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leona123
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Postby leona123 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 3:30 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:
leona123 wrote:If memory proves me right, the Japs(not derogatory) outwitted the Brits. They came in through the causeway and through the jungles in bicycles when the Brits thought that they would be attacking another place.


Everything else aside, this is correct. The Brits assumed an invasion from the south and were not permitted by their superiors to turn the guns to the north when the invasion started.

Head out to Labrador Park and see the old gun emplacements and read about it.

PS: 'Japs' is derogatory.


Thanks for the correction. Though important, history was never my favourite subject(which I think is obvious). However, this thread as sort of kindled an interest in it.

I hate using derogative terms against citizens and the use of Japs was out of ignorance and nothing else. I won't use it anymore.

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Postby leona123 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 3:35 pm

JayCee wrote:
leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'


Do you also call people from Pakistan 'Pakis'?


Until now, YES! But after a brief reading on the internet, no.

anneteoh

Postby anneteoh » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 4:38 pm

JayCee wrote:
leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'


Do you also call people from Pakistan 'Pakis'?


On this cold, damp, dark and misty Uk morning, the heat in this thread is almost inviting so yes, I concede that for whatever reason, some people consider the abbreviation Jap derogatory; but I didn't mean it that way much as the soldiers deserved it for their atrocities in WW2. Like the Jews, I think we should remember the Japanese war crimes in SE Asia and China. However, I lost a full post and would be quite happy referring to Brits, Japs, Kiwis, Aussies, even commies which is also derogatory but I think I used the full terminology except for the slip.

Leona123, this is basically a Western media perception. Perhaps when people say Jap, it's within the WW2 context.
I don't think Pakis, Japs, Swede, Jerry, etc should be regarded as derogatory anymore, esp for emails and forum posts.
The Brits like to contract long words - as do S'poreans -hence out SATs, GCSEs, MPs and your ERPs and a list of others I've now forgotten.
I like that - desyllable-ize. The same idea goes for Singlish, doesn't it ?

Why spik long sentence when you can just say "Can do, No can do. Aiyah... Too complicated lah" or translated 'Lu kong ha mi?' to "What say you?"
Not much difference here , except for the drop tones.
But it can get annoying :-
* when you say "Oh, its duck here." when you mean "Oh, it's dark here!"
* when all Europeans are "Angmo" or worse, "Angmokui"
* it's badtime
* where's my beg
* this crap is full of shall ( we get different semantics here )

There're similarties and differences - it'll be fun to point them out.

My grandchildren, being Swedish English bilinguals always, say ," I want to come with" or, " Are you coming with?" To my surprise, I hear that coming up in 'middle' places and on the tv too! It's one of the latest in thing, making the new vocabulary listed by BBC such as 'chav and bling' dictionary words now.

Language is dynamic and not static and the language people speak becomes acceptable as the norm.
Last edited by anneteoh on Thu, 11 Nov 2010 4:55 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Postby nakatago » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 4:49 pm

@anneteoh: I find that ironic, coming from you :wink: :P :D

anneteoh

Postby anneteoh » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:06 pm

vbelle wrote:
poodlek wrote:
:D I enjoyed that definition of Caucasian. I was also amused to learn once upon a time that the term "Aryan race" as applied to the blond-haired, blue-eyed and proud types is a misnomer. Aryans are actually northern Indian/Persian types.


They're all Aryans.

I thought north Indians are mix of Aryan n Dravida? no?

No. The Southern Indians predated the Northern Indians by quite a long stretch of time. They 're the Dravidians and their Maharappa cultual site was excavated and studied. That proved their earlier existence. Are you acquainted with the Out of Africa anthropological discoveries?

Long discussion/arguments on singlish...its uniquely singapore..let it be..

Don't worry, the S'poreans need to speak up and show, like Leona123 did, that they're not dumbed down contrary to the concensus among some expats. In fact, the world will benefit when the whole of China opens up to throw their gauntlets down with SMS and everyone who likes a banter or a serious discusssion. Much as I'm being disillusioned by democratic governing as the best system of running a country, it's good to break down national barriers.

i enjoyed laughing when a friend of mine came visiting last weekend..never been to singapore before, got on a taxi..with a driver
whom she claim to be..already weird by talking to himself while driving..

My friend: To Sims ville
Driver: Sims Ville ah?
My friend: no, sims ville
Driver: Sims Ville ah?
My friend: Sims ville
Driver: yes, sims ville ah?

My friend walking with me entering the apartment building and reading the name: i dont understand why he insisted the name is Sims Villa...See! its Sims Ville!


You could explain to him their different meanings - afterall, they're French and Spanish derived words; unless he's talking about a townhouse. lol
Last edited by anneteoh on Thu, 11 Nov 2010 6:09 pm, edited 3 times in total.

anneteoh

Postby anneteoh » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:25 pm

teck21 wrote:
ksl wrote:The British did leave us to fend for ourselves during the Japanese Occupation...


Quite simply, they did actually, knowing they were stretched by Germany enough that they didn't have the resources to put up any kind of fight in SE Asia against the Japanese.

That said, the conduct of Britain in Asia throughout the rest of WWII was in fact reprehensible (by today's moral zeitgeist of course) for everything they did (or in fact didn't do) was an attempt at preserving empire when Japan was defeated.

You can't blame all of them, though for Penang, I'd say, it was an embarrassing and disgusting getaway. However, some British, in the civil and military, did stay back and tried to fight back from the jungles or even in prisons all over Malaysia. I think they could not foresee the sheer ambitions, not to say, monstrous savagery, of the enemies.
They did right to return - to get things back to order instead of leaving a chaotic mess - and eventually to succumb to the native demands for independence.
But I do agree that the top commanders giving their orders from the UK were inept and should be held to be totally blameworthy.


A job to be left to the Americans entirely of course.

Unnecessary.

But all of this has nothing to do with how Singaporeans speak English. :shock:


Well, it paved the way.
Last edited by anneteoh on Thu, 11 Nov 2010 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby JR8 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:29 pm

leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'



Using the term Jap is derogatory. I'd go further and say it is hateful, and disdainful.

I've seen both sides of the coin. As a child growing up in Britain laughing at friends of my parents who could only afford the early Japananese cars arriving in Europe at that time. 'Jap-crap' as we referred to them.

And then working in Japan in the 90's, and seeing what a fantastic and kind people they are. After I left, I recall hearing people using the term Jap, as almost like getting a physical poke, that was how much it stunned and, er, disappointed me. Perhaps like hearing someone call a black person a wog.

Would you call a Japananese person a Jap to their face?

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Postby JR8 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:37 pm

leona123 wrote:
JayCee wrote:
leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'


Do you also call people from Pakistan 'Pakis'?


Until now, YES! But after a brief reading on the internet, no.



Good grief! So much to learn eh teach? Are you very young...

And to think Anne was going 'all funny' at me for saying cina, which is of course simply the Malay word for a Chinese person :)

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Postby Strong Eagle » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:43 pm

Jap = Kike = Wop = Spic = Hun = Slopehead = Slanteye = Goyum = Raghead = Chink = Coon = Frog = Greaser = <the>

All designed to dehumanize those that are not like us.

anneteoh

Postby anneteoh » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:47 pm

leona123 wrote:
anneteoh wrote:I really enjoyed myself and did outstandingly well, er, excuse the immodesty. I won 3 awards. I should have stuck it out.

Why am I not surprised 8-)


Ahh...sweet camaraderie. You're doing amazingly well to be so dedicated , and have time for the forum. I'm sorry I don't remember much regarding the exact details about SG in WW2 , but no doubt I'll be working on that some time in the future. Have a great day - aren't the kids so adorable in SG?

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Postby leona123 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:49 pm

JR8 wrote:
leona123 wrote:
JayCee wrote:
leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'


Do you also call people from Pakistan 'Pakis'?


Until now, YES! But after a brief reading on the internet, no.



Good grief! So much to learn eh teach? Are you very young...

And to think Anne was going 'all funny' at me for saying cina, which is of course simply the Malay word for a Chinese person :)


You don't sound very much older eh matured either.

Firstly, I don't teach history. And not everyone knows everything in the world.

Secondly, Cina is not short for Chinese. In Singaporean context, it IS derogatory!
Forgot to add: Depending on the context it is used.
Last edited by leona123 on Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby leona123 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 5:52 pm

anneteoh wrote:
leona123 wrote:
anneteoh wrote:I really enjoyed myself and did outstandingly well, er, excuse the immodesty. I won 3 awards. I should have stuck it out.

Why am I not surprised 8-)


Ahh...sweet camaraderie. You're doing amazingly well to be so dedicated , and have time for the forum. I'm sorry I don't remember much regarding the exact details about SG in WW2 , but no doubt I'll be working on that some time in the future. Have a great day - aren't the kids so adorable in SG?


Exams over with just another 1 more week before term ends. I won't be seeing my adorable kids next year (moving to another class). Sad :(.

BTW, teaching awards are not easily given out. So, you must have made quite a contribution to get THREE AWARDS! You received an OCA?

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Postby JR8 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 6:05 pm

leona123 wrote:
JR8 wrote:
leona123 wrote:
JayCee wrote:
leona123 wrote:SMS,
Jap (ouch -- talk about a derogatory term!)

When did 'Jap' become derogatory? It is just short for Japanese, at least to me! 'Aiyoh!!!'


Do you also call people from Pakistan 'Pakis'?


Until now, YES! But after a brief reading on the internet, no.


Good grief! So much to learn eh teach? Are you very young...

And to think Anne was going 'all funny' at me for saying cina, which is of course simply the Malay word for a Chinese person :)


You don't sound very much older eh matured either.

Firstly, I don't teach history. And not everyone knows everything in the world.

Secondly, Cina is not short for Chinese. In Singaporean context, it IS derogatory!
Forgot to add: Depending on the context it is used.


Your use of offensive names for races is nothing to do with what you teach. I didn't suggest that.

No cina 'is not short' for anything you are right. Rather it is the Malay word for China. Or a person from China. If I wanted an intentionally offensive term I would say bukit, but at least I understand the connotations and offensiveness of that term.

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Postby JR8 » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 6:21 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:http://wherebearsroamfree.blogspot.com/2010/04/race-discrimination-in-singapore-who.html



Wah, getting used to the stone-walling denial approach now :wink:

anneteoh

Postby anneteoh » Thu, 11 Nov 2010 6:38 pm

JR8 wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:http://wherebearsroamfree.blogspot.com/2010/04/race-discrimination-in-singapore-who.html



Wah, getting used to the stone-walling denial approach now :wink:


Yes, imagine the Great Wall.
In the context of what you said i.e. how you said it, it was a racist jibe. Jacques Derrida would agree with me.
So be a gentleman and confess if you want true cyber friends.
No charming winks will succour thy betrayal of the universalhood.


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