Singapore Expats Forum

Filial Piety Revisited

Discuss about the latest news & interesting topics, real life experience or other out of topic discussions with locals & expatriates in Singapore.

User avatar
JR8
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 16514
Joined: Wed, 24 Mar 2010
Location: K. Puki Manis

Postby JR8 » Sat, 12 Feb 2011 10:51 pm

Oh yes I used to know that nice Donald Bowie (as only close friends call
him) you know.

It was during the Belgravia to Beijing rally back in 1936 that we stopped
by for tea... [and so on, at great length, for 200 posts]

User avatar
Brah
Manager
Manager
Posts: 1956
Joined: Sat, 18 Dec 2010

Postby Brah » Sun, 13 Feb 2011 12:14 am

JR8 wrote:Yeah'ok, and your point is?


...validated once again

Coming to a cinema near you - "The Thread That Wouldn't Die", ""What Will Annie Say Next", "Once More Her Foot Her Mouth".

tyianchang
Chatter
Chatter
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Location: uk

Postby tyianchang » Mon, 14 Feb 2011 3:46 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:tic.....toc.....tic.....toc......

Anne,

After this last tirade, I think it might be a good idea for you to back off a bit. Pot. Kettle. Black. from what I've read. I've tried to stay out of this as much as possible, but you seem to be spoiling for a fight you cannot win. Lambasting the moderators, or insinuating that the moderators aren't doing their jobs isn't going to get you very far at all. Frankly, you are lucky you weren't locked out permanently months ago. Even your backstabbing came to naught. Your behaviour is rather trollish , but was somewhat amusing for a while, however, recently you have seemingly lost the plot.

You can jump down my throat if you'd like, but as you know, it really doesn't make a tinker's dam to me, so knock yourself out.

moderator


SMS, with due respect to you, I'll attempt an explanation. From my newbie thread, I saw you have honesty, among other attributes. I sincerely respect you for that and for sticking your neck out for the unassailable truths, so hear me out if you have the impartiality on a Solomonesque scale of justice.

I retaliated from unprovoked attacks either
- in the way of name calling, Aunt Batty, bag lady for instance = all derogatory
- shameless bitching and my, such disgusting introductions for herself as in the name of brah ( she should know I'm not a man but she doesn't and keeps hunting me with her yukky blah )
- directing swearing words at me ( stressful day, overheated brain etc.? )
- misreading, rude addressing and blatant arrogance.

As you yourself said, they give me the bait as I can rise to the challenge. I really find that a stupid waste of time- this is a discussion platform. Really, all the mud slinging should be for politicians in parliament, don't you think???

Regarding my lovely impossible troll shadowing me, he did. I deleted the long winded complaint regarding moderators as it was really a spitum for my fedups; but he put it back, even as I was typing the alternative. I really don't know what he sees in my bile. But you admit he can be acidic and I can't forgive him for his railing against my compatriots as in Chinese culture - follow the money and augmented brain ( so vile it's unthinkable ), much as I admire his character. lol

As for banning me, that might turn out to be a blessing in disguise for me you know. This is an otiose pass time meant for sublime thinking on a lotus flower in the rising tide of brash realities. That's all, and I do have better things to do, as in don't we all???

But I'm concerned about the 'backstabbing' accusation so I'd like to know what that is all about.

Have a great day, SMS for you deserve it and your lovely boy, wife and other Singaporeans must have priceless FP for you. That's my kind of knockout! haha
tyianchang

User avatar
sundaymorningstaple
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 34270
Joined: Thu, 11 Nov 2004
Location: Still Fishing!
Contact:

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 14 Feb 2011 4:47 pm

tyianchang wrote:
But I'm concerned about the 'backstabbing' accusation so I'd like to know what that is all about.


I am referring your attempt to throttle the moderators by going to the Admins. We were made aware of it when it happened. You will notice, nothing changed at all...... :-|

tyianchang wrote:I retaliated from unprovoked attacks either
- in the way of name calling, Aunt Batty, bag lady for instance = all derogatory
- shameless bitching and my, such disgusting introductions for herself as in the name of brah ( she should know I'm not a man but she doesn't and keeps hunting me with her yukky blah )
- directing swearing words at me ( stressful day, overheated brain etc.? )
- misreading, rude addressing and blatant arrogance.


As far as Aunt Batty is concerned, you should feel honoured that some have given you an affectionate name which is also a play on the nickname for the queen as well. It's more for your quirkiness than anything else. Believe me, I've got worse nicknames here. But, it's just water off'n a ducks back and comes with the territory. It takes all kinds to make a world. For all and sundry, I've been reduced to a phone text message, sms! So much so I sign off that way as well. I've also been called a lot worse. Does it bother me? Nah. They still respond for, against, and outright indignant on quite a few occasions. But, respond they do. And that it just like that old saying for complaining girls when a guy gives them the once over. "I've never met a girl who would rather be overlooked than looked over!" Think about it. You've got their attention. If one is trying to be a constant thorn, just don't respond to the vexation. I get'em on here all the time. In fact, I'm probably everybody's favourite target. Give it your best shot, I say. It only a forum and we don't get the chance to pick our sparing partners here. Just learn to look for the wheat and overlook the chaff. That's just the way it is.

moderator

tyianchang
Chatter
Chatter
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Location: uk

Postby tyianchang » Tue, 15 Feb 2011 1:05 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
tyianchang wrote:
But I'm concerned about the 'backstabbing' accusation so I'd like to know what that is all about.


I am referring your attempt to throttle the moderators by going to the Admins. We were made aware of it when it happened. You will notice, nothing changed at all...... :-|


Recently, I made a complaint about a post and a thread. The only implication I might've made was why the moderators did nothing about it, if I did even mention the moderators. I really have nothing to complain about you, Plavt or SE. Rather the reverse.
The only other compliant was with the newbie thread when I received a strange pm. That was water under the bridge.

SMS, I don't think anyone, safe a redneck, made any nasty remarks on you. OTOH, from what I've read, they're affectionately drole with you。 I haven't browsed much safe a few topics that interest me.
 
tyianchang

User avatar
AstroGal
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue, 15 Feb 2011

Postby AstroGal » Tue, 15 Feb 2011 7:11 pm

I'm going to ignore a lot of the personal back and forths here and address the OP.

I think filial piety is an idealistic concept.
We like to take a principle and psycho-analyse the hell out of it hence much of the finger pointing about whether it works or not.

I don't mean its not doable. It certainly is.

But living in Singapore and living in a Western country has shown me both sides of the coin.

On one hand, looking after and looking out for one's parents is a wonderful thing. It binds the family, it creates warmth and close-knitted feelings of familiarity and family.
Providing for one's parents seem like the logical way to go considering they have raised us.

Asian parenting (at least, traditional Asian parenting) sees the parents pouring their everything into their child and keeping almost nothing to nothing for themselves.
(There are exceptions but lets not get into that.)

The downside is that you end up with children who, westernised or 'asianised', doesn't matter, might turn into nasty creatures who refuse to give back or
even acknowledge their parent's efforts.

The parents are then screwed because there is no welfare in Singapore. So sucks for them.

Then there's the Western concept. If parents are old and dribbling with drool (not meant negatively) they are placed in an aged care home.
Some aged homes are wonderful. Some are hell holes for oldies to wait to die in terrible conditions. It all depends on the budget.

Some elderly parents are smart/lucky and have saved for a nest egg, live wonderful lives and still maintain good contact with children.

But like the Asian concept it doesn't always turn out well. Some old people languish in aged care homes, forgotten, while their children live their lives selfishly.

But yet in these Western countries they have welfare, so the parents don't have to depend on the child. It really is an optional thing. Whereas parents in Singapore don't have that option.

Personally these two sides of any extreme just seem undesireable to me.
Being Gen Y I really value my individuality, but yet I appreciate the traditions which have 'value'.
My parents are quite level headed and value their 'independence' as well.

Ideally the set up for my parents and myself is a house in the same neighbourhood, few doors down maybe, me contributing to their expenses, having a close knitted family life but yet having my own privacy.

Nothing is worse than extended family living conditions where you have to 'hush' sex in your own house. I mean wtf.
-- AstroGal

User avatar
sundaymorningstaple
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 34270
Joined: Thu, 11 Nov 2004
Location: Still Fishing!
Contact:

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 15 Feb 2011 8:44 pm

AstroGal wrote:
Nothing is worse than extended family living conditions where you have to 'hush' sex in your own house. I mean wtf.


Don't I know it! Try it with the 83++ year old MiL, and 4 20somethings in the same house (two mine) and they telling me TMI! :P

User avatar
Addadude
Reporter
Reporter
Posts: 683
Joined: Fri, 26 May 2006
Location: Darkest Telok Blangah
Contact:

Postby Addadude » Tue, 15 Feb 2011 11:03 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
AstroGal wrote:
Nothing is worse than extended family living conditions where you have to 'hush' sex in your own house. I mean wtf.


Don't I know it! Try it with the 83++ year old MiL


Okay - I stopped reading right there... :wink:
"Both politicians and nappies need to be changed regularly, and for the same reasons."

tyianchang
Chatter
Chatter
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Location: uk

Postby tyianchang » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 5:34 pm

AstroGal wrote:I'm going to ignore a lot of the personal back and forths here and address the OP.

That's what I should've done but some explanations were necessary to clear one's conscience so to say. I actully lost a long response at the end -might have typed on the wrong command. But the quality of your text calls for some effort on my part.

I think filial piety is an idealistic concept.
We like to take a principle and psycho-analyse the hell out of it hence much of the finger pointing about whether it works or not.

I don't mean its not doable. It certainly is.

But living in Singapore and living in a Western country has shown me both sides of the coin.

FP is not an idealistic concept. It is a continuous practice among overseas Chinese and has been back in vogue in the mainland. It involves a tradition of adhering to tacitly a recognised way of speech and behaviour although there're no rules written out as such except for 'obedience.' Underpinning FP is the deference for age as the source of wisdom gained from experience.

On one hand, looking after and looking out for one's parents is a wonderful thing. It binds the family, it creates warmth and close-knitted feelings of familiarity and family.
Providing for one's parents seem like the logical way to go considering they have raised us.

Asian parenting (at least, traditional Asian parenting) sees the parents pouring their everything into their child and keeping almost nothing to nothing for themselves.
(There are exceptions but lets not get into that.)

The downside is that you end up with children who, westernised or 'asianised', doesn't matter, might turn into nasty creatures who refuse to give back or even acknowledge their parent's efforts.

The parents are then screwed because there is no welfare in Singapore. So sucks for them.

There are efforts from the clans associations, Christian missions and community sponsored groups to give dignity to the unfortunate elderlies by setting up homes which either take in donations or are free in SG and Malaysia.

Then there's the Western concept. If parents are old and dribbling with drool (not meant negatively) they are placed in an aged care home.
Some aged homes are wonderful. Some are hell holes for oldies to wait to die in terrible conditions. It all depends on the budget.

Some elderly parents are smart/lucky and have saved for a nest egg, live wonderful lives and still maintain good contact with children.

I believe there's a place where east meets west and the twain shall have the best. Such aged homes are increasingly accused of marginalising the elderly, e.g. just yesterday, a complaint was made about an aged not given drinks when she asked for it, and left in total negligence throughout the day. Many do charge a hefty fee of 20,000 - 30, 000 GBP a year , or the house in lieu of housing. But in most places, the quality of care is absent.
Regarding the nest egg, it's the downfall of the state system not to raise our awareness of old age concerns at any time in our education. We mainly learn about every other needs except our own and work to meet all those other needs in our work. There's no time to think about when we get old, or what we'll need. Personally, I didn't prepare for what's coming in old age so it's just good karma that I'm not too badly off.

But hey, what with all these western countries accruing national debts, caring for the elderly is onerous on the welfare state. It can only exist due to extraneous wealth from the 'utilitarian' politics of exploitation of land, resources and people,. Now that most of that is gone, welfare countries need to balance the national incomes with the national needs so that welfare seems like a luxury ietm. The cuts in every department today is indicative. In the end, it might just fall on the family unit to shoulder their own welfare and back to how it all started.



But like the Asian concept it doesn't always turn out well. Some old people languish in aged care homes, forgotten, while their children live their lives selfishly.

But yet in these Western countries they have welfare, so the parents don't have to depend on the child. It really is an optional thing. Whereas parents in Singapore don't have that option.

Personally these two sides of any extreme just seem undesireable to me.
Being Gen Y I really value my individuality, but yet I appreciate the traditions which have 'value'.
My parents are quite level headed and value their 'independence' as well.

Ideally the set up for my parents and myself is a house in the same neighbourhood, few doors down maybe, me contributing to their expenses, having a close knitted family life but yet having my own privacy.

Nothing is worse than extended family living conditions where you have to 'hush' sex in your own house. I mean wtf.


There's never any suggestion in the OP that children should pay towards their parents' upkeep. It all depends on the individual and their family circumstances - entirely a family matter. It's usually the case that payment in deeds is more priceless but material rewards can afford us to live out our dreams.
My daughter has exactly the same plan - to live nearby but I insisted they live with me when she decided to return for good. So we have her hubby and two young kids - luckily my flat's an old Victorian building with rooms for privacy day and night. Let's hope the romps never get too loud and wild. Still, we vanish to France or Sweden every so often and I'm off to Asia soon so it's good to have family rather than squatters in the home.
I'm Chinese with a western family. We talk civilly, most times, and no one gives me any FP money, nor do I want it, but we're always there for one another.
But I have been with mainland Chinese who practice FP the whole hog and the harmonious relationships is a beauty to behold ; i.e. unless the old man strives for power, the boys leave the chores to the girls and the mothers-in-law nag and are imperious of their sons' loyalty.
Last edited by tyianchang on Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
tyianchang

tyianchang
Chatter
Chatter
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Location: uk

Postby tyianchang » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 6:53 pm

tyianchang wrote:
AstroGal wrote:I'm going to ignore a lot of the personal back and forths here and address the OP.

That's what I should've done but some explanations were necessary to clear one's conscience so to say. I actully lost a long response at the end -might have typed on the wrong command. But the quality of your text calls for some effort on my part.

I think filial piety is an idealistic concept.
We like to take a principle and psycho-analyse the hell out of it hence much of the finger pointing about whether it works or not.

I don't mean its not doable. It certainly is.

But living in Singapore and living in a Western country has shown me both sides of the coin.

On one hand, looking after and looking out for one's parents is a wonderful thing. It binds the family, it creates warmth and close-knitted feelings of familiarity and family.
Providing for one's parents seem like the logical way to go considering they have raised us.

Asian parenting (at least, traditional Asian parenting) sees the parents pouring their everything into their child and keeping almost nothing to nothing for themselves.
(There are exceptions but lets not get into that.)

The downside is that you end up with children who, westernised or 'asianised', doesn't matter, might turn into nasty creatures who refuse to give back or
even acknowledge their parent's efforts.

The parents are then screwed because there is no welfare in Singapore. So sucks for them.

Then there's the Western concept. If parents are old and dribbling with drool (not meant negatively) they are placed in an aged care home.
Some aged homes are wonderful. Some are hell holes for oldies to wait to die in terrible conditions. It all depends on the budget.

Some elderly parents are smart/lucky and have saved for a nest egg, live wonderful lives and still maintain good contact with children.

But like the Asian concept it doesn't always turn out well. Some old people languish in aged care homes, forgotten, while their children live their lives selfishly.

But yet in these Western countries they have welfare, so the parents don't have to depend on the child. It really is an optional thing. Whereas parents in Singapore don't have that option.

Personally these two sides of any extreme just seem undesireable to me.
Being Gen Y I really value my individuality, but yet I appreciate the traditions which have 'value'.
My parents are quite level headed and value their 'independence' as well.

Ideally the set up for my parents and myself is a house in the same neighbourhood, few doors down maybe, me contributing to their expenses, having a close knitted family life but yet having my own privacy.

Nothing is worse than extended family living conditions where you have to 'hush' sex in your own house. I mean wtf.


I'd just submitted another long response and lost it too. This is weird. I'm sorry about that AG for I really enjoy chatting with you - maybe we can meet up when I'm in SG.
tyianchang

User avatar
JR8
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 16514
Joined: Wed, 24 Mar 2010
Location: K. Puki Manis

Postby JR8 » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:10 pm

I blame anti-Chinese agents :wink: :lol:

User avatar
ksl
Governor
Governor
Posts: 6005
Joined: Mon, 19 Jul 2004
Location: Singapore
Contact:

Postby ksl » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:40 pm

I'd just submitted another long response and lost it too. This is weird. I'm sorry about that AG for I really enjoy chatting with you - maybe we can meet up when I'm in
Long response times, allow for the connection to time out or drop, hence you lose your text. As SMS calls me long winded, I have experience of the same sometimes, and i really do curse, while I imagine SMS grins like a cheshire cat :wink:

tyianchang
Chatter
Chatter
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Location: uk

Postby tyianchang » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:47 pm

ksl wrote:
I'd just submitted another long response and lost it too. This is weird. I'm sorry about that AG for I really enjoy chatting with you - maybe we can meet up when I'm in
Long response times, allow for the connection to time out or drop, hence you lose your text. As SMS calls me long winded, I have experience of the same sometimes, and i really do curse, while I imagine SMS grins like a cheshire cat :wink:


Thanks, ksl.
I tapped the wrong command inthe first instance; and the second time, it was because I shifted the paragraohs in the original text. But AG deserves good things in life. OOOPS, I've neglected my work!
Last edited by tyianchang on Wed, 16 Feb 2011 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
tyianchang

User avatar
JR8
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 16514
Joined: Wed, 24 Mar 2010
Location: K. Puki Manis

Postby JR8 » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:50 pm

If that is the problem, simple answer...

Copy and paste the message to which you wish to reply into a new e-mail [say Outlook]. Insert your reply. Add formatting.

Open Explorer again and this forum, and the post to which you are replying. Copy and paste as a reply. Preview to check formatting. Post.

If it fails, you still have all of your original in Outlook as a back-up.

User avatar
JR8
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 16514
Joined: Wed, 24 Mar 2010
Location: K. Puki Manis

Postby JR8 » Wed, 16 Feb 2011 7:57 pm

tyianchang wrote: But AG deserves good things in life.


Would that be in any way connected with the fact that she shares some sentiments about FP with you?

Just asking :P


  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post
  • The tips thing, revisited
    by Brah » Sat, 17 May 2014 10:59 pm » in Staying, Living in Singapore
    47
    7035
    by zzm9980 View the latest post
    Sun, 08 Jun 2014 3:24 am

Return to “General Discussions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests