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Confused re. career search - all advice much appreciated!

Discuss about getting a well paid job or career advancement. Ask about salaries, expat packages, CPF & taxes for expatriate.

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$Pripps
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Postby $Pripps » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 10:45 am

I've had a few bad experiences with recruiters here as well, at one point some years back I was tasked to put together a team of developers. You cannot believe the number of useless CVs and candidates I had to go through despite the fact I had told them very explicit what I wanted. It was much as SMS said, they threw us a bunch of CVs and hope for the best. We would even get candidates where the recruiter had faked skills on the CVs for candidate in the hope we would hire the person before getting found out.

That said I think the best way to get a job here is just to avoid the recruitment firms altogether and apply directly to the firm you want to work for, preferably by writing on real paper to make it standout and not look like just another junk mail.
Everybody already knows what it is, so there's not much point in saying it - Simpsons

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Postby Splatted » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 7:41 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:Then, step back. Unemployment is high in Singapore. Times are tough. But, looking at the number of job listings one could only conclude that things are absolutely gang busters.

Only conclusion: Fake jobs. If you do sign up and apply, it will be the rare response you get.


Now you've got me worried :X

I actually met up with one agency who told me one chain had around 40 vacancies. I went to their office and filled out application forms and everything and was interviewed by their recruiters.

They then called me a couple hours after I left to tell me this particular chain wanted to interview me and that they would call me to interview me this week, as I am leaving next week for Australia.

Obviously if there's a job offer, I'll relocate to Singapore again.

So far no calls. Was this yet another agency pretending it's listings are real?

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Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 10:24 pm

Splatted wrote:Was this yet another agency pretending it's listings are real?


All I can say is that I am subscribed to jobsdb and monster in the hopes of drumming up business for my company. Between them I see between 10 and 40 'fresh', at least someone related job posts per day.

At the same time, I know a bunch of laid off PM's, some of whom have been searching for quite some time. The two don't add up.

So, I dunno... maybe you got a live one.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 10:55 pm

Splatted, that's the problem. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. You have to send them as otherwise, no choice at all. But at the same time, you obviously don't know if it's a valid position either. However, if they are willing to fly you to Singers for the IV then it's probably a real one (talking here about on their nickle, not yours). Again, if it's a valid one, have them set up the initial interview via teleconference. Hell, you can even do it using multi party via skype for that matter. If nothing else, the constant submitting will keep your CV up to date with them on the off chance that the perfect wave does appear.

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Postby Splatted » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 11:01 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:However, if they are willing to fly you to Singers for the IV then it's probably a real one (talking here about on their nickle, not yours).


No, I paid for my airfare. This was initially meant to be a holiday for my wife and I, until my FIL was hospitalized on Easter.

Now considering moving back permanently, and was looking at my options. I responded to ad on mycareer (a site related to monster.com)
Last edited by Splatted on Wed, 14 Apr 2010 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 14 Apr 2010 11:03 pm

Another problem with both businesses and agencies here is this little trick known as letting the agency know that your company is going to be in the market, down the road, when things turn around, for this PM position for a project that's coming. This is always good for the agency and they have a JD to go on. But what they don't have is a time-line. The client also neglects to tell the agency that they (the company) have just tendered for the contract. So there isn't any way of knowing whether they will even have the project when that time comes. It's a shitty way of doing business here and it unfortunately does give recruiters a bad name but quite often it's the fault of the client company that is to blame. They don't tell the agency they are just testing the market in case they win the bid.

The other ruse is to let the agency know that when the economy picks up they will be ramping up again and could you please be on the lookout for this type of person. Instant ads go out to load up the database with potential candidates. No valid JD or start date but there you are, ads go out immediately. SE, that is what happens to PM's all the time. All are highly sought after but usually nothing transpires because the clients tend to put the cart before the horse and the agency isn't up front with the candidate (often the agency doesn't know it either).

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Postby irvine » Thu, 15 Apr 2010 4:14 pm

You may try listing yourself on Linkedin. I have had a few good calls and prospects emailing from there.

Although one advise I would give is not to appear or be too desperate. Maybe you will find this out about people here when you're here.

Know that you're good, and both sides should match before a new job begins.

[Not all may agree to this but here's my further 2cents]
Not to brag, nowadays I really want the employer to convince me I should join them rather than the other way round.

Sigh, sometimes it is really just not worth the job switch.

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Postby irvine » Thu, 15 Apr 2010 4:18 pm

On Sms's line on Cart before the Horse. That happens I notice.

I went through 4 interviews for a good job and got the verbal Yes. Turned out no offer as the recently-joined VP decided to bring in someone he already has in mind. Their HR didn't know this and couldn't do much about this. Bummer!

Also know in Singapore, if the job is yours they will wait and it will be yours. If it is not yours, it will not be, and you shouldn't take it personally.

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Postby Splatted » Thu, 22 Apr 2010 9:13 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Splatted, that's the problem. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. You have to send them as otherwise, no choice at all. But at the same time, you obviously don't know if it's a valid position either. However, if they are willing to fly you to Singers for the IV then it's probably a real one (talking here about on their nickle, not yours). Again, if it's a valid one, have them set up the initial interview via teleconference. Hell, you can even do it using multi party via skype for that matter. If nothing else, the constant submitting will keep your CV up to date with them on the off chance that the perfect wave does appear.


Turns out it was a genuine job on offer. I went for an interview today with the employer.. hope they liked me :X

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 22 Apr 2010 11:09 pm

Was it the one of which we spoke? If not, Good Luck anyway! :cool:

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Postby Splatted » Fri, 23 Apr 2010 4:17 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Was it the one of which we spoke? If not, Good Luck anyway! :cool:


thanks. No, I applied for work related to my profession. With the other job, that we spoke about, I'm still mulling over.. all the points you brought up were spot on, so not rushing into anything until I'm confident I can do it right...

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Postby Big Mac » Mon, 26 Apr 2010 9:40 am

ak1978 wrote: Any words of wisdom of these topics would be most appreciated.

(I have yet to figure out how they do the box thing). I just finished writing something similar to this in another post so not sure if this counts as double posting but anyway. To share with you my current experience, my gfriend did have similar problems. She emailed alot of the agents in regards to finding a job but took them a while to respond ( 2wks + at least). She also had a phobia of moving to the new country without finding a job first (which is understandable) but is finding the whole job hunting thing alot harder than in the western countries. Her plan of attack was to email as many head hunting firms as she could find and to apply for as many relevant jobs listed in websites such as efinancials, monster, jobsdb to name a few. And i definitely agree with SMS - the service provided by headhunters here in sg definitely has not given me anything to praise them about!

@irvine - not everyone is lucky enough to be in a situation where they get to choose their employer and not the other way around. Be grateful that you are in the privileged minority

btw if someone is kind enough to tell me how to do the format for the "box" reply (ie highlighting what someone wrote previously) - would be great.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 26 Apr 2010 10:36 am

Is this the "box" you are talking about?

Big Mac wrote:btw if someone is kind enough to tell me how to do the format for the "box" reply (ie highlighting what someone wrote previously) - would be great.


If it is, instead of hitting the reply button when responding to a post, in the upper right corner of the message you want to reply to (quote) you click the "Quote" button. This will automatically open the message reply box along with the previous message already quoted. You can then edit out all the text you don't want to appear (as I did with your post) but you have to ensure that you leave the opening

Code: Select all

[quote="Big Mac"]btw if someone is kind enough to tell me how to do the format for the "box" reply (ie highlighting what someone wrote previously) - would be great.[/quote]

in place as it is those tags that form the box.

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Postby Big Mac » Mon, 26 Apr 2010 11:54 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Is this the "box" you are talking about


yup SMS this is the 'box' thingie. Thanks - now i feel like a seasoned pro!

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Postby Splatted » Fri, 30 Apr 2010 10:07 pm

Splatted wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:Was it the one of which we spoke? If not, Good Luck anyway! :cool:


thanks. No, I applied for work related to my profession. With the other job, that we spoke about, I'm still mulling over.. all the points you brought up were spot on, so not rushing into anything until I'm confident I can do it right...


So, I've got a job offer out of that interview.

Expecting to sign a contract this monday.

One question. I have been offered a generous relocation allowance. What's the go with this. Do i have to produce receipts in order to claim back expenses or is it a 'blank cheque' , so to speak, to spend any way I choose?


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