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Problem buying an iPhone

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Wellman
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Problem buying an iPhone

Postby Wellman » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 11:18 am

Hi All,
I am looking to buy an iPhone however a few things stand in my way. Not sure how much longer I'm going to be in Singapore for so not sure if I can go for a year long contract with Singtel, etc. Is it possible to cancel a contract half way through? How much are we talking about?

Is there anywhere that a sim-free iPhone can be got? I'm thinking this option isn't going to be too cheap though!

Are there any other options?

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 11:40 am

Singtel will require you to pay an S$856 equipment penalty for early termination, essentially the cost of the phone.

As far as I know, all GSM phones are SIM based, and that includes the iPhone. There is talk in the US that Apple will release a Verizon version, which is CDMA, not GSM, and I am not aware of any CDMA phones that have a SIM. But, such a phone would not work in Singapore or most of the rest of the world.

I have used my Singapore iPhone in the US. All phones in Singapore must be sold unlocked (thank you IDA). However, in the US, the clowns at AT&T would not sell me a data plan since they did not sell me the phone. Their service is worse than a 3rd world country, with apologies to 3rd world countries that may have been offended.

I did end up going with T-Mobile who also runs a GSM network in the US. Phone coverage was satisfactory but data was only available via EDGE for the iPhone even though t-Mobile is allegedly 3G.

iPhone 4.0 will be out soon, June or so, I think. After this iPhone OS upgrades will be made available to 3GS users but not 3G. I think that you'll be able to pick up a 3G for cheap because it cannot be upgraded, and a 3GS for a better price than Singtel's equipment penalty if you wait.

I'd really take a look at the iPhone purchase options and what you can do with the phone in the country to which you will be moving. For example, the clowns at AT&T have switched off tethering which means that you cannot use the iPhone as a 3G modem. Similarly, you cannot use Google Voice of Skype over 3G with AT&T. If you really wanted this, you might prefer and older, jailbroken iPhone that overcomes these absurdities.

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Postby Wellman » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 11:48 am

Strong Eagle wrote:Similarly, you cannot use Google Voice of Skype over 3G with AT&T. If you really wanted this, you might prefer and older, jailbroken iPhone that overcomes these absurdities.


Why can the older iPhones only be broken? Can the iPhone not be jailbroken beyond a certain release? I currently have the iPod Touch and jailbreaking is a must for me.

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 12:10 pm

Wellman wrote:
Strong Eagle wrote:Similarly, you cannot use Google Voice of Skype over 3G with AT&T. If you really wanted this, you might prefer and older, jailbroken iPhone that overcomes these absurdities.


Why can the older iPhones only be broken? Can the iPhone not be jailbroken beyond a certain release? I currently have the iPod Touch and jailbreaking is a must for me.


Because jail breaking means one has to find a weakness in the OS in order to inject the code that does the jailbreak. Typically, this is done by finding a buffer overflow exploit... overwriting a buffer intended for 10 or a 100 bytes and loading in thousands of bytes.

To both jailbreak and unlock (not need with Singapore phones), both the baseband (phone carrier code) and the OS must be exploited.

Starting in week 41 of 2009, it is not possible to jailbreak an iPhone 3GS because of firmware changes made. It must be tethered to the computer. This means if you turn it off, it will not work again until you tether it and either restore the native or jail broken OS.

OS 3.1.2 is the last OS version that can be jailbroken on the 3GS. Baseband can be no higher than 05.11.07.

About one month ago, Apple released version 3.1.3 of the OS. This can be jailbroken on the 3G and lower versions but not on the 3GS. This also updated the baseband software and this cannot be unlocked on any version.

The DevTeam, that lovely group of people that produce the jailbreak hacks are non committal about another jailbreak release. For one thing, with each release, it becomes harder to find an exploit, for another, OS 4.0 is out and I imagine the thrust of their efforts will be there.

A good site for info:

http://blog.iphone-dev.org/page/2

and

http://modmyi.com/forums/index.php?forumtabs=1

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Postby Wellman » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 12:30 pm

Cheers for the info Strong Eagle

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Postby $Pripps » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 12:41 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:
Wellman wrote:
Strong Eagle wrote:Similarly, you cannot use Google Voice of Skype over 3G with AT&T. If you really wanted this, you might prefer and older, jailbroken iPhone that overcomes these absurdities.


Why can the older iPhones only be broken? Can the iPhone not be jailbroken beyond a certain release? I currently have the iPod Touch and jailbreaking is a must for me.


Because jail breaking means one has to find a weakness in the OS in order to inject the code that does the jailbreak. Typically, this is done by finding a buffer overflow exploit... overwriting a buffer intended for 10 or a 100 bytes and loading in thousands of bytes.

To both jailbreak and unlock (not need with Singapore phones), both the baseband (phone carrier code) and the OS must be exploited.

Starting in week 41 of 2009, it is not possible to jailbreak an iPhone 3GS because of firmware changes made. It must be tethered to the computer. This means if you turn it off, it will not work again until you tether it and either restore the native or jail broken OS.

OS 3.1.2 is the last OS version that can be jailbroken on the 3GS. Baseband can be no higher than 05.11.07.

About one month ago, Apple released version 3.1.3 of the OS. This can be jailbroken on the 3G and lower versions but not on the 3GS. This also updated the baseband software and this cannot be unlocked on any version.

The DevTeam, that lovely group of people that produce the jailbreak hacks are non committal about another jailbreak release. For one thing, with each release, it becomes harder to find an exploit, for another, OS 4.0 is out and I imagine the thrust of their efforts will be there.

A good site for info:

http://blog.iphone-dev.org/page/2

and

http://modmyi.com/forums/index.php?forumtabs=1



Actually even v4.0 (beta) has been broken - it took less than 24h

http://twitter.com/Musclenerd

see 4.0 features video at http://www.nordichardware.se/nyhet,17734.html

EDIT: actually not much of a video, 12s :o forget it
Last edited by $Pripps on Mon, 12 Apr 2010 1:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Wellman » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 1:09 pm

Only one problem remains now, me actually getting my hands on an iPhone! :x

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 1:55 pm

$Pripps wrote:Actually even v4.0 (beta) has been broken - it took less than 24h

http://twitter.com/Musclenerd

see 4.0 features video at http://www.nordichardware.se/nyhet,17734.html

EDIT: actually not much of a video, 12s :o forget it


This is the beginning of the cat and mouse game. What will really matter is whether the version released to customers via iTunes will be so easy to jail break.

A lot of new 4.0 features make jail breaking less necessary but tethering (which Singtel allows in Singapore but not AT&T, and lack of 3G support for Skype, Google Voice and such, as well as other non approved apps still make it an attractive option for me.

Another great iPhone info site is RedmondPie

http://www.redmondpie.com/jailbreak-iph ... s-9140617/

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 2:06 pm

Wellman wrote:Only one problem remains now, me actually getting my hands on an iPhone! :x


IF I were to buy one I think the pre week 41 3GS, purchased in an already unlocked country (Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, New Zealand... I think)... would be the way to go... if you want to do it now.

Otherwise, I'd wait for the 4.0 phone hardware to come out, and watch what the Dev Team does.

Just be aware that there are hundreds of scam websites offering unlocked 3GS phones for ridiculous sums. A friend of mine bought a new 32 gig phone in Hong Kong for USD 800... used ones will not be that much less... and you might come out ahead buying the phone from Singtel (or now M1 and/or Starhub), and see if the penalty is now prorated, now that there are multiple suppliers.

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Postby nakatago » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 2:42 pm

@OP: what is the primary reason why you want an iPhone? You may want to consider alternatives if you can't wait for the 4.0 OS jailbreak.

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Postby Wellman » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 2:48 pm

nakatago wrote:@OP: what is the primary reason why you want an iPhone? You may want to consider alternatives if you can't wait for the 4.0 OS jailbreak.


Few reasons really:

1. I already carry a phone and iPod Touch around together so it makes sense to have an iphone :shock:

2. I'm not really looking for the 4.0 OS just yet, I'd prob choose a jailbroken version over it as I've seen the possibilities with this already.

3. I like the big screen on the iPhone and already have iTunes set up for it with music, videos, apps etc.

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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 6:35 pm

I think the HTC based Android phones are going to be real winners... the only ones I can find here are Windows based.

The form factor is slightly larger (a plus or minus depending upon your view of the ideal hand phone size) and the screen is a capacitive mutli-touch AMOLED set up... brilliant colors, washes out in the sun, and better power consumption.

With Steve Jobs basically telling Adobe to f*ck off (although to an extent I share his sentiments... ALL Adobe products are bloatware), it is pretty clear that iPhone users will not have access to vast number of flash based movies and websites.

Couple this with Apple's absolutely unsupportable attempt to lock me into the Apple store only, and Google's incredibly deep pockets, and Apple may find itself tossed by the wayside yet again by trying to lock users into proprietary systems... wither the Mac versus the PC.

I am eagerly awaiting the arrival of a good Android phone... I give it about 2 more OS iterations to be a real rival... and already there are software development platforms that let a developer build for both Apple and Android with one piece of code.

That light that Apple sees could well be the Google train, barreling down the tunnel and about to wipe out all that is iPhone and iPad... slick stuff but limited developer availability.

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Postby nakatago » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 8:14 pm

Strong Eagle wrote:and already there are software development platforms that let a developer build for both Apple and Android with one piece of code.


well, iphone OS 4.0 blows that out of the water. developers must accept that

[quote]“3.3.1 … Applications must be originally written in Objective-C, C, C++, or JavaScript as executed by the iPhone OS WebKit engine, and only code written in C, C++, and Objective-C may compile and directly link against the Documented APIs (e.g., Applications that link to Documented APIs through an intermediary translation or compatibility layer or tool are prohibited).”

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Postby $Pripps » Tue, 13 Apr 2010 9:27 am

All in all Apple products look quite slick and handle well but the main turn-off for me is the control freak aspect of it. If I buy a phone I want to be able to do as I want with it including doing programs for it and selling them without having to ask somebody politely if the app conforms to sometimes seemingly obscure rules.

Also I find Apple hardware in general way overpriced, for the same price I can buy a MacBook Pro I can get a Alienware notebook with much much better hardware (raid0 500GB,dual graphics card etc).

Apple is just incredibly good in marketing.
Everybody already knows what it is, so there's not much point in saying it - Simpsons

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Postby Strong Eagle » Tue, 13 Apr 2010 9:45 am

Mr. Jobs may have seriously overreached with the iPad... the competition is going to be very strong and good... and the brand will be hurt.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/1 ... 33860.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/1 ... 34226.html


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