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Effectiveness of Frequent Flyer Programme (FFP)

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aster
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Postby aster » Thu, 08 Apr 2010 9:45 pm

Splatted, you can redeem on SQ using your Diamond Club points, though SQ are unlikely to open up their seats on the A380/777-300ER. Even for KF members seats on those planes cost DOUBLE the amount of miles so nothing gained, nothing lost really (you can get a First Class award on the 747 for less miles than a Business Class award on the A380/777-300ER).

Converting your miles to reward flights works well with DC due to the miles&cash option, and there are a few gems ("loopholes") that can be taken advantage of. Check out the redemption chart: http://www.flybmi.com/bmi/en-gb/diamond ... ights.aspx

Take London or Franfurt (Zone 1) to Singapore (Zone 7): 80,000 miles round-trip (or 40,000 + £270 when using miles&cash option). For business awards you multiply that by 1.5 so 120,000 miles (or 60,000 + £405 when using miles&cash option).

Now if you were to switch to a different airport from Zone 2 (say Copenhagen, or somewhere as far as Spain for instance) and fly to Zone 8 (Hong Kong, China, Japan) then suddenly you'd be looking at 50,000 miles round-trip (or 25,000 + £170). For business 75,000 miles (or 37,500 + £255). Quite a difference!

Now let's compare business awards (round-trip) between DC and KF:

1. Singapore - Copenhagen/Frankfurt
- 120,000 miles (or 60,000 + £405 miles&cash) with DC
- 93,500 miles with KF

Slightly less with KF, but then with DC you're always earning a 25% miles bonus on all *A carriers, not just SQ. So by the time you redeem the miles earned via DC might have made up for the difference. Plus the miles&cash option is the way forward: I mean do you want two biz return tickets for 187,000 miles (via KF) or 120,000 miles and 810 GBP (via DC)? Easy choice here - if you were to purchase the 67k extra miles on SQ to get the two tickets you would have to pay US$2,680 for them.

2. Singapore - London
- probably unavailable with DC
- 204,000 miles with KF (no saver awards whatsoever on this route)

Ridiculous amount of miles makes this route unredeemable for the sensibly-minded person.

3. Copenhagen - Japan
- 75,000 miles (or 37,500 + £255)
- 114,750 miles with KF

4. Copenhagen - Hong Kong
- 75,000 miles (or 37,500 + £255)
- 110,500 miles with KF

Needless to say, you can sign up your wife and kids to DC and pool all your miles. Plus you can purchase extra miles with DC at 12 GBP per 1,000 miles, up to a maximum of 24,000 per member, per annum.

So, when you combine the following...
- pooling family miles
- miles&cash redemptions
- buying miles at 12 GBP/1,000 miles (they have specials with even lower rates)

...you can easily see how it's possible to makes your miles go a long way even without being on a plane week in, week out. :)

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Postby Pinky » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 8:16 pm

aster wrote:I too fly SQ most of the time, though my next long-haul flight will be with another carrier...

KirsFlyer has too many drawbacks for me to remain with them:

- no family membership (no transferring of miles between family members either)
- miles expiry regardless of status (other programs offer miles that don't expire from Silver status onwards)
- no saver redemptions (the only ones worth making) when trying to book a business class award on the A380/777-300ER.
- need to fly 50,000 miles to reach Gold (25,000 for Silver)
- 25% miles bonus for flying SQ (from Silver status onwards)

BMI's Diamond Club:

- family membership, can pool all miles together for rewards
- miles don't expire
- best redemption value of all frequent flier programs
- only need 38,000 miles to reach Gold (16,000 for Silver)
- 25% miles bonus for flying ANY Star Alliance carrier (from Silver status onwards)

I'm moving over, and there are loads others who are joining DC even though they won't be flying them at all (or rarely). :)


Fully agree... Initially I was quite hesitant to switch to BD becuase of the additional earnings with credit cards, etc. (in SIN). But since I will be flying a bit less in the next year or so and still want to retain *A Gold (currently KFEG), I think BD will be the best way to go. Another airline's FFP to look at is OZ.

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Strong Eagle
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Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 8:27 pm

I don't see that BMI flys into SIN. So how?

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Needs more help...

Postby liujw » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 8:40 pm

I apologise, don't mean to spam or anything. However, I see that there are indeed a lot of views to this thread. Some 500 over. However, I only have 50 respondents. I hope you can continue to help me with my survey so that I am able to get down on my analysis soon. Your help is greatly appreciated. Thank you.
JW Liu

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aster
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Postby aster » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 9:04 pm

Pinky, the problem with OZ is that although it's great for Gold status, the problem is what to do with the miles earned. With Diamond Club you have the best redemption possibilities to burn those miles. :)

Strong Eagle, BMI don't need to fly into SIN because you can collect points accross the entire *A. That's why even if you fly one alliance airline then it might still make more sense to belong to another carrier's FFP. It actually depends on a variety of factors, like which airlines you fly, what routes, how often, what class of travel, etc.

And when you redeem, you can also do so across the alliance. Hence Diamond Club has become such a popular program with people who never even fly with them. :)

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Re: Needs more help...

Postby Strong Eagle » Mon, 12 Apr 2010 9:30 pm

liujw wrote:I apologise, don't mean to spam or anything. However, I see that there are indeed a lot of views to this thread. Some 500 over. However, I only have 50 respondents. I hope you can continue to help me with my survey so that I am able to get down on my analysis soon. Your help is greatly appreciated. Thank you.


It is because people don't think your survey will make any difference. Who cares how many years I have been a member? I've changed a bunch over the years.

I don't care to answer the agree/disagree questions for any survey because the way the question is couched may not have any relevance for me. Like this one: "I expect great service every time I fly". What kind of question is that? Does anyone wish to be shat upon? And, I also expect great service when shopping, when dining, and when doing any other activity that I am paying for.

You'd get a lot more responses and IMHO a better view of flyer feelings with a simple, five question survey.

a) Are you getting screwed by your airline because they keep canceling mileage you have earned?

b) Are you getting screwed by your airline because you can NEVER get a ticket when you need it and/or pay an absolutely exorbitant number of miles when you do get it?

c) Are you getting screwed by your airline because the mileage requirements keep climbing, especially for upgrades, to the point that it is non sensical?

d) Are you getting screwed by your airline because more and more ticket classes don't collect miles, only collect a small percentage, or are not transferable within partner airlines?

e) Are you unhappy with the fact the FFP's are one of the most profitable segments of an airline, even though they are screwing you as above?

Oh... make it six or seven.

f) Are you tired of the exorbitant processing fees that sometimes run as much as $300 to 'process' your ticket?

g) Are your tired of the ridiculous rates imposed to buy additional mileage to get a reward, rates often in excess of the actual ticket price?

h) Are you totally pissed off with being nickled and dimed to death over baggage fees, legroom fees, standing in line fees, meal charges... you name it?

A lot of good comments have been made by experienced travelers above, and this information, although anecdotal, is far more on target than any survey filled with assumptions as to what the questions should be and what the answers mean.

As Mark Twain said, "There's lies, damn lies, and statistics".

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Pinky
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Postby Pinky » Tue, 13 Apr 2010 6:07 pm

aster wrote:Pinky, the problem with OZ is that although it's great for Gold status, the problem is what to do with the miles earned. With Diamond Club you have the best redemption possibilities to burn those miles. :)


Yeah read about the poor burn rates... Only thing that gets me about bmi is the problems with logging on to the website and the call centre!!!

SE, as stated by aster, you do not need to fly on bmi metal to get those miles as it is part of the Star Alliance (which includes SQ, Thai, Lufthansa, Swiss, UA, Continental, etc.).

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Postby ScoobyDoes » Mon, 19 Apr 2010 12:43 pm

Aster: you might want to check-up on the DC pretty quickly, word is that it might be rolling into Miles & More next month, starting in selected countries first.

Upshot I think is, at least, migration is starting.

Their UK website over the last week has had, and has not had, on-and-off links from DC to M&M advising of the migration but i'm not sure if it was wrongly assigned for the UK page first before assigned to the correct country sites in question or whether it was simply a draft going "live" too early.

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aster
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Postby aster » Mon, 19 Apr 2010 8:59 pm

A few countries are being moved over to M&M which kind of sucks, hopefully they'll leave most of us alone for some time to come.

M&M is completely useless if you fly economy as it requires 100k miles to reach Gold status. Ain't gonna happen...


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