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"inconsistent information" - reason for EP rejection

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amarettoSour
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"inconsistent information" - reason for EP rejecti

Postby amarettoSour » Tue, 01 Jun 2010 11:55 am

so my EP has been rejected, and MOM cited "inconsistent information" as the reason saying that my current employer submitted different details than what I put on my new application.. which doesn't really make sense to me because i literally copied down exactly what i put when i applied for my EP back in november. The only thing I added was my new experience with my current employer and my current FIN number.

MOM of course does not want to specify what information was inconsistent.

I have the right qualifications (graduated from a well known university from the united states with relevant degree) and have been approved for an EP before. My new job will be very similar to my current one, and the new company is well established.

I guess the only inconsistency i can think of is that my current employer transferred my EP over from a sub company to their main company back in Feb. I didn't list that in my application since i'm still basically under the same company.

Anyway, my company has appealed, but I'm not quite sure what my chances are.. has anyone encountered something like this? is there any possibility MOM will tell me what the inconsistency is so i can rectify it?

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Postby revhappy » Wed, 02 Jun 2010 2:35 pm

If you have already quit your current job then I really feel sorry for you, but then why are you planning to switch in just 6 months? Maybe others reading this should take it as a lesson and not do a kangaroo until they complete like couple of years and have a PR

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Postby amarettoSour » Thu, 03 Jun 2010 9:25 am

well, actually, i know 2 other people (with the same age and experience as me) who quit their jobs after only 4 months and 6 months. they both got their EP approved so I think I was just unlucky.

if you believe it would be better for your career to move on to another job, even after just a couple months, why wouldn't you?

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Postby Saint » Thu, 03 Jun 2010 9:43 am

amarettoSour wrote:
if you believe it would be better for your career to move on to another job, even after just a couple months, why wouldn't you?


Your totally in your rights to but does give us decent Expats a bad name amongst the local workforce and companies. To be honest, I think you got what you deserved

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Postby revhappy » Thu, 03 Jun 2010 10:40 am

amarettoSour wrote:if you believe it would be better for your career to move on to another job, even after just a couple months, why wouldn't you?


Its funny You are asking this question. The exact reason, why I wouldn't is to avoid a situation like you are into. You should always hope for the best but be prepared for the worst. You visa was rejected on the 1st attempt earlier as well right? This is the second time it is happening to you and still you havent learnt? :shock:

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Postby amarettoSour » Thu, 03 Jun 2010 10:59 am

Saint wrote:Your totally in your rights to but does give us decent Expats a bad name amongst the local workforce and companies. To be honest, I think you got what you deserved


you're probably thinking i left and screwed over my current company, but that's not the case. i left on good terms, gave them plenty notice time (even told them before i signed with my new job) and did not violate any contracts as i was hired on full-time basis. i'm also still on good terms with all of my coworkers and supervisors.

my previous EP was rejected due to a mistake (mine). we resubmitted and it was approved within a week.

i know you guys are probably used to dishonest people, but that's really not the case here.

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Postby Vaucluse » Thu, 03 Jun 2010 12:05 pm

revhappy wrote:If you have already quit your current job then I really feel sorry for you, but then why are you planning to switch in just 6 months? Maybe others reading this should take it as a lesson and not do a kangaroo until they complete like couple of years and have a PR


Indeed, it smacks of instant-gratification and entitlement as is seen so often now . . .
......................................................

'nuff said Image

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Postby amarettoSour » Thu, 01 Jul 2010 1:09 pm

well, thanks for no help to the people who replied above, but my EP was approved today.

for anyone else going through the appeal process, here's my experience:

it took very long for the appeal to get approved and a whole lot of effort from my HR. took about 3.5 weeks in my case - submitted appeal June 4, result finally came out today.

we found out my EP was not rejected due to "inconsistent information" (not sure why they even used this reason in the first place), but because they wanted my company to justify hiring me over locals, which makes more sense. thankfully my HR was awesome at what she does. she met up with MOM officer a few times, answered their questions, submitted requested documents, keep trying to convince them to get my EP approved and i really think if it wasn't for her, it wouldn't be.

I'm not sure if I can offer any more help as we know each case is different. It has been harder to get EPs approved as your qualification alone wouldn't guarantee approvals anymore, but if you think you're doing the right thing then don't lose hope.

Also if anyone is thinking about switching jobs, please do refer to SMS' advice on my previous thread. Obviously I was aware of all these risk before I decided to switch job and I took it anyway. thankfully it paid off THIS TIME, but i definitely wouldn't switch jobs so soon anymore unless absolutely necessary!

I also know another guy who just got his appeal approved after 3.5 weeks, although i'm not sure what his reason for rejection was, but like it's been said so many times, each case differs from another.

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Postby revhappy » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 11:12 am

I dont think the reason for your initial rejection was due to "Lack of justification" to hire you over the locals. If you from the field of IT or any niche field like you appear to be, you shouldnt have any problem getting your EP approved in 2 days flat.

Clearly they want to teach people like you, a lesson and so made you wait for 3.5 weeks. But the good thing is that you have finally learnt your lesson. :)

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 11:28 am

revhappy, I don't think that you will find that MOM is vindictive. Clearly, you still haven't learned a couple of things about government agencies here. They still, especially in the IT fields, have to justify it as they are pumping out people here left and right. Additionally, when it comes to IT, technology is changing so fast that obviously the people at MOM won't be able to understand the changes and niches. So, to them, there are inconsistencies and they need to see why a foreigner needs to be hired. But as I reiterated before, with the general tightening up, it's not a good time to jump jobs if you don't have to. Obviously the new company's HR was up to scratch on her job.

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"entitlement"

Postby chococat » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 8:48 pm

don't worry amarettos...

these people (posters who responded with a "shame on you") must be pretty old school in their thinking.

In the 80s-90s the estimate* was that up to 10 job changes was not unusual, but for career changes the number was around 5 (between ages 18 and 55.)

The current mindset* is that it's not unusual for someone to switch jobs every few years. I have held 5 diff jobs he past 9 years--all with the same employer, but in 3 distinctly different departments.

If you left amicably, then there must have been reasons for the switch. it's no one's business but yours. and theirs. and MOMs, but only somewhat. (I guess it's the business version of consenting adults..in the privacy of their own bed-- I mean BOARD room. hahahaha. sorry.)

I wouldn't be surprised, actually, if all hasty employment changes were automatically stamped with an "investigate further" just to give them a extra time to peruse the file and scrutinize every detail. (Don't want no shifties slipping by!)

Since they ultimately approved it, they are not punishing you for the choices you make in your life[/u]!

* this is a subject in which trends in societies' attitudes are more measurable than statistics, don't you think?
Last edited by chococat on Tue, 06 Jul 2010 10:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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"shame on you" (for career stepping stones?)

Postby chococat » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 10:02 pm

Two things...

1. This raises some questions:
Are frequent or numerous job/career changes good or bad? Are they good/bad for employees? businesses? staff morale? creative problem solving? Are they perceived differently in different fields?

SEE...! there are so many variables here, so many unknowns, so much vagueness in the terminology! How many separate scientific experiments/studies would you need just get get a general idea of the issues?

Even if there were, something as broad/varying as career choices is only worth worrying about insofar as how your future potential employer will view it. If you switch a lot, you probably will want to work in more progressive/less traditional environments anyway, right?

2.
Think about it...

How does a variety of former work-experiences make you:
a. a jack of all trades, but master of none
b. someone with a unique perspective and broad knowledge-base.
c. someone who is flexible and focused; not fazed by change; "hits the ground running."
d. a versatile employee, who could do several of the jobs under the one company's roof...someone who can fill in for others when they are too busy with something of a higher priority.

What does a brief stint in one position show? (Let's say you left the new job for the dream job.)
a. you are lazy, careless, and uncommitted.
b. you pursue your dreams; you're passionate and
c. you show courage by taking risks--great things can only happen when you take a risk.

(and yes, I'm aware that I'm playing devil's advocate here. These are hypothetical, and I most definitely know the issue is not as simple as this!)


end of my tirade...

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 06 Jul 2010 10:32 pm

chococat, you're not playing devil's advocat nor is it a tirade. It's just verbal diarrhea from someone who thinks they know how MOM and ICA operate. Nothing more. Nobody CARES how many jobs you have during a career. MOM doesn't either. However, they do care about unemployed Singaporeans as that is their first priority. You really don't have a clue do you. :roll:

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what are you talking about, sundaymorny?

Postby chococat » Wed, 07 Jul 2010 3:14 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:chococat, you're not playing devil's advocat nor is it a tirade. It's just verbal diarrhea from someone who thinks they know how MOM and ICA operate. :roll:



First

huh?
Where did you get the idea I was describing MOM/ICA? I neither know nor care how they operate. My tirade* of a response was directed at the 3 individuals who belittled AmarettoSour's character, despite knowing very few details about the situation.

Is there anything ambiguous in my opening sentence, here?
don't worry, amarettos...these people (posters who responded with a "shame on you") must be pretty old-school in their thinking.

*Perhaps tirade is too harsh a word for my rant, as there is no obvious tone of anger. There's definitely some now, though!
Last edited by chococat on Wed, 07 Jul 2010 4:50 am, edited 2 times in total.

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and...this

Postby chococat » Wed, 07 Jul 2010 3:49 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:... Nobody CARES how many jobs you have during a career... :roll:


Second

You're wrong about that, sundrymorningstar.

It seems at least 3 people care...or care enough to admonish an anonymous adult for his career choices--knowing nothing of his professional history, field of expertise, or the reason for his unusually short tenure with the first employer.

Or am I misinterpreting these quotations from Revhappy, Vaucluse and Saint...
"This is the second time it is happening to you and still you havent learnt?"
"Clearly they want to teach people like you a lesson and so made you wait"
"it smacks of instant-gratification and entitlement as is seen so often now"
"[it] does give us decent Expats a bad name amongst the local workforce and companies. To be honest, I think you got what you deserved"

Certainly unstable people often make erratic employment choices...
But to assume this person must be deplorable because this situation doesn't follow a set of nebulous, outdated moral criteria is an egregious oversimplification. (It's also idiotic and mean-spirited.)

You say MOM doesn't care how many jobs you have, how long you stay with each employer--and that was my understanding as well. I am surprised you didn't see that you agree with me. Or am I misreading "MOM doesn't [care] either"?

(Someone is worried amarettoSour is the one "giving us a bad name"? i lol'd at that one!)


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