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Dating a Muslim girlfriend

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k1w1
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Postby k1w1 » Sun, 24 Jan 2010 1:52 pm

Oh, this is hairy. Yup, don't envy you, and totally know where you're coming from...

In my experience, everyone is really laid back and really easy-going - till you say you have no intention of converting. Then all of a sudden, it's the only thing that really matters and there's big dramatic scenes. Just unreal.

I remember as a kid being told that my grandfather had been disowned from his staunchly Catholic family for marrying my Presbyterian grandmother, and thinking how unbelievably backward that was... And yet, here it is still happening. It's like something out of the dark ages, if you ask me.

The really sad part, for me, is that suddenly love has nothing to do with it, and it's all about what the neighbours and extended relatives will say. It's really sad.

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Postby mayaray » Mon, 25 Jan 2010 4:28 pm

interesting to stumble upon this conversation. Hi all, I've been AWOL for a couple of years.

My best friend is Indian muslim from Malaysia. She met and married a French man 3 years ago. Yup, he had to convert, have a muslim name etc.

But shortly after getting hitched they left the country and have eventually settled down in France, 2 kids. They have a dog. Her husband still eats pork and drinks wine (French-no wine?? Cant imagine). My bestfriend, once a practising muslim is practicing only the most basic.he doesnt eat pork, I dont think she fasts anymore at ramadan, and eats non halal meat other than pork. Yes, drinks alcohol too. She's glad to be out of Malaysia.her children carry their father's surname and not some bin mohammad

The important thing is what your gf expects from you, and where you forsee yourselves living after marriage. Family pressure may make her feel that you need to convert even if the muslim law in SG is not enforced the same way as in Malaysia. I have another friend, a muslim girl dating an indian guy. He will never convert, she expects him to. The funy thing is she's not religious at all, drinks (no pork), probably has had 'illicit sex' before. not sure how forcing a man to convert just because society thinks he should will improve their relationship when she cant practice her own religion properly.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 25 Jan 2010 5:14 pm

mayaray wrote:......drinks (no pork), probably has had 'illicit sex' before.


Then I daresay she's been porked! :lol:

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Postby mayaray » Mon, 25 Jan 2010 5:19 pm

:))

Maybe indirectly porked

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Postby ev-disinfection » Mon, 25 Jan 2010 6:53 pm

mayaray wrote::))

Maybe indirectly porked


That sounds illicit to me... lol

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Postby durain » Mon, 25 Jan 2010 7:52 pm

that's the thing. a muslim can do all the sinful thing, porking around, etc. but when it comes to marrying a non-muslim, they expect the non-muslim to convert as marrying a non-muslim is sinful!

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Postby notsoworthless » Tue, 26 Jan 2010 12:27 pm

I've had the same question in mind for a long time now, I mean how does it work here in SG when a muslim wants to marry a non-muslim. This thread gave me the answer.
I have to agree with the others that a serious talk with your GF is necessary to know where your relationship is going.
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Postby k1w1 » Tue, 26 Jan 2010 1:53 pm

durain wrote:that's the thing. a muslim can do all the sinful thing, porking around, etc. but when it comes to marrying a non-muslim, they expect the non-muslim to convert as marrying a non-muslim is sinful!


This is the most difficult part to swallow, I think... Forcing someone to convert to a religion that the family/partner don't even follow themselves... It's just so rude.

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Postby forumid123 » Tue, 26 Jan 2010 3:41 pm

I would recommend you not to change religion and alll.. Just keep chilling and njoy ur life as you had all these days..

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Postby mayaray » Wed, 27 Jan 2010 9:35 am

marry overseas and live there for a few years or the other way around. It will broaden the perspective, i think. My best friend has definitely changed since they lived abroad. I have yet to ask her on whether she still views herself as muslim, as this topic is very much taboo in malaysia, (i.e you can only exit the religion by death, some perceive it as- if not by natural death, your peers will help bring it on if they know you are wanting to leave the religion).

Religion is very much deeply ingrained in the malay psyche. As unreligious and sinful as some younger ones seem, i think many return to their religion in middle or old age for repentance. (as do many other people who have some form of religion instilled in them from a young age)

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 27 Jan 2010 9:48 am

mayaray wrote:marry overseas and live there for a few years or the other way around. It will broaden the perspective, i think. My best friend has definitely changed since they lived abroad. I have yet to ask her on whether she still views herself as muslim, as this topic is very much taboo in malaysia, (i.e you can only exit the religion by death, some perceive it as- if not by natural death, your peers will help bring it on if they know you are wanting to leave the religion).

Religion is very much deeply ingrained in the malay psyche. As unreligious and sinful as some younger ones seem, i think many return to their religion in middle or old age for repentance. (as do many other people who have some form of religion instilled in them from a young age)


So what you are saying is what I've been telling my wife for years. There is virtually no difference between being a Catholic and being a Muslim. Their habit and histories and attitudes are almost parallel throughout history.

Just thought I'd fan the flames of debate! :devil:

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Postby Superglide » Wed, 27 Jan 2010 11:51 pm

Always funny to read that non-muslims are such experts on Islam and know exactly how muslims live and breathe. All from hear say and know this and that friend who got married to.

The usual cliche crap, such as pork, alcohol and circumcision and there you go: expert in Islam.

From own experience: Muslims are just humans, like all others, meaning they live lives like any other human being, no difference whatsoever.

We're a mixed couple, malay Singaporean (muslima) and an atheist Dutchman.

We drink wines, in fact mrs. Superglide even does cooking classes and wine classes, she loves to enjoy quite a bit of wines herself, we have an impressive wolfdog as a pet (and a cat), I am nowhere and no way circumcisesd, converted or otherwise changed to whatever, we're just another 'mixed' couple.

To OP, best advise I think is given by SMS, get a civil marriage abroad.

And keep away from the cliche crap, it is negative, stupid and a waste of energy.
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Postby k1w1 » Thu, 28 Jan 2010 9:21 am

Actually, my comment was personal experience, Superglide. Not one cliche or 3rd hand account.

Of course Muslims are human beings just living their lives like everyone else... My issue is with being pressured to convert to a religion that another person does not practice or follow anyway.

Obviously I don't know your situation, but you must know that it is against Islam for your wife to have married you in a civil wedding. Muslim men are allowed to marry "women of the book" but not the other way around... There is huge pressure from families, so your in-laws must be very open-minded (or your wife bloody minded - either way, all good! :wink:) to have avoided being caught up in it.

Having had reason to really research Islam and find out more about it, the difficulties I have are more to do with a total lack of personal choice. (And the fact that religion and culture are seen as the same thing - like it's impossible to be a non-Muslim Malay, which I find bizarre as those two things should not automatically be the same in my mind...) Actually, I think in a lot of ways, Islam has been given an unfairly bad rap, and there are a number of very positive things about the faith, as I'm sure you've seen too.

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Postby bluenose » Thu, 28 Jan 2010 2:00 pm

And the moral of the story so far is.....religion causes so many problems, for people who may not even take part in it! :wink:
I married someone from the same religion as me and it did not work out....and I know there is a god, because he got me out of it :wink: Unfortunately not a religious god I hasten to add :)

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Postby EADG » Thu, 28 Jan 2010 9:02 pm

Isn't the point that the mixed marriage is one thing, and where one lives can make it more difficult or not.
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