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EP - How many jobs can you have?

Relocating, travelling or planning to make Singapore home? Discuss the criterias, passes or visa that is required.
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EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby Vek » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 10:46 am

Hi all,

My first post to kick-off.

I'm on an EP P2 and I'm wondering if these passes allow me to have more than one job? I have my main company "sponsor" for this pass but keen to do some outside consultancy on the side. Its all transparent as its stipulated in my employment contract that I can do this, but will the EP allow me to do so? Any thoughts would be useful.

Also to allow flexibility I'm going to upgrade to P1 status with a supporting letter from my sponsoring company confirming my monthly salary level and afterwards I intent to move onto PEP straight away. I've only been here since August. Is it too early to consider this move to PEP and would it probably get rejected by MOM given the time I've been here?

Thanks

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Postby nakatago » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 10:49 am

one job--the one's that registered by your company and that's it.

PEP, wait two years. look it up in the MOM site how to get a PEP from P2.

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Re: EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 11:34 am

Vek wrote:Hi all,

My first post to kick-off.

I'm on an EP P2 and I'm wondering if these passes allow me to have more than one job? I have my main company "sponsor" for this pass but keen to do some outside consultancy on the side. Its all transparent as its stipulated in my employment contract that I can do this, but will the EP allow me to do so? Any thoughts would be useful.

Also to allow flexibility I'm going to upgrade to P1 status with a supporting letter from my sponsoring company confirming my monthly salary level and afterwards I intent to move onto PEP straight away. I've only been here since August. Is it too early to consider this move to PEP and would it probably get rejected by MOM given the time I've been here?

Thanks


No, you cannot work for more than one employer while on an EP. If you are caught, you are history.

The upgrading process is not one of your choosing. When your company appliesfor an EP, the application;s only "choice" is an EP or "if not acceptible will you consider an S pass". They determine which level EP you get. So even if your income is over $7K/mo they may well leave your EP as a P2. There is a reason for this but I'm not getting into that in this discussion. Going to a PEP from there might prove difficult in the short term (e.g., the first 2 years) as more than likely you didn't qualify for the PEP before coming here. I'm sure that they are going to want to see documentary proof before granting the PEP. Oh, should they find out that you are in collusion with the employer so that he pays you a higher amount and then your are remitting back salary to the employer just so you can get a higher level EP, if you get caught you will be unceremoniously booted out of the country. Technically there is no way they can catch you unless you are an S pass holder as you are not contributing CPF nor is the employer required to pay you via GIRO as is required for S pass holders. However you will have to pay an additional amount to IRAS in taxes based on the falsified income levels (if that is the case).

No accusations, just giving data and a heads up to any other readers who might be contemplating such a move. (As an HR Manager, I've seen & heard of all kinds of scams here)

:wink:

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Re. EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby Vek » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 11:56 am

Hi there to you both,

Thanks for the replies.

Well the obvious thing is that only one job is allowed; even if the consultancy on the side is contract based ie freelance. It would appear that if I wanted to look into these I can't do both, its only one or the other; stayed employed or go out and get an Entrepass or something like that, form my own pte ltd and get a pass based on that.

@SMS; thanks for your comments. No offence taken! Given your comments, theres probably no point in upgrading as it mightn't be granted anyway. The PEP did look appealing though as it means that you have more flexibility and if something were to happen, you wouldn't need to leave the country in a month. The flexibility was really what I was after.

Thanks

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Re: Re. EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 12:05 pm

Vek wrote:The PEP did look appealing though as it means that you have more flexibility and if something were to happen, you wouldn't need to leave the country in a month. The flexibility was really what I was after.

Thanks


And that is the reason why MOM is cracking down on a lot of things. The PEP is/was initially designed for those who where contemplating making Singapore their home and was designed as a stepping stone to PR. Previously PR was abused for the same reason. (as a free long term visa) Now the gahmen are aware of this so it's getting more and more rigid. Basically, expats are doing it to themselves. Anytime somebody abuses the system, it gets harder for the next guy.

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Re. EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby Vek » Fri, 12 Nov 2010 12:19 pm

Well loopholes will always be abused by some if its possible.

I can see why the policies are there though as frustrating as it is. Especially for those who really want to give Singapore a go with an intent to indeed stay here but need some degree of protection or peace of mind that they have ample time to find another job if something were to happen.

I'm also mythed that say one is in employment and decides to setup their own business; after careful consideration of course; they'd need to quit their job, make their EP void and reapply under their new company. Its okay if the new EP is approved, but if it isn't you've just left a job, started a company and suddenly have a month to leave; no excuses.

Anyway, thanks once again for your response :)

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Postby observer » Sat, 13 Nov 2010 11:37 am

Actually, you can. With the explicit written approval of the primary employer. For example, I know people who lecture in a universities part time.
It's common sense - if you try to come in before I go out, I can't go out. And you can't come in! Lose-lose!

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 13 Nov 2010 12:46 pm

observer wrote:Actually, you can. With the explicit written approval of the primary employer. For example, I know people who lecture in a universities part time.


Not if he's on an EP he can't, employers permission or not. It is not up to the employer at all. This is a codicil of working here on an EP. You are allowing to work for only ONE employer. If you try working part time elsewhere, there two thing you are guilty of. Evading taxes, as the 2nd employer cannot report your income, and you wont be reporting it either, and working in violation of the EP itself which very directly tells you that you can only work for a single employer at the employers place of business.

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Re: Re. EP - How many jobs can you have?

Postby ksl » Sat, 13 Nov 2010 1:57 pm

Vek wrote:Well loopholes will always be abused by some if its possible.

I can see why the policies are there though as frustrating as it is. Especially for those who really want to give Singapore a go with an intent to indeed stay here but need some degree of protection or peace of mind that they have ample time to find another job if something were to happen.

I'm also mythed that say one is in employment and decides to setup their own business; after careful consideration of course; they'd need to quit their job, make their EP void and reapply under their new company. Its okay if the new EP is approved, but if it isn't you've just left a job, started a company and suddenly have a month to leave; no excuses.

Anyway, thanks once again for your response :)


You can actually set up a company on EP and appoint a manager to run it. officially you are not allowed to be active in the company, while on EP, though few have built their company with local assistance and then when the EP runs out with present employer, they apply for EP in their own local Company and there is no need to pay the 50k capital, as you are not applying for the entrepass. The main point is you need to have a PR or Citizen appointed in your company, while you are employed by others. You cannot do 2 jobs officially and if caught will be punished.

Your company must not interfere with your present employment in anyway. You can oversee the Company and give instruction without being actively involved, you are not allowed on the Company premises, if caught you will be prosecuted for working two jobs automatically no excuse. You must toe the line of the regulations, one foot over and your out! After punishment that is.

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Postby Vek » Sun, 14 Nov 2010 10:18 pm

Many thanks for the comments again.

I think its pretty clear.

One job and one job only so if I'm on my EP, stay in my current job. If I find a new job then on the MOM site there are forms to declare this and have the EP changed over to the the new sponsoring firm.

I'm guessing the one thing i have to be careful about is to ensure the new employer is willing to also sponsor a DP for my partner which my current employer has done.

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Postby Vek » Mon, 15 Nov 2010 4:32 pm

Hi guys,

Just wanted to add a bit more to the conversation as I reported back to my employer on my research in combination with the replies on this forum. We agree that the right thing to do is obviously to follow the rules and policies put in place.

My employer sees value in having me do additional contract work but we change it so that it is through them ie the same company I have my EP with. This way we can attract additional revenue, I'm keeping in line with one EP tied to the same company and all is okay. It is a win win as both employee, company and the community can benefit from the expertise.

However my question is; in terms of project or consulting work; are there rules in place where say the company specialises in manufacturing of vehicles; do other revenue sources also have to belong to the same industry? ie if you're in manufacturing of vehicles and you have know how that can be suited to another industry; can you consult to them and collect revenue?

I hope my questions make sense?

Thanks in advance.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 15 Nov 2010 4:53 pm

That revenue stream would obviously have to agree with the stated trade/industry that is listed in the company's registration. Of course, that is his responsibility and not yours. Having said that, as long as your employer bills the client and and you are paid a salary and or commission from the employer and it's included on your IR8A at the end of the year, then their shouldn't be any problem with it.

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 15 Nov 2010 8:22 pm

Vek wrote:Hi guys,

Just wanted to add a bit more to the conversation as I reported back to my employer on my research in combination with the replies on this forum. We agree that the right thing to do is obviously to follow the rules and policies put in place.

My employer sees value in having me do additional contract work but we change it so that it is through them ie the same company I have my EP with. This way we can attract additional revenue, I'm keeping in line with one EP tied to the same company and all is okay. It is a win win as both employee, company and the community can benefit from the expertise.

However my question is; in terms of project or consulting work; are there rules in place where say the company specialises in manufacturing of vehicles; do other revenue sources also have to belong to the same industry? ie if you're in manufacturing of vehicles and you have know how that can be suited to another industry; can you consult to them and collect revenue?

I hope my questions make sense?

Thanks in advance.


It shouldn't make much difference and unless your accountant was asleep when the company was created, one of its trade codes will be 'general trading'.

I think the codings create an industry classification; it is hard to imagine how they would go about auditing to discover you are making money in another line of business.


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