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US citizen who skipped out on NS

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M3Driven
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US citizen who skipped out on NS

Postby M3Driven » Wed, 01 Sep 2010 11:46 pm

Guys,

Here is the quick and short description of my situation and I would appreciate a quick and short answer if possible.

I was born in China, went to Singapore when I was 5 years old and got my Singapore citizenship and passport. I left Singapore at 12 years old and relocated to USA and haven't gone back since. My Singapore passport has been expired since 2003 and I do not plan on renewing it.

Now, I'm 23 years old and have been working for an international I-Bank for the past 2 years...I'm also a US citizen and hold a US passport...

If my company sends to Singapore for a short term work assignment, would I have any problems getting into and out of Singapore with my US passport?

If I want to do a leisure vacation to Singapore, would I have any problems getting into and out of Singapore with my US passport?

Many thanks!

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Postby M3Driven » Thu, 02 Sep 2010 12:06 am

I did a little light reading and it seems like there is a concept of a "Runner List" and my name might be on it if I did not change my name on my US passport...Also, my US passport makes no mention of Singapore anywhere...it does list China as my country of birth...

On my embankment papers, I would also state my hotel address as I do not have any kins in Singapore. This is surely not set off any red flag upon entry.

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Mad Scientist
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Postby Mad Scientist » Thu, 02 Sep 2010 2:05 am

Nope
The positive thinker sees the invisible, feels the intangible, and achieves the impossible.Yahoo !!!

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Postby Koalabear » Thu, 09 Sep 2010 11:02 pm

not a chance dude. The government has determined that your parents belonged to one of the most undesirable groups - ones that maximized social benefits and using Singapore as a stepping stone for greener pasture. The moment you land in Singapore, they will make a mockery out of you and inform your company to make a prime example for helicopter parents who are harboring the same intentions.

Stay out of Singapore unless you can find a reputable human trafficking firm.

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Postby Koalabear » Fri, 10 Sep 2010 7:21 am

oh there is another way to do it.

Change the birthdate on your passport, do a plastic surgery (focus on the nose, cheekbone and forehead) and burn off your thumb prints.

What you are suggesting is possible in the 80s but impossible in 2000, let alone now.

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sundaymorningstaple
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 10 Sep 2010 12:43 pm

The odds were probably in your favour as, unless they were having a slow day or a gap in arrival flights, they might not do a hard look. Having a China POB and a US Citizen passport would not initially draw any queries. It would depend on if they are using canned searches based on ethnicity, name & age with a crosscheck of "runners" then you name will surely pop up as you left after the age of 11 and most probably didn't apply for an exit permit either.

Of course, with the speed of mainframes today, they could conceivably do a search on ANY male who appears to be of a certain age and ethnicity and it probably wouldn't slow down the system appreciably as the list would be updated daily and it obviously wouldn't be that long either, so it could possibly send up a red flag "for further questioning". Therefodre, in the paraphrased words of Clint Eastwood in Dirty Harry........ Do you feel lucky?

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Postby Koalabear » Sat, 11 Sep 2010 12:27 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:The odds were probably in your favour as, unless they were having a slow day or a gap in arrival flights, they might not do a hard look. Having a China POB and a US Citizen passport would not initially draw any queries. It would depend on if they are using canned searches based on ethnicity, name & age with a crosscheck of "runners" then you name will surely pop up as you left after the age of 11 and most probably didn't apply for an exit permit either.

Of course, with the speed of mainframes today, they could conceivably do a search on ANY male who appears to be of a certain age and ethnicity and it probably wouldn't slow down the system appreciably as the list would be updated daily and it obviously wouldn't be that long either, so it could possibly send up a red flag "for further questioning". Therefodre, in the paraphrased words of Clint Eastwood in Dirty Harry........ Do you feel lucky?


Actually it is VERY EASY. Birth-Date match? -> yes Ok we have someone with the same birthdate as a defaulter lets see what he looks like -> Chinese? -> yes The largest ethnic race in Singapore! Lets ask where this guy is born -> born in same place as database? -> yes quietly press red button below counter while reassuring you everything is alright and take you to a private room for some kopi, thumb print matching and photo ID.
ALL MATCH? -> if yes, end of story.

There is less than 1% NS default rate every year. How long do you think the mainframe needs to cross check your birthdate with a list of less than 10000 dates?

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Asian_Geekette
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Postby Asian_Geekette » Sat, 11 Sep 2010 8:09 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote: Therefodre, in the paraphrased words of Clint Eastwood in Dirty Harry........ Do you feel lucky?


Hey, don't scare the young punk! :P He could get lucky and not be flagged when he first enters Singapore for his work assignment. But what about if he goes out to have a vacation in the nearby islands/countries? ;-) Lady Luck may not smile at him again when he comes back in.

<edited>

From what he wrote, the OP did not renounce his Singaporean citizenship. So from the eyes of the government, he is still a Singaporean citizen despite the fact that he holds a US passport. So what's the punishment if they catch an NS defaulter?
My business is not to remake myself, but make the absolute best out of what God made. -Robert Browning

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sundaymorningstaple
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 11 Sep 2010 11:26 pm

Jail, fine and still having to do NS as well after being released.

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Postby Koalabear » Sun, 12 Sep 2010 12:03 am

Its not about luck. Its not even 10000 dates to match. How many defaulters are 21 years of age now? Probably less than 100. The database just search for the year of birth and you have narrowed results to less than 100! How many of them are born on the same date? Maximum 10. How many are Chinese? Lets assume 7. How many are Chinese born in China with the same birthdate as the OP on defaulter's list? You know the answer.

We are trying to help him. If we wanna screw him we will just tell him that the sky is blue and everything is fine. Anyway its only a work assignment he can reject it. Not like he will lose his job or anything but he has to wait longer for promotion since the action is all in Asia.

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Postby Mad Scientist » Sun, 12 Sep 2010 9:59 am

As I said before and I state it again. if OP has said what he has said, you'll be alright .
The positive thinker sees the invisible, feels the intangible, and achieves the impossible.Yahoo !!!


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