What is this "black mark" on the resume?

[deity_me]

I've been reading some other thread that mentions a black mark on the resume for being terminated.

What is this black mark?
How will it follow you for the rest of your life?

[sundaymorningstaple]

I've been reading some other thread that mentions a black mark on the resume for being terminated.

What is this black mark?
How will it follow you for the rest of your life?

And you want to be considered as foreign talent?

[deity_me]

Please explain your comment because I am unfamiliar with terms being used there.

In North America, it is not mandatory to include all your past work experiences. Applying for an IT job, I highly doubt people looking at my resume would be interested seeing my first job as a cleaner or my other unrelated jobs as a telemarketer.

My employment was terminated once but I doubt that was my fault.
I was hired as a technical manager several years ago but on my second day on the job, my department was dissolved. All my developers were reassigned to a different project. The only ones left in my department was my director and myself. If I resigned, I would not get any social insurance benefits. If I was terminated, I would receive 60% of my salary for the next 6month or when I get another job. It would not have been fair for them to ask me to resign because I just left another job so I could go work for them.

I don't include that in my Resume because it was a pointless detour in my career.

[JR8]

There is someone who hangs out here, and their resume is blank for their first 35 years.

Different from the orthodoxy!

[sundaymorningstaple]

Please explain your comment because I am unfamiliar with terms being used there.

In North America, it is not mandatory to include all your past work experiences. Applying for an IT job, I highly doubt people looking at my resume would be interested seeing my first job as a cleaner or my other unrelated jobs as a telemarketer.

My employment was terminated once but I doubt that was my fault.
I was hired as a technical manager several years ago but on my second day on the job, my department was dissolved. All my developers were reassigned to a different project. The only ones left in my department was my director and myself. If I resigned, I would not get any social insurance benefits. If I was terminated, I would receive 60% of my salary for the next 6month or when I get another job. It would not have been fair for them to ask me to resign because I just left another job so I could go work for them.

I don't include that in my Resume because it was a pointless detour in my career.

That's the funny think about Asia. It's not the US or Canada or the UK where things like age, race, gender, religion and what colour underwear you wear are allowed to be asked for. Invariably HR departments want to know all of the above as well as how much you made on your previous jobs, why you left (sic!) and other "non-relevant" BS. Often (most) times they don't "check" the facts, but none-the-less, if one is caught lying on their CV, well,......

It's a hazard of working in Asia where there are no "laws" per se. This is why there are not many terminations here but lots of resignations for dubious reasons. Employers go to great lengths to convince the employee getting the sack that it's better if they resign rather than get terminated. You do to suit yourself. I'm just relating how things are here. (I'm from there originally as well - East coast of the US anyway).

[deity_me]

So I'm still confused about this black mark thing
Am I supposed to include all my work experience and reason for leaving?

[Mad Scientist]

So I'm still confused about this black mark thing
Am I supposed to include all my work experience and reason for leaving?

A black mark can means anything from employer's perspective. It can means that your previous employment has not gone well for you OR you have a criminal record so on and so forth.

What SMS said is true in many sense.

It is up to you to write down or not. IMHO if you feel that it will jeopardise your chance and not relevant to the pertaining job application then forget it and do not worry . I do employ staff years ago but I did not have any black mark on my employee. I do not really see what is on their CV . More on face to face and feels if the interviewee is up for the job.
Usually HR will get the department manager involve so write what you think will land you that job and no BS as it will bite you in your bum

[scarbowl]

So I'm still confused about this black mark thing
Am I supposed to include all my work experience and reason for leaving?

I wouldn't leave any gaps without explanation but I also wouldn't feel compelled to include minor points such as those you point out.

[JayCee]

So I'm still confused about this black mark thing
Am I supposed to include all my work experience and reason for leaving?

My CV doesn't state reasons for leaving any of my old jobs, I've never seen one that did. If they ask in an interview then tell them, otherwise don't say anything

[JR8]

So I'm still confused about this black mark thing
Am I supposed to include all my work experience and reason for leaving?

My CV doesn't state reasons for leaving any of my old jobs, I've never seen one that did. If they ask in an interview then tell them, otherwise don't say anything

It wouldn't surprise me if SGns would be uncomfortable asking such questions to your face. So, if as is suggested, 'reasons for leaving' are common to state here I expect it is because they hope to choose a candidate from reading resumes. If they ask for photos too... hey, thy don't even need to see you!

[hellind]

It is very hard to fill a job vacancy. It took us many months to find a credit risk business analyst because we wanted to find the right candidate. A right candidate would be one who has the attitude in addition to technical skills.

We would definitely ask the reasons for leaving your previous 2 jobs. We want loyalty, commitment, and ability to get along with most people.

[ututu]

It is very hard to fill a job vacancy. It took us many months to find a credit risk business analyst because we wanted to find the right candidate. A right candidate would be one who has the attitude in addition to technical skills.

We would definitely ask the reasons for leaving your previous 2 jobs. We want loyalty, commitment, and ability to get along with most people.

loyalty just like love, friendship, etc is a two way street and can not be demanded it can only be earned. With modern day employment arrangements it's quite hypocritical for employer to demand loyalty w/o offering any in return. Unless of course yours is some old style Japanese company or tight knitted SME.

I think better would be to look for fairness, as treating employees fairly is still common so expecting fairness in return is not unreasonable.

Anytime some of these MNCs start demanding loyalty when it's well known that they chop heads at the moment's notice I cringe at the idiocy.

[JR8]

It is very hard to fill a job vacancy. It took us many months to find a credit risk business analyst because we wanted to find the right candidate. A right candidate would be one who has the attitude in addition to technical skills.

We would definitely ask the reasons for leaving your previous 2 jobs. We want loyalty, commitment, and ability to get along with most people.

loyalty just like love, friendship, etc is a two way street and can not be demanded it can only be earned. With modern day employment arrangements it's quite hypocritical for employer to demand loyalty w/o offering any in return. Unless of course yours is some old style Japanese company or tight knitted SME.

I think better would be to look for fairness, as treating employees fairly is still common so expecting fairness in return is not unreasonable.

Anytime some of these MNCs start demanding loyalty when it's well known that they chop heads at the moment's notice I cringe at the idiocy.

+1

[sundaymorningstaple]

-1

As a job seeker, if you don't bring anything to the company that may appeal to the company's attitude, Well, let's just say, you are the applicant, and unless you were headhunted (which is an extremely small fraction of a percentage point), you are the supplicant and not the hirer. The hirer has their choice, the job seeker may or may not. As a job seeker, one would do well to remember that. It's the employees that create company policy. the company's actions are governed by the employee's actions. HR policies are a creation based on abuses by employees.

As far as loyalty goes, in today's economy, especially here in Singapore, where the average worker will jump ship for $50 or 5 minutes, the workers have done it to themselves. not the other way around. (unless it's a full blown economic crises). We have only terminated two people over the past 3 years (both for cause), While we have an annual turn over of around 10% whe have about 30% of the company with over 5 years of service. We have no retirement age (they can work as long as they are capable of doing the job) and we don't cut their salaries or freeze their salaries because of their age. (Oh, our staff strength runs between 180-225 staff - so we aren't exactly small potatoes).

[vozzie]

Yes .... however, demanding "loyalty" and/or "the right attitude" in a job selection criteria is just plain dumb.

1. Will you be loyal to the company? ... ah, yes!
2. Do you have a great attitude? .. ah, yes!

The only thing that will determine an applicant's loyalty or attitude is ... time.
He will either enjoy being in the company and will stay ... or he will go.

So, I agree with JR8 ... it's incumbent on the company to provide an environment that tends to generate loyalty and a good attitude.