The BillyB, Aster & JR8 roundtable!

[aster]

Some random info that has been floating around lately:

Apparently not that long ago there were officially 11,000 people in Greece aged 100+. Brussels inquired into this, and it turned out that there are actually only 800 Greeks who are currently into triple digits. Surprise, surprise?

According to tax-office statistics, tax filings showed that only 324 people had properties with swimming pools in a bloc of neighbourhoods in Athens. After the gov't announced that it will use satellite photography to verify this information, all sorts of materials were sold out from local DIY stores. Final tally of swimming pools in the area: 16,974 swimming pools.

[JR8]

'Greece debt rollover would be classed as a default, warns S&P
Greece will be put into default if it agrees to a plan proposed by French banks to rollover its debts, according to a warning from ratings agency Standard & Poor's.'
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/fina ... SandP.html



Hilarious. These monkeys couldn't organise a pi$$-up in a brewery!

[JR8]

'"The sovereignty of Greece will be massively limited," said Jean-Claude Juncker, who is also prime minister of Luxembourg, told Germany's Focus magazine.

In comments that are likely to alarm Greeks sensitive to the prospect of foreign interference, he said teams of economic experts from around the eurozone would be heading to Greece. "One cannot be allowed to insult the Greeks. But one has to help them. They have said they are ready to accept expertise from the eurozone," said Mr Juncker

[Strong Eagle]

They have said they are ready to accept expertise from the eurozone,"

Now that's a good one... "expertise from the eurozone"... a bunch of bumblers, working to protect the banks, with no plan B, and with no insight into long term consequences or alternatives.

Greece really just ought to pull the trigger and start printing drachmas. I'm sure the "expertise from the eurozone" will be able to handle this.

[JR8]

They have said they are ready to accept expertise from the eurozone,"

Now that's a good one... "expertise from the eurozone"... a bunch of bumblers, working to protect the banks, with no plan B, and with no insight into long term consequences or alternatives.

Greece really just ought to pull the trigger and start printing drachmas. I'm sure the "expertise from the eurozone" will be able to handle this.

Precisely.

[aster]

Greece lied and cheated it's way into the Euro. They've been falsifying data for 10+ years now, just so they could make more and more money-grabs from banks and then one day just belly-up.

Kick them out of the EU altogether I say. It's not like anyone will be crying after their departure.

[Barnsley]

Some random info that has been floating around lately:

Apparently not that long ago there were officially 11,000 people in Greece aged 100+. Brussels inquired into this, and it turned out that there are actually only 800 Greeks who are currently into triple digits. Surprise, surprise?

According to tax-office statistics, tax filings showed that only 324 people had properties with swimming pools in a bloc of neighbourhoods in Athens. After the gov't announced that it will use satellite photography to verify this information, all sorts of materials were sold out from local DIY stores. Final tally of swimming pools in the area: 16,974 swimming pools.

Its probably been mentioned in this thread somewhere, but I am sure I read recently that there were only 30 or so declared millionaires in Greece.

[aster]

Apparently the numbers 4-4-2 have taken on a new meaning recently. To the typical person the first thing that comes to mind is the beautiful game. But in Greece, 4-4-2 is a Greek-style tax mitigation scheme.

Out of every 10 Euros that would normally be paid in taxes, the company gets to keep 40%, 40% goes to the "tax inspector", and 20% is actually paid in taxes.

[JR8]

442?

I thought it might be the collective IQ of all the German and French politicians who embraced the Greeks joining the euro in the first place.

[aster]

Yet again we agree.

The alarm bells were ringing at the time, and even the Beeb made some loud statements about how this could backfire in the future.

I have to say it's remarkable how those cheats were able to forge their way into the Euro, and how gullible politicians had to be in order to fall for this cheap trick.

I think giving them a combined IQ of 442 is somewhat overestimating their intellectual capacity...

[JR8]

Kinda interesting watching EU politicians destroy the EU.

----------------
Markets fall after Moody's downgrades Portugal to 'junk'
The credit rating agency singled out the insistence of European leaders on private bondholders taking part in the Greek bail-out as a reason for the downgrade.

Moody's slashed Portugal's debt four notches to Ba2, saying that the country was likely to need a second bail-out before it could raise money in the capital markets.

The outlook was left at negative, signalling the possibility of more downgrades...

...
Meanwhile, Hans Hoogervorst, the new head of the International Accounting Standards Board, suggested allowing European banks to adopt a new accounting rule, called IFRS 9, to gain a "bit more leeway" on Greek debt. IFRS rules have attracted controversy in Britain for hiding risks and distorting accounts.

----------------

[JR8]

Germany's judges hold the euro's fate in their hands

If the eight judges in Karlsruhe rule that Europe's €500bn bail-out machinery breaches of Germany's Basic Law – or Grundgesetz – in any significant way, they risk knocking away the central prop beneath the debt edifice of Southern Europe.

...A recent Allenbach poll found that 71pc of Germans now have "little" or "no trust at all" in the euro. [Oh dear!]

..."Is there anybody out there who really thinks this crisis is over?" said Jacques Cailloux, Europe economist at RBS. "The policy has failed completely. It must be revamped. There needs to be a Marshall Plan, and the penal interest rate on EU loans must be cut to zero."

None of this is happening because Europe's creditor states have not faced up to the reality that saving monetary union requires years of subsidies – not loans – from North to South. The EU authorities are instead lost in minutiae, arguing over collateral rules, or floating plans for bond rollovers at effective rates of up to 10pc. The sole aim is to buy time for banks to offload liabilities – mostly on to EU taxpayers – and for Spain and Italy to beef up defences.

The Greeks are being sacrificed for the greater cause. Their reward is to learn from Eurogroup chief Jean-Claude Juncker that Greek sovereignty will be "massively limited". A body overseen by EU officials and modelled on East Germany's Treuhand will liquidate Greece's national assets to cover debts.

Suzerainty has begun in earnest.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/fina ... hands.html

[BillyB]

Kinda interesting watching EU politicians destroy the EU.

----------------
Markets fall after Moody's downgrades Portugal to 'junk'
The credit rating agency singled out the insistence of European leaders on private bondholders taking part in the Greek bail-out as a reason for the downgrade.

Moody's slashed Portugal's debt four notches to Ba2, saying that the country was likely to need a second bail-out before it could raise money in the capital markets.

The outlook was left at negative, signalling the possibility of more downgrades...

...
Meanwhile, Hans Hoogervorst, the new head of the International Accounting Standards Board, suggested allowing European banks to adopt a new accounting rule, called IFRS 9, to gain a "bit more leeway" on Greek debt. IFRS rules have attracted controversy in Britain for hiding risks and distorting accounts.

----------------

That rating is actually too kind. It should be in free fall like a pair of knickers on a tart.....

[JR8]

But wait, it gets better! Portugal was downgraded by Moodys due to the actions of EU politicians, and now they're threatening to sue. LOL!

A-ha but of course, start an EU rating agency that will report ratings that the politicians demand. It all makes sense in EUland!

Fact is EU politicians have totally buggered Europe and they don't like that fact being reported.

------------------------------
Credit agencies are 'anti European' blasts EU president Barroso as Portugal's credit rating is slashed to junk status

'Anti-European': European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso has attacked credit agencies after Moody's slashed Portugal's rating

The president of the European Commission has attacked credit agencies as 'anti-European' after Portugal's rating was slashed.

Jose Manuel Barroso said the EU planned to strengthen regulations overseeing the three major credit rating agencies - Moody's, Standard & Poor's and Fitch.

And he said European legislators would also look into issues of 'civil liability' for incorrect judgments by agencies on the credit worthiness of sovereign European nations.

'It seems strange that there is not a single rating agency coming from Europe,' he said.

'It shows there many be some bias in the markets when it comes to the evaluation of specific issues of Europe.

'There are some possible developments regarding the possibility of creating ratings agencies originating in Europe.'

It comes after Moody's gave a devastating assessment of Portugal's financial problems.

It said Portugal 'could not fully achieve the cuts needed to reduce its bulging deficit'. [continues]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... opean.html

[BillyB]

But wait, it gets better! Portugal was downgraded by Moodys due to the actions of EU politicians, and now they're threatening to sue. LOL!

A-ha but of course, start an EU rating agency that will report ratings that the politicians demand. It all makes sense in EUland!

Fact is EU politicians have totally buggered Europe and they don't like that fact being reported.

------------------------------
Credit agencies are 'anti European' blasts EU president Barroso as Portugal's credit rating is slashed to junk status

'Anti-European': European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso has attacked credit agencies after Moody's slashed Portugal's rating

The president of the European Commission has attacked credit agencies as 'anti-European' after Portugal's rating was slashed.

Jose Manuel Barroso said the EU planned to strengthen regulations overseeing the three major credit rating agencies - Moody's, Standard & Poor's and Fitch.

And he said European legislators would also look into issues of 'civil liability' for incorrect judgments by agencies on the credit worthiness of sovereign European nations.

'It seems strange that there is not a single rating agency coming from Europe,' he said.

'It shows there many be some bias in the markets when it comes to the evaluation of specific issues of Europe.

'There are some possible developments regarding the possibility of creating ratings agencies originating in Europe.'

It comes after Moody's gave a devastating assessment of Portugal's financial problems.

It said Portugal 'could not fully achieve the cuts needed to reduce its bulging deficit'. [continues]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... opean.html

Delia, you dirty daily mail reader. Shame on you!!