Dating a Muslim girlfriend

ksl · Post by **ksl** » Fri, 07 Jan 2011 6:32 pm

leona123 wrote:
ksl wrote:Love after all is stronger than any religion, but people are born with identities and it is not right to ask people to change identity, for love or marriage.
Would be wonderful if everyone felt the same way.

I couldn't agree more with you! It takes evolution in all faiths, some like the changes others don't, though i feel sorry for those that are forced into marriages without having any say in the matter. Traditions are complicated and as much a problem as religion I believe, and evolution comes in stages for all species and we very rarely notice the subtle changes. Though we do notice the backward steps!

Blue Sapphire · Post by **Blue Sapphire** » Sat, 08 Jan 2011 12:45 am

It's unfair that its more complicated for a non-muslim man to marry a muslim women.

I'm Catholic and my husband is Muslim but we are actually both Atheist. Our child has no religion. Things have worked really well for us and we never encountered any religious issues from anyone including family. If we did we would send them to hell anyway. We had a civil marriage and also an islamic ceremony (in a land where race and religion holds no boundaries!). I wasn't keen on the islamic wedding but it was very much for my own protection. I never converted and was never asked to by anyone. Although the Imam at our Islamic ceremony did hand me a bunch of booklets and suggested a visit to some 'sisters' at the mosque.

Post by **nakatago** » Sat, 08 Jan 2011 2:06 am

Blue Sapphire wrote:It's unfair that its more complicated for a non-muslim man to marry a muslim women.

I'm Catholic and my husband is Muslim but we are actually both Atheist. Our child has no religion. Things have worked really well for us and we never encountered any religious issues from anyone including family. If we did we would send them to hell anyway. We had a civil marriage and also an islamic ceremony (in a land where race and religion holds no boundaries!). I wasn't keen on the islamic wedding but it was very much for my own protection. I never converted and was never asked to by anyone. Although the Imam at our Islamic ceremony did hand me a bunch of booklets and suggested a visit to some 'sisters' at the mosque.

That imam and your husband's family seems to be the rare exception then.

earthfriendly · Post by **earthfriendly** » Sat, 08 Jan 2011 2:56 am

ksl wrote: I would like to see freedom not condemnation.

Yeap, life is about freedom to make the choice for ourselves, not what our friends, spouses, lovers, families, religions or cultures want us to do. One more week and it will be Martin Luther King Day in the USA. In school my kids learn this song.

(sing to the tune of Twinkle Twinkle)

Freedom, freedom, let it ring.
Let it ring said Dr King
Let us live in harmony.
Peace and love for you and me.
Freedom, freedom let it ring.
Let it ring said Dr King.

JR8 · Post by **JR8** » Sat, 08 Jan 2011 9:17 am

I love you, and you love me,
If we get married we won't have to linger in duty free.

That was going to be a sonnet, but I give up... :-p

JR8 · Post by **JR8** » Mon, 10 Jan 2011 2:33 am

State hectoring c. 1994. Are they still running this campaign, or have they given up?

Expat_guy · Post by **Expat_guy** » Mon, 10 Jan 2011 10:49 am

Blue Sapphire wrote:It's unfair that its more complicated for a non-muslim man to marry a muslim women.

I'm Catholic and my husband is Muslim but we are actually both Atheist. Our child has no religion. Things have worked really well for us and we never encountered any religious issues from anyone including family. If we did we would send them to hell anyway. We had a civil marriage and also an islamic ceremony (in a land where race and religion holds no boundaries!). I wasn't keen on the islamic wedding but it was very much for my own protection. I never converted and was never asked to by anyone. Although the Imam at our Islamic ceremony did hand me a bunch of booklets and suggested a visit to some 'sisters' at the mosque.

Did you thought that civil law would not be able to protect you? Why should always non-muslims have to compromise under such situations? Why a non-muslim spouse never consider converting to other religion OR in your case why you did not have a civil + church marraiage?

Or are there any such cases which are not highlighted ?

Post by **nakatago** » Mon, 10 Jan 2011 11:03 am

Expat_guy wrote:
Blue Sapphire wrote:It's unfair that its more complicated for a non-muslim man to marry a muslim women.

I'm Catholic and my husband is Muslim but we are actually both Atheist. Our child has no religion. Things have worked really well for us and we never encountered any religious issues from anyone including family. If we did we would send them to hell anyway. We had a civil marriage and also an islamic ceremony (in a land where race and religion holds no boundaries!). I wasn't keen on the islamic wedding but it was very much for my own protection. I never converted and was never asked to by anyone. Although the Imam at our Islamic ceremony did hand me a bunch of booklets and suggested a visit to some 'sisters' at the mosque.
Did you thought that civil law would not be able to protect you? Why should always non-muslims have to compromise under such situations? Why a non-muslim spouse never consider converting to other religion OR in your case why you did not have a civil + church marraiage?

Or are there any such cases which are not highlighted ?

Because in some countries, religious law takes precedence over any other law or religious law IS the law. Period.

In most Islamic practices, converting out of Islam is considered, "undesirable" to put it mildly.

Vaucluse · Post by **Vaucluse** » Mon, 10 Jan 2011 1:21 pm

It is not possible to leave Islam, it is considered apostasy . . . and is punishable by death - according to their 'good book'.

So, anyone leaving Islam is an apostate

(Not prostate!!!!)

JR8 · Post by **JR8** » Mon, 10 Jan 2011 4:27 pm

nakatago wrote:
Expat_guy wrote:
Did you thought that civil law would not be able to protect you? Why should always non-muslims have to compromise under such situations? Why a non-muslim spouse never consider converting to other religion OR in your case why you did not have a civil + church marraiage?

Or are there any such cases which are not highlighted ?
Because in some countries, religious law takes precedence over any other law or religious law IS the law. Period.

In most Islamic practices, converting out of Islam is considered, "undesirable" to put it mildly.

I agree with the legal aspect. I have two friends (both European and former catholics) who married girls from KL (one couple still lives there, the other is in Europe right now). To all intents and purposes they could not get married without converting to live there. Even to visit there on holiday if the guys had not converted they would have the whole kalwhat (close proximity) stuff to deal with, separate hotel rooms etc.

The other thing with this is why is islam so hard and fast. Why can you not leave it, is free will not allowed? I expect the answer to that is that it is written in the book, and as the contents of it are 'perfect' they cannot be questioned.

I don't think Islam caters to cross-cultural marriages, after all it's teachings have not evolved one bit in 1400 years, and I don't expect they were very common back in the Dark Ages.

Expat_guy · Post by **Expat_guy** » Tue, 11 Jan 2011 5:22 pm

Vaucluse wrote:It is not possible to leave Islam, it is considered apostasy . . . and is punishable by death - according to their 'good book'.

So, anyone leaving Islam is an apostate

(Not prostate!!!!)

Ho! Death for leaving Islam!!

I was of the opinion that Islam is a peace loving religion.

JayCee · Post by **JayCee** » Wed, 12 Jan 2011 12:33 pm

Expat_guy wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:It is not possible to leave Islam, it is considered apostasy . . . and is punishable by death - according to their 'good book'.

So, anyone leaving Islam is an apostate

(Not prostate!!!!)
Ho! Death for leaving Islam!!

I was of the opinion that Islam is a peace loving religion.

As long as you do what they tell you and never question - it is (the same as all the rest of them

)

Vaucluse · Post by **Vaucluse** » Wed, 12 Jan 2011 7:05 pm

JayCee wrote:
Expat_guy wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:It is not possible to leave Islam, it is considered apostasy . . . and is punishable by death - according to their 'good book'.

So, anyone leaving Islam is an apostate

(Not prostate!!!!)
Ho! Death for leaving Islam!!

I was of the opinion that Islam is a peace loving religion.
As long as you do what they tell you and never question - it is (the same as all the rest of them )

Actually, Jaycee, you are not correct.

Care to elaborate on both your assertions?

JayCee · Post by **JayCee** » Wed, 12 Jan 2011 7:09 pm

Vaucluse wrote:
JayCee wrote:
Expat_guy wrote: Ho! Death for leaving Islam!!

I was of the opinion that Islam is a peace loving religion.
As long as you do what they tell you and never question - it is (the same as all the rest of them )
Actually, Jaycee, you are not correct.

Care to elaborate on both your assertions?

Doesn't history prove that religion is not at all peaceful?

Vaucluse · Post by **Vaucluse** » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 8:45 am

JayCee wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
JayCee wrote: As long as you do what they tell you and never question - it is (the same as all the rest of them )
Actually, Jaycee, you are not correct.

Care to elaborate on both your assertions?
Doesn't history prove that religion is not at all peaceful?

It is not a matter of religion not being peaceful. I find little in most religions that make them anything but.
Rather, it is people that bastardise religion for their own purposes that make religion what it is - both in the past and present.

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