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PR and NS woes

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Postby Saint » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 11:43 am

wongkw wrote:But would they really bar an ex-PR from entering Singapore as a visitor? Even if not on a SVP? :?


You wont be an ex-PR until you have full filled your NS obligations.

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Postby wongkw » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 11:47 am

Saint wrote:
wongkw wrote:But would they really bar an ex-PR from entering Singapore as a visitor? Even if not on a SVP? :?


You wont be an ex-PR until you have full filled your NS obligations.

If you renounce your PR, you are no longer a PR. Hence, you no longer need to fullfill NS obligations. I understand that this will have an adverse effect on any future bearings on working and living in Singapore.

I know of some cases of people who renounced their PR at 17/18 successfully to legally avoid NS, and being able to return to Singapore for visits.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 12:29 pm

You are incorrect. You might renounce your PR, but the government will not accept that it has been renounced UNTIL you have finished your NS obligation, unless you follow ALL the protocols that have been outlined in these various threads here for the past couple years. Don't follow them to the "T"? You will be considered a deserter and the government will most certainly keep your name flagged as well as your passport (they already have your name, FIN and other information about you anyway if you are a PR - most was given during the years you were in government schools). So, as Dirty Harry said... "Do you feel lucky?"

The key word in your last paragraph was 'successfully'. This means their parents followed the proper protocols prior to that point when they renounced. Big difference.

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Postby Saint » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 12:34 pm

wongkw wrote:
Saint wrote:
wongkw wrote:But would they really bar an ex-PR from entering Singapore as a visitor? Even if not on a SVP? :?


You wont be an ex-PR until you have full filled your NS obligations.

If you renounce your PR, you are no longer a PR. Hence, you no longer need to fullfill NS obligations. I understand that this will have an adverse effect on any future bearings on working and living in Singapore.

I know of some cases of people who renounced their PR at 17/18 successfully to legally avoid NS, and being able to return to Singapore for visits.


Well there you go, you have all the answers already and all so easy and nothing to worry about.

Look forward to that first trip back to Singapore once you've reached NS age :cool:

I'm assuming you still have family who are also PR staying in Singapore? Be interesting what happens when their REP comes up for renewal!

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Postby wongkw » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 12:55 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:You are incorrect. You might renounce your PR, but the government will not accept that it has been renounced UNTIL you have finished your NS obligation, unless you follow ALL the protocols that have been outlined in these various threads here for the past couple years. Don't follow them to the "T"? You will be considered a deserter and the government will most certainly keep your name flagged as well as your passport (they already have your name, FIN and other information about you anyway if you are a PR - most was given during the years you were in government schools). So, as Dirty Harry said... "Do you feel lucky?"

The key word in your last paragraph was 'successfully'. This means their parents followed the proper protocols prior to that point when they renounced. Big difference.

My understanding of the matter is that when you go to ICA to renounce your PR, ICA has to give approval for the renunciation. This approval is done by a letter, which certifies that you are no longer a PR of Singapore. Seeing as this letter is issued by an official government agency, it means you are no longer a PR of Singapore. If they deny permission for you to renounce, then yes, that's another story.

The cases I've heard are not much different from mine. They renounced just before they were enlisted, meaning after the medical check up at 16.5 years old. And they are enrolled in government JCs at the time of renunciation.

Well there you go, you have all the answers already and all so easy and nothing to worry about.

Look forward to that first trip back to Singapore once you've reached NS age :cool:

I'm assuming you still have family who are also PR staying in Singapore? Be interesting what happens when their REP comes up for renewal!

I'm not sure if the first and second part were sarcasm or not. There's a lot of conflicting answers.

Yes, I do have family still living in Singapore as SPRs. Their REP is up for renewal soon, though (within the next year). Not going to go any further.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 3:31 pm

If you are happy with your understanding of the rules, so be it. Why are you here then? You seem to know more than all of our collected wisdom of many years at your tender age of 15. May the force be with you. You're gonna need it. I'm outta here.

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Postby wongkw » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 4:12 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:If you are happy with your understanding of the rules, so be it. Why are you here then? You seem to know more than all of our collected wisdom of many years at your tender age of 15. May the force be with you. You're gonna need it. I'm outta here.

I'm not claiming to be correct. However, my previous post was based on what I know from official procedure. I know that this forum does not give official advice, the ICA would be best for that. Although it's not official, I've heard the stories of many who renounced PR at 17/18 and come back as visitors, without any issues.

I have read many times the procedures on the board for renouncing citizenship. Hardly anything about SPR except being able to renounce at any time.

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Postby Plavt » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 11:11 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
Singapore as used Photo Recognition software successfully for several years now at immigration already (having picked up numerous Filippina's returning with "new" passports) from what I've been told.



What you have been told and what the actual situation is may well turn out to be two different things. Infra-red sensors and body scanners are hardly new technology if you think about it, remote controls and X-rays have been around for years! Although I would agree most would not know what goes on behind the scenes you may well find the methods employed for tracking people such as those mentioned are a good deal simpler than you think.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 05 Jul 2010 11:39 pm

Slip of the keyboard. I actually read it in the local birdcage liner sometime last year. So, it not as simple as you make it out to be. In fact, in the same article, it was inferred that it was either developed jointly with Australia or Australia wanted to use it and try to develop it further.

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Postby Plavt » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 12:07 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote: In fact, in the same article, it was inferred that it was either developed jointly with Australia or Australia wanted to use it and try to develop it further.


Inferred does not give you much if any evidence and since it was posted in the national 'rag' how reliable is that? I have read more than one article by Singaporean journalists that were way off the mark as journalists so often are elsewhere and may well be practising sensationalism as usual. Consider this: somebody sends you a file via the Internet, what's the best way of confirming the sender is who he/she says they are?

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 6:54 am

Don't know. Who are you? :P

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Postby Mad Scientist » Thu, 08 Jul 2010 3:11 pm

wongkw wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:If you are happy with your understanding of the rules, so be it. Why are you here then? You seem to know more than all of our collected wisdom of many years at your tender age of 15. May the force be with you. You're gonna need it. I'm outta here.

I'm not claiming to be correct. However, my previous post was based on what I know from official procedure. I know that this forum does not give official advice, the ICA would be best for that. Although it's not official, I've heard the stories of many who renounced PR at 17/18 and come back as visitors, without any issues.

I have read many times the procedures on the board for renouncing citizenship. Hardly anything about SPR except being able to renounce at any time.


This is bullshit.
Read this and the one that is in bold. Taken out from circulation

Once you renounce your Singapore citizenship, you will be treated like any other foreigner and any application for immigration facilities, including Singapore citizenship, will be considered on its own merits under the prevailing rules and regulations. To be able to work or study in Singapore you will need a valid work pass and student's pass. Applications for these passes will be treated like any other application and will be considered on their own merits. Being an ex-Singapore citizen has no standing in these matters and there is no assurance that you will be allowed to enter Singapore. If you are granted PR or citizen status again, please note that you will have to refund the amount withdrawn from your CPF Account at the time of renunciation, along with interest rate accruals.

If border control allows one to enter SG it will depends on its individual merit. This is the guideline and I based on this rather than hearsay
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 08 Jul 2010 7:06 pm

MS, the guy is a PR not a SG'er

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Postby Mad Scientist » Fri, 09 Jul 2010 11:39 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:MS, the guy is a PR not a SG'er


SMS, I know he is a SPR. I post the wrong one for that fact. I did a few times post this but I cannot find it or cannot recall who I post it for.
I am getting a internal circulation for that effect .
I am pretty sure that this banned is up and running. I will wait and get the facts right.
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Re: PR and NS woes

Postby JR8 » Fri, 09 Jul 2010 3:47 pm

[quote="Koalabear"]How does gahmen prevent quitters from transit in Singapore when they do not even go through singapore customs?[/quote


Ironic isn't it, barring people, when the gubment also have a whole department (Contact Singapore) roving the world almost begging quitters to return.

p.s. I'd like to compliment the original poster on his excellent English


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