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Want to work in Singapore - realistic? (8 yrs exp.)

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George_Ch
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Want to work in Singapore - realistic? (8 yrs exp.)

Postby George_Ch » Wed, 27 Oct 2010 9:12 pm

Dear all,

This is my first post on this forum (so, uh, hi!) and, I suppose, a fairly predictable one at that. I did honestly try to do research and read through some of the threads in the forum, but it seems they mostly deal with fresh university graduates.

I'm wondering if I'd have any chance of finding a job in Singapore in Marketing (with a specific emphasis on Online Marketing). I have eight years of work experience, of which six have been in marketing-related positions (four years running my own online marketing business, and two years as a digital marketing manager with a small financial service provider in Switzerland).

I speak fluent English and Russian, hold a dual Master in Management & Leadership / HRM (from the Swiss branch of an accredited American university, so it's a standard US MA degree, in other words). I'm 27 years old and hold Eastern European nationality (and, boy, did that ever make my life miserable!)

Given this profile - and given the field I'm interested in working in - how likely is it that companies in Singapore would even consider hiring me from overseas? I've been diligently sending out job applications, but haven't had any luck so far (so I'll admit I only started recently, and am not easily discouraged).

Lastly, let me just clarify that I'm not looking for this forum to single praises as to my qualifications or otherwise expect to hear what an invaluable asset I'd be to any organization (I've seen this accusation made a few times in similar threads); rather, I'm just asking for some honest feedback to help me shape my expectations.

Thanks a bunch in advance,
George

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Re: Want to work in Singapore - realistic? (8 yrs exp.)

Postby ksl » Wed, 27 Oct 2010 10:45 pm

George_Ch wrote:Dear all,

This is my first post on this forum (so, uh, hi!) and, I suppose, a fairly predictable one at that. I did honestly try to do research and read through some of the threads in the forum, but it seems they mostly deal with fresh university graduates.

I'm wondering if I'd have any chance of finding a job in Singapore in Marketing (with a specific emphasis on Online Marketing). I have eight years of work experience, of which six have been in marketing-related positions (four years running my own online marketing business, and two years as a digital marketing manager with a small financial service provider in Switzerland).

I speak fluent English and Russian, hold a dual Master in Management & Leadership / HRM (from the Swiss branch of an accredited American university, so it's a standard US MA degree, in other words). I'm 27 years old and hold Eastern European nationality (and, boy, did that ever make my life miserable!)

Given this profile - and given the field I'm interested in working in - how likely is it that companies in Singapore would even consider hiring me from overseas? I've been diligently sending out job applications, but haven't had any luck so far (so I'll admit I only started recently, and am not easily discouraged).

Lastly, let me just clarify that I'm not looking for this forum to single praises as to my qualifications or otherwise expect to hear what an invaluable asset I'd be to any organization (I've seen this accusation made a few times in similar threads); rather, I'm just asking for some honest feedback to help me shape my expectations.

Thanks a bunch in advance,
George


Online marketing is a skill in its own right and I'm pretty sure you can find work, though income maybe less than what you are used to, unless you can provided substantial returns, then you will be worth every penny, so you may need to negotiate your foot in the door, with a bonus system based on tangible results.

You may want to check this thread out too ftopic73618.html

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Postby beppi » Thu, 28 Oct 2010 9:49 am

You'd have to find an employer who wants you so badly that overcoming the obstacles of hiring a foreigner (read on the forum about this!) seems less of a burden than not having you (and hiring a similarly qualified local instead).
Not knowing the details of your skills and industry I cannot comment on how likely this is, but surely job ads (especially the 99% of them that say "only Singaporeans and PR need to apply") are not the way to go.
Good luck - you'll need it!

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Postby ksl » Fri, 29 Oct 2010 12:14 am

Seeing that you have been at it for 8 years, you must be able to forecast some results.

I'm self taught at online marketing, I started a freelance project of branding someones website and products, back in 2000.

Not knowing anything about online marketing at the time, and i had no intentions of paying anyone to do it, I recall it took me about 6 months to have significant feedback, the first 8 to 12 weeks was useless, as the bots take up to that period of time to list, if you are not paying for a listing.

I do know if you do not pay on some of the search engines, you never get listed at all.

However i was hitting my target market which was not consumers but B2B, within 18 months i had established 11 agents in different countries.

What I would like to ask you is, what is the normal or the average for generating a target audience without paying.

And what if you pay for add words and all the other advertising click throughs.

As I am really not convinced that google addwords is the way to go, I have held number 2 ranking position on google for a good 5 years, through choosing my domain carefully and also the keywords i use.

Though only last week I deleted my website to install a new flash website, and lost probably half of my backlinks, would this be a normal occurance? Though I have no back links on google at all, as i haven't even bothered promoting the website after i hit 2nd ranking on the main specific word search.

Yahoo on the other hand I have around 3500 backlinks. My website revenue worth dropped from 3.45 USD a day down to 1.75 because i haven't bothered to promote the website, which was a business strategy, rather than anything else.

My interest is also to advise other start ups more than anything, as i hate to see them throw good money away for clicks, that cannot be fully accounted for.

What is your honest opinion on clicks?

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Re: Want to work in Singapore - realistic? (8 yrs exp.)

Postby madura » Fri, 29 Oct 2010 10:58 am

George_Ch wrote:I'm wondering if I'd have any chance of finding a job in Singapore in Marketing (with a specific emphasis on Online Marketing). I have eight years of work experience, of which six have been in marketing-related positions (four years running my own online marketing business, and two years as a digital marketing manager with a small financial service provider in Switzerland).


That's a good combination - digital marketing + financial services. Are there jobs here? Yes. Would they be willing to hire someone from overseas? Yes.

The only problem I see here is (1) lack of knowledge of a regional language (2) many employers would not put much weight on your 4 years of running your own online marketing business. Essentially, they would see you as having only 2 years of relevant experience. I'm in no position to judge though, since you haven't provided any details on your online marketing business.

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Postby George_Ch » Fri, 29 Oct 2010 4:59 pm

Hi there,

Thanks a lot for your feedback; below please see some of my comments.

ksl wrote:I do know if you do not pay on some of the search engines, you never get listed at all.


I am not sure if, by getting listed, you mean having your PPC ads appear (in which case, yes, of course you have to pay) or simply appearing in search engine results (which you don't have to pay for - in fact, Google doesn't even offer you the option of making any such payment).

What I would like to ask you is, what is the normal or the average for generating a target audience without paying.


This depends on whether you're dealing with a B2B or a B2C market, and on whether there's sufficient opportunity for pull marketing (bear in mind that Google is essentially a pull marketing operation - the precondition for people typing in "boogey widgets for sale" is awareness that there's such a thing as "boogey widges" out there - and if your target customers aren't aware of such a product even existing, that severely limits your low-cost pull marketing options).

Assuming, however, that there's sufficient awareness, the "free" strategies I'd be looking at would be:

- Social media (direct communication with customers for B2C, or identifying and reaching out to decision makers in B2B)
- Forums (identifying where customers matching our profile would hang out based on their needs, and building a presence there)
- Viral marketing (only B2C, really - awareness best generated through YouTube and Facebook)
- SEM/SEO (individual pages built for specific keyphrases)

In general, in my experience - and particularly in B2B markets - the less awareness there is of your offering, the harder it is to do "free" marketing.

And what if you pay for add words and all the other advertising click throughs.

As I am really not convinced that google addwords is the way to go, I have held number 2 ranking position on google for a good 5 years, through choosing my domain carefully and also the keywords i use.


We have had a lot of success with Adwords, but then we also pay up to $3.50 CPC. It helps build awareness of the product and somewhat transcends the pull marketing bottleneck by allowing you to advertise on queries that are related to, but do not specifically describe, your own offering (you're basically gambling that someone interested in that would also be interested in what you have to offer). Also, through a combination of Google Analytics and correct website setup (e.g., a contact form instead of e-mail links, or a shopping cart), you are able to conduct empirical, scientific studies to determine which keywords convert and at what rate, helping you decide which keywords to axe and which to increase your bids on. Personally, I consider Adwords an integral part of an effective marketing campaign - especially in cases where you aren't the No. 1 result on Google.[/quote]

Though only last week I deleted my website to install a new flash website, and lost probably half of my backlinks, would this be a normal occurance? Though I have no back links on google at all, as i haven't even bothered promoting the website after i hit 2nd ranking on the main specific word search.

Yahoo on the other hand I have around 3500 backlinks. My website revenue worth dropped from 3.45 USD a day down to 1.75 because i haven't bothered to promote the website, which was a business strategy, rather than anything else.


If you have backlinks pointing to specific pages of your site, rather than a landing page (deep linking, as it is called in SEO), then it's plausible, as the backlinks would be linking to now non-existent pages (it would be a good idea to insert the redirect code that sends visitors who arrive at a 404 page to your main page).

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Re: Want to work in Singapore - realistic? (8 yrs exp.)

Postby George_Ch » Fri, 29 Oct 2010 5:04 pm

madura wrote:
George_Ch wrote:I'm wondering if I'd have any chance of finding a job in Singapore in Marketing (with a specific emphasis on Online Marketing). I have eight years of work experience, of which six have been in marketing-related positions (four years running my own online marketing business, and two years as a digital marketing manager with a small financial service provider in Switzerland).


That's a good combination - digital marketing + financial services. Are there jobs here? Yes. Would they be willing to hire someone from overseas? Yes.

The only problem I see here is (1) lack of knowledge of a regional language (2) many employers would not put much weight on your 4 years of running your own online marketing business. Essentially, they would see you as having only 2 years of relevant experience. I'm in no position to judge though, since you haven't provided any details on your online marketing business.


1. Yep, that's honestly something I'd work on if I did end up in Singapore (would be my No. 1 priority, actually).

2. This is a bit complicated. The problem with digital marketing is that all the guys (and gals) who are really good at it are mostly self-taught, because it's such a new field of marketing that many corporations are only now catching on to. Or, to put it another way, what the marketing departments of multinational companies are doing now, digital marketers such as myself were doing 5-6 years ago.

So, basically, when you look for people with corporate experience in digital marketing, more often than not, you'll get someone who may have worked on a digital project to do and pays lip service to the term "social media" - because everyone's talking about "social media" - but is miles behind in terms of knowledge and skill behind a self-taught digital marketer who's been at it for the past six years.

With that said, I do see your point, and that a lot depends on whether a recruitment agency would see things the same way.

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Postby ksl » Fri, 29 Oct 2010 8:07 pm

Thanks George _Ch for reinforcing my thoughts on these issues, I have them all covered.
- Social media (direct communication with customers for B2C, or identifying and reaching out to decision makers in B2B)
- Forums (identifying where customers matching our profile would hang out based on their needs, and building a presence there)
- Viral marketing (only B2C, really - awareness best generated through YouTube and Facebook)
- SEM/SEO (individual pages built for specific keyphrases)

Now this is interesting and i didn't expect such policy as paying more to get more though it does make sense, though I did wonder like on ebay, when these additional offers popped up, also Amazon and other B2C trading sites, how they was getting the spot light, so now I know.
We have had a lot of success with Adwords, but then we also pay up to $3.50 CPC.

Your information on the links was also very helpful too, I'll get that sorted but maybe a tedious task ugh.

I'm pretty sure you will be worth your weight in gold for many a business, and probably better off starting for yourself.

There is a shortage of quality SEO people here, as I know some people that believed paying was the way forward, though they have paid 300$ for a about 100 clicks a day and received no actual sales, so I suspect the quality is lacking in targeting.

Thanks I'm sure this is all very helpful to many on this forum.

After reading your reply above, I can say you have no worries providing you can convince them of your ability, that's why i said, contract plus a performance ability which is probably difficult but would prove your value.

I spent a great deal of my time on learning SEO optimisation and social marketing, for product launches and establishing agencies world wide, it pays big dividends just working on commission, so big that Companies don't like it when you are earning more than the CEO :wink:

Digital marketing means nothing to many people, its just warming up, though many curse the SMS's they get as spam, so much has yet to be done, to streamline the delivery process for a quality service.

But I am aiming to use the technology too for my own clients eventually and hope my website can be customised for delivery too for customer services.


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