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Ideal retirement locations

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maneo
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby maneo » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 1:29 pm

Brah wrote:One got bored and left after a year, the other lives in massive distrust and contempt of the locals. Both cases make me wonder, as much as I like the place (Phuket), that it might not be such a good idea.

Would not want to live in Phuket long term or any other popular tourist destination in Thailand for that matter.

When it's time for retirement being away from the exciting hustle and bustle of the city is good.
I know where I'd like to be (and already have a small condо there).
Won't say where, since it already has too many expats as it is, but at least they seem to be respectful long timers and not the sleazy farangs you hear about in Pattaya and Phuket.

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby ecureilx » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 2:54 pm

JR8, :)


Wd40 wrote:India is cheap to retire. I did some calculations. .


Small correction.. India is cheap to retire for Indians.

Even Sri Lankans of Indian origin have found out how expensive it is ..

And Indians who have lived elsewhere too long have been bled dry.

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Brah » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 3:24 pm

maneo wrote:
Brah wrote:One got bored and left after a year, the other lives in massive distrust and contempt of the locals. Both cases make me wonder, as much as I like the place (Phuket), that it might not be such a good idea.

Would not want to live in Phuket long term or any other popular tourist destination in Thailand for that matter.

When it's time for retirement being away from the exciting hustle and bustle of the city is good.
I know where I'd like to be (and already have a small condо there).
Won't say where, since it already has too many expats as it is, but at least they seem to be respectful long timers and not the sleazy farangs you hear about in Pattaya and Phuket.

Well, the major retirement spot there is Chiang Mai / Chiang Rai
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby JR8 » Sat, 19 Sep 2015 3:42 pm

Brah wrote:Some posting here are considering Thailand for retirement, and it is indeed a location growing in popularity for that.
I know of 2 separate couples who did this, at different life stages.
One got bored and left after a year, the other lives in massive distrust and contempt of the locals. Both cases make me wonder, as much as I like the place (Phuket), that it might not be such a good idea.


I know that it can be a minefield, I've seen people try various iterations with varying success. Combining the issues (your examples) that can come with retirement (example: boredom>depression), relo'ing to a new country+language barrier+different ways/laws, plus the risk of locals regarding you as mega-rich and hence ripe for the plucking: That adds up to a massive challenge, and right when you're expecting and wanting life to be feet-up and peachy. The other thing is that even if you consider it home, the 'people who could become your friends' might be transient and rather disinterested, something you can witness as an FT in SG too. That's when the local expat pub becomes your 3rd home... hehehe.

I think one way is like the 'snowbirds' in North America, retirees or semi-retirees flying south for the winter, often Florida. Easier than retiring abroad/x-language etc. I imagine that might segue later into full-time retirement at the 2nd home, by then all knowns being known - no nasty surprises.

I know two people who have permanently retired or semi-retired abroad. Both estate agents, in fact a) bought the business owned by b), b) moved to TH (by then with Thai wife plus children, who were born and raised through infancy in London). a) still in London retired 5-10 years later by then also w/Thai wife+children (a+b were good long-time friends too, so it's not the weird coincidence it might appear :)). b) is a born cool-as-ice wheeler-dealer so I've no doubt he's found a semi-retired niche to keep him mentally occupied. a) he and his wife having sold the London estate agency, used the proceeds to buy a small hotel in a Thai seaside destination (Phuket IIRC). About 2 years later he wrote an e-book on that entire experience. I recall it as being a blend of terrifying and hilarious... :) [that's despite him having a local wife (who is also his business partner)].

I know a 3rd person who tried to semi-retire abroad. Initially to Saint Maarten in the WI. Wonderful to visit but very incestuous since everyone who is non-native knows just about every other non-native on the island. The distance from the UK took a toll, so she upped and relo'd to Spain and set up a business there, somewhere around Marbella/Puerto Banus. That area esp PB is known as a playground for the super-rich (I don't know to what extent she knew this), with a lot of dirty money + the kind of characters that go together with that. She started and ran a livery stable there... probably a viable proposition in that area. But being as innocent/naive as she is, she ended up being shafted by someone she had some kind of business dealings with. Now perhaps 5 years later she's back in the UK, and has set up another livery stable. - Major home-ground advantage - she's a lot poorer as a result of her past ventures, but her life is waaay more stable too.
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby rajagainstthemachine » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 10:01 am

I can't see myself retiring from life anytime soon, but ready to quit working! And maybe start something new like a self run business and preferably in one of the mentioned retirement countries.
However what stops me is a fear of the unknown and the fear of failure.
I'll be honest and admit that.
Ideally I'd like to start a cafe with an emphasis in music where bands could come and play.
Something that would require minimal investment, that would bring me a small amount of money to subsist while parking my savings somewhere that would give me a decent return of money which I'd plough back into my daily needs of running this place.
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Wd40 » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 12:23 pm

I feel retirement location has to have some sort of connection with the home location. For example Australia is a great place for the Brits, lots of thing is common. Spain too since its part of Europe, is a great place for the British.

For Singaporeans, its Malaysia as there is lots of things in common. I am sure there are lot of such combinations where synergies exist.

I dont understand how come Thailand comes up a lot in these sort of discussions. Thailand was never colonised. So its kind of ironic, that westerners seem to think it is a top choice.

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Re: RE: Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 12:48 pm

Wd40 wrote:I dont understand how come Thailand comes up a lot in these sort of discussions. Thailand was never colonised. So its kind of ironic, that westerners seem to think it is a top choice.


Thailand is one of the top spots for retirement, not just for westerners but quite a few non westerners too, including a few Asians who found how painful retirement is, in their own country, especially when they have spent too much time away from their own mother land earning money elsewhere.

WD40, seem to Think ? Nope, its the truth.

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Wd40 » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 1:23 pm

With the Malaysian Ringgit tumbling and an upcoming property glut coming up there, I would watch Malaysia closely, for its MM2H program. In the next couple of years, I see awesome value in buying a MY property and retiring there.

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Re: RE: Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 2:26 pm

Wd40 wrote:With the Malaysian Ringgit tumbling and an upcoming property glut coming up there, I would watch Malaysia closely, for its MM2H program. In the next couple of years, I see awesome value in buying a MY property and retiring there.

If Umno doesn't continue their antics ..

Otherwise nobody would want to touch Malaysia even with a 10 foot barge pole.

Sorry again, for throwing cold water on your suggestion

Quite a few MM2H residents are getting jittery with the red shirt power.

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby JR8 » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 3:50 pm

@WD40
I think the common themes include language and places re: perhaps culture-wise, perceived value, climate, transparent land rights, functional infrastructure (incl air travel connectivity), where the individual retiree feels comfortable and secure, and where they can live a combination of their home and local cultures. It's worth repeating too that happy retirement usually expects/needs to 'go risk-off'. Living in a place that might soon have a military coup is not a risk that figures in peoples' plans. Most also won't aspire to be pioneering a new retirement destination on their own. Those few who do tend to know it very deeply already. If there is already an established community of people similar'ish like you, people who might help you set yourself up and later provide avenues into social activities then all the better.
So with that in mind:
- Australia. Depends on where 'home is', but it's a heck of a long way from Europe. I've enjoyed visiting it, but it still feels like the end of the world to me. How often might friends/family visit, and you them, when it's a 24hr flight? Younger people can endure that once or twice, to experience Australia, but it's not a pleasant way to start/end any holiday for anyone.
- Spain. Yep historically works well for many people. But there was a notorious land-grab some years back. Where a developer built hundreds of homes for retirees and some years later a court case was launched claiming he didn't have title to the land and all the homes (hundreds) had to be demolished. Added to which Spain has seen many time-share schemes, which generally come with a major trust-warning attached. Rightly or wrongly that fits within the stereotype view that things in the S.Europe countries can be pretty random at times. It might otherwise be an option that ticked most boxes for many people.
- France. An obvious choice for many, as long as you can deal with ‘French ways’. (IMHO/E) they can be pretty xenophobic, and the taxes are high. Also getting things done (example: internet connection) seems to run to a Mediterranean timescale. That’s based on a friend with deep family links to a village where he bought a lovely house, so his family are remembered and he is accepted as a historic part of the community. But heavens he faced some challenges, simple things like getting a 2nd phone line for internet, which took months/+ to arrange. The default position being ‘You can’t have two phone lines, why would you want that anyway?’. So there is an element of can’t-do that also reads across into other necessities of life. Lastly, French law is very different from UK law so that’s a pretty expensive hurdle.
- Malaysia. Love the place but wouldn't buy there. A lot of question marks with opaque land title, and how you can never buy freehold, hence you’re always answerable and at the whim of some ‘other master’. The government might have MM2H but I don't see any say established western retirement locations. Not Politically stable.
- Thailand. I can see why it used to work. Naturally friendly, stable, lovely climate, little or no taboo around pork and alcohol and so on, good value for money. Acceptably close to home that F+F would likely want to visit. But all the political uncertainty going on there right now has likely changed the equation for those considering it as a retirement or holiday-home destination.

I can’t see myself buying a retirement/holiday home abroad. It’s a nice idea but given some thought and testing it doesn’t add up for me. Say you spent 3-4 months a year there, you’re still going to have costs clocking up the rest of the year. Who’ll take care of it in your absence, that’s going to cost too? Unless you are going to live there permanently as your sole home it risks being veeery expensive. A bit like owning a yacht, superficially a wonderful thing to be able to do but the running/maintenance/boatyard storage etc costs are massive, and clocking up every week of the year. You need to be completely loaded to buy such a thing and use it only occasionally. Probably to the extent that the costs are of little or no consequence to you. IMO there is x-over between that and a 2nd/holiday home.


... for the time-being I'll stick with the notion that with all the $ I'll save not owning a 2nd place abroad, then for trips abroad I can afford to pay more to stay in nice hotels or even rent a holiday property for a period of time. The latter (say, renting a house somewhere for a month, or 2,3) would hopefully be possible without a lot of hassle of setting up a home there from scratch.
'Do it or do not do it: You will regret both' - Kierkegaard

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Brah » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 4:50 pm

JR8 wrote:
I know two people who have permanently retired or semi-retired abroad.....[one] wrote an e-book on that entire experience. I recall it as being a blend of terrifying and hilarious... :)

I bet that would be an interesting read
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby zzm9980 » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 5:39 pm

Brah wrote:
JR8 wrote:
I know two people who have permanently retired or semi-retired abroad.....[one] wrote an e-book on that entire experience. I recall it as being a blend of terrifying and hilarious... :)

I bet that would be an interesting read


Agreed. Link?

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby JR8 » Sun, 20 Sep 2015 7:45 pm

http://www.amazon.com/Riff-Raffles-Kevi ... B0048EK1AI

Riff-Raffles - Kindle Edition
by Kevin Meacher (Author)
Paperback
$13.99
4 Used from $10.00 7 New from $10.14
-----------------------------------------------------
'Have you ever dreamt of quitting your job and setting up a business in a tropical paradise, spending days lazing by the beach whilst the money comes rolling in? Most of us have had this dream at some time or the other but the reality can be alarmingly different.
We follow the hilarious trials and tribulations of Kevin, who turned the dream into a reality, leaving his life in England to run a small hotel in the Thailand holiday resort of Pattaya.
His story highlights the vast difference in cultures between East and West and shows the number of day-to-day problems that can be encountered. Whilst everything is viewed in a light- hearted and amusing manner, it is easy to see that the grass is not always as greener on the other side, as we may imagine.

p.s./add - The title 'Riff-Raffles' is a play on a) Raffles, an Englishman venturing forth into Asia, and b) 'Riff-raff' =>

'disreputable or undesirable people.
"I saw the sort of riff-raff that had been invited"
synonyms: rabble, scum, refuse, garbage, rubbish, trash, vermin, the lowest of the low, in the underclass, the dregs of society, good-for-nothings, undesirables'
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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Wd40 » Sat, 26 Sep 2015 7:24 pm

http://www.financialexpress.com/article ... is/132693/

Interesting venture by former Australian cricketer :)

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Re: Ideal retirement locations

Postby Primrose Hill » Mon, 28 Sep 2015 9:38 am

rajagainstthemachine wrote:some of the things to consider for retirement would be

1. safety

2. a peaceful serene atmosphere

3. access to good and cheap medical care

4. a bit of social life maybe?


This is key to us, especially no.3. I think it will be Europe eventually. But husband thinks that if we move back to Europe we will always be coming back to Asia for the warmth and sunshine whenever we can. We haven't made a wad of cash unlike JR8, I am thinking in 10years time, to work part-time, I wonder how feasible is that in my industry.


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