ding round 2 with all the insults, but look at the Eurozone - it's on it's arse and if the markets collapse, it will be the root cause.

Aster - stay off the Japanese beers mate!!


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