...and speaking of protests: Wisconsin

[nakatago]

Wisconsin. The state was and still is in financial dire straits, Gov. Walker won because he promised to fixed it. Now, he wants a bill to pass that aside from cutting some expenses (most people don't have a problem with those), he also wants to remove collective bargaining rights of labor unions (most people have a problem with this).

Discuss.

One word of warning, though, I'd understand if the Americans or those familiar with the situation to be passionate about this. Those who are not but still be "passionate", not so much and would probably be flamed to death.

[sundaymorningstaple]

While I understand the necessity of Unions (when they were necessary), I've been anti-Union since I started working 42 years ago. I've never worked in a Union Shop and I don't intend to. So, I'm not going to get into this one as my stance is obvious.

[ksl]

Too controversial!

[sundaymorningstaple]

I prefer to be without union as I am an intensive worker, that works rather than gossip, if safety is a problem, I will know and evaluate the risk accordingly, but its my call.

Now I know why you go on and on and on when you're on here! You're not working! It's all bottled up inside and this is your outlet!

[Plavt]

I don't know about Wisconsin nor can I say I want to know but unions are still necessary to protect the rights of workers in many industries otherwise the employer(s) will just whatever they like. There are enough examples in evidence in the UK and elsewhere so I don't need to say more.

[sundaymorningstaple]

Plavt. Didn't the unions almost destroy Northern England back in Maggie Thatcher's day?

[Plavt]

Plavt. Didn't the unions almost destroy Northern England back in Maggie Thatcher's day?

That is not the point and no they didn't destroy Northern England that is media bullshit! Thatcher's policies destroyed the manufacturing industry in order to destroy the unions so the likes of the CBI amongst her cronies could enjoy their ill-gotten gains.

I am not saying unions are perfect but if you at least bothered to look at things in perspective then you might have a more balanced view than that which you at least appear to have at present.

[sundaymorningstaple]

Oh, but I do have a balanced view. I've watched the AFL-CIO in their goodness of constantly going out on strike for half a year for a pittance in "strike benefits" all for a 5 cent raise. The poor deluded union members have no choice but to walk out or else get their heads busted. So while drawing the meager sum of strike benefits, instead of their salaries which were 10x to 15x more than the strike benefits, ended up loosing their cars, homes, whatever, all so the union leaders could keep lining their pockets.

Fortunately, today the AFL-CIO has become the worker's as well as the automaker's friend again, instead of just lining the union stewards pockets. One man accomplished more in one gesture that everybody else for many years before him couldn't. that was Lee Iacocca when he closed Chrylser's Kenosha assembly plant. The union now knows it can broken. The Trucker Union also found out that the independents can play hardball as well after the Teamsters Union leader, Jimmie Hoffa disappeared in 1975.

Unions are good as long as they don't have so much power so as to cripple the economy of a country as has been done numerous times in France, Australia, England and the US.

But unfortunately, Unions are controlled by people and people are greedy. Therefore I don't like the unions. Each to their own.

That's it, I quit. There cannot be a winner in this discussion as long as man is greedy. I'm bowing out!

[Plavt]

France, Australia, England and the US.

But unfortunately, Unions are controlled by people and people are greedy. Therefore I don't like the unions. Each to their own.

I don't know about France (although you are likely misinformed), Australia and the US but as I already stated, much of what you hear in the UK is merely media hype! Yes some unions and some union members are greedy, the car-workers for example may have been seen to be and may well have been that way. However, everybody is expected to pay increase living costs for which they need pay-increases. This something private employers coudn't give a toss about so no surprise that some industries cannot get staff - how would you live on 12K a year if such a salary was unsubstantial? You may not like unions but they are in many instances there for the benefit and do often provide benefits for their members (I am of course referring to UK unions with which I am familiar and also have my disagreements).

[ksl]

You may not like unions but they are in many instances there for the benefit and do often provide benefits for their members (I am of course referring to UK unions with which I am familiar and also have my disagreements).

You certainly need unions in UK for most people, that's for sure, though I'm a little too independant and non reliant on employers full stop.

[ksl]

I prefer to be without union as I am an intensive worker, that works rather than gossip, if safety is a problem, I will know and evaluate the risk accordingly, but its my call.

Now I know why you go on and on and on when you're on here! You're not working! It's all bottled up inside and this is your outlet!

Fishing still, but not enough bait I could do with more sex I guess.