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Chances for work permit / graduate job

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grt
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Chances for work permit / graduate job

Postby grt » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 6:01 am

Hi, I hope to get some advice here because my situation is a bit more complex. I'm kind of a perpetual student and try to avoid work wherever possible.

However, I thought entering work life could be interesting after having worked on several degrees and would like to know more about my chances...

Thanks for any input
Last edited by grt on Tue, 08 Mar 2011 6:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby JR8 » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 6:52 am

Does it worry you that you might create an impression of avoiding work by being a perpetual student?

It reminds me of a episode in my banking days when my manager declined to promote a colleague of mine, on the basis that he walked around the office too slowly. Yes, really.

The serious point though is that banks hire 'young thrusters' who are willing and able to work their nuts off. A bank is going to have no interest in a perpetual student/clerk with no real world experience to speak of (sorry I don't think the European Commission is real world, and you won't get a job in politics in SG!).

Business consulting? Why would anyone hire you? You have never worked in business. But others here will have much better experience on that topic.

Sorry for the hard-ball but I think you need it. Your suggestion that if you can't get the position you want you'll go off and do yet another degree course rather sums it up for me. There just seems to have been little demonstration so far of a need or desire to work. Plus, there are plenty of 'young thrusters' who are going to leave you absolutely toasted in the trail of their after-burners.
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Postby Mad Scientist » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 8:24 am

Maybe I am wrong, there is no longer "expat package" offered by local employers for foreign talent. Unless you are relocated here from your parent company overseas.

Yes it is hard to get employed nowadays hence you cannot be choosy. Getting your foot in the door is the best step moving forward. Then you go from there.
Wanting to do something you love will be a challenge here. You must have something that shows your skill set is in demand to gain employment here.
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Postby BillyB » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 10:59 am

JR8 wrote:Does it worry you that you might create an impression of avoiding work by being a perpetual student?

It reminds me of a episode in my banking days when my manager declined to promote a colleague of mine, on the basis that he walked around the office too slowly. Yes, really.

The serious point though is that banks hire 'young thrusters' who are willing and able to work their nuts off. A bank is going to have no interest in a perpetual student/clerk with no real world experience to speak of (sorry I don't think the European Commission is real world, and you won't get a job in politics in SG!).

Business consulting? Why would anyone hire you? You have never worked in business. But others here will have much better experience on that topic.

Sorry for the hard-ball but I think you need it. Your suggestion that if you can't get the position you want you'll go off and do yet another degree course rather sums it up for me. There just seems to have been little demonstration so far of a need or desire to work. Plus, there are plenty of 'young thrusters' who are going to leave you absolutely toasted in the trail of their after-burners.


+1. Unfortunately you add very little benefit to a future employer particularly in banking or consulting with your academic extensions. We all know that a degree gets you in the door when you are a fresh graduate and the rest is based on drive, experience etc.

I think you should focus on getting some working experience as at 29 and having almost none, you are making your employment window of opportunity very restrictive.

The other option is to consider something in the academic field - teaching etc.

JR8 - My old manager used to hire based on two things. Firstly, they must like football and secondly, they have to be able to drink. He would meet exp hires in a bar and offer them a drink. If they chose a beer the interview would continue, any soft drinks and it wouldn't, if they could take 4 or 5 and still chat sense they had a 90% chance of being hired!

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Postby grt » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 12:46 pm

Thanks for your comments so far.

It seems I should reconsider.
Last edited by grt on Tue, 08 Mar 2011 6:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby grt » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 12:54 pm

Mad Scientist wrote:Maybe I am wrong, there is no longer "expat package" offered by local employers for foreign talent. Unless you are relocated here from your parent company overseas.

Yes it is hard to get employed nowadays hence you cannot be choosy. Getting your foot in the door is the best step moving forward. Then you go from there.
Wanting to do something you love will be a challenge here. You must have something that shows your skill set is in demand to gain employment here.


Actually, this is what I have heard before as well. I'm just trying to ignore this fact because from a monetary point of view it just wouldn't make any sense to stay in Singapore and earn clearly less than $3k if you could relatively easily earn €4k in Europe (or up to/around £3k in the UK) - all pre-tax.

But, of course, it's not all about money so I'd prefer an exciting time in Singapore to a time or boredom in Germany. But, then again, why not work in Germany for 2-3 years and then go to Asia as an expat... :???:

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 1:22 pm

grt wrote:
But, of course, it's not all about money so I'd prefer an exciting time in Singapore to a time or boredom in Germany. But, then again, why not work in Germany for 2-3 years and then go to Asia as an expat... :???:


Going to Asia ever after 2-3 years, as an expat, may still not be what you want it to be. The "Old" definition of expat is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Especially in Countries with better standards of living that what you may have come from. The "uplifts" are not always there.

Again, just to reiterate, the degrees just get you in the door. It's the experience you bring to the table that gets you hired. If you have no more experience than a local, the government (not the employer) won't give you an Employment Pass. It's that simple. A two step process. Finding an employer who wants to hire you AND the employer being able to convince the MOM that they need to hire a foreigner over local candidates, if there are suitable local candidates readily available. Therein lies your problem.

We, having said all that, are not telling you not to come, but just to not burn any bridges. The odds are stacked heavily against you in the current climate over here, that all.

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Postby grt » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 8:47 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Going to Asia ever after 2-3 years, as an expat, may still not be what you want it to be. The "Old" definition of expat is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Especially in Countries with better standards of living that what you may have come from. The "uplifts" are not always there.

Again, just to reiterate, the degrees just get you in the door. It's the experience you bring to the table that gets you hired. If you have no more experience than a local, the government (not the employer) won't give you an Employment Pass. It's that simple. A two step process. Finding an employer who wants to hire you AND the employer being able to convince the MOM that they need to hire a foreigner over local candidates, if there are suitable local candidates readily available. Therein lies your problem.

We, having said all that, are not telling you not to come, but just to not burn any bridges. The odds are stacked heavily against you in the current climate over here, that all.


Thanks. Well, when talking about being an expat I'm not thinking of earning necessarily the same as in my original country or even twice as much due to the 'burden' of coming here. This, indeed, is generally a thing of the past as far as I can tell. From my perspective, it's mostly about being transferred for a certain amount of time, making new experiences and, yes, earning a bit more than the locals/having less rigid contracts.

Nevertheless, the focus on specific work experience here surprises me a bit. Sure, Singapore is an Asian country, but I didn't think, global companies would matter that much and adapt to the local ideas here too much. Interesting.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 06 Mar 2011 10:07 pm

grt wrote:
Nevertheless, the focus on specific work experience here surprises me a bit. Sure, Singapore is an Asian country, but I didn't think, global companies would matter that much and adapt to the local ideas here too much. Interesting.


You would be surprised that in a lot of instances, the home office has little concept of how HR departments in their own overseas subsidiaries are run. They are usually run by, staffed by and managed by locals. Therefore, western concepts are just that.

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Postby grt » Tue, 08 Mar 2011 6:07 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:You would be surprised that in a lot of instances, the home office has little concept of how HR departments in their own overseas subsidiaries are run. They are usually run by, staffed by and managed by locals. Therefore, western concepts are just that.


Thank you, that's helpful to know :)


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