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Vaucluse
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Postby Vaucluse » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 11:04 am

x9200 wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
x9200 wrote: At the same time, practically the whole educational system is based on memorization resulting in an average Singaporean Joe with no practical ability to think independently. How is it possible that 40 years have passed and the government has done here absolutely- or close to nothing?


This idea, pre-conception or mis-conception, is such an old chestnut that it is becoming laughable.

There is no doubt that many Chinese schools harp on about rote-learning, but that seems to be the only way to learn the thousands of Chinese characters.

So is with Japanese and in medical schools and under few hundreds other situations still not creating some tape recorders out of majority of the population.


This proves or disproves your point . . . how? Japanese not human tape-recorders? :???:

This 'no independent thinking' cliché is just that - a cliché.

No it's not. It is overused perhaps but this is the reality. I am not the only one bitching here about this. It's everywhere starting from the part-time maids to the PhD graduates. If you are oblivious or resistant to it for whatever reason, then good for you.

In your opinion it may be true, perhaps your thinking of it is so rigid that you have placed yourself into this cliché? Part-time maids? How so? As for PhD grads . . . I'd love to hear your reasoning for this. Oh, and thank you for being able to 'reason' that I am oblivious to something like this. I guess anyone not agreeing with your opinion is in some way 'oblivious' to your perceived reality?

As for ragging on the education system as a whole . . . try living in Malaysia to see how a government can right royally f**k up every possibility of tinkering with it.

And this makes the SG system ....?

I see . . . so your using Japan as an example is quite acceptable, but my using Malaysia as an example is - in some way according to you - not?

x9200, I am not sure if you are making fun of ev-disinfection's English . . . but if you are then I would strongly suggest you rethink this strategy . .

Giving my English skills that would be rather stupid so maybe we both should do some rethinking.

I'd like to do that . . . if I could understand what you are trying to say



We had one of our girls in the Singaporean school system and it was anything but pure rote learning, actually, it certainly placed her well above her age group when we left.
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x9200
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Postby x9200 » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 12:15 pm

Vaucluse wrote:
x9200 wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
x9200 wrote: At the same time, practically the whole educational system is based on memorization resulting in an average Singaporean Joe with no practical ability to think independently. How is it possible that 40 years have passed and the government has done here absolutely- or close to nothing?


This idea, pre-conception or mis-conception, is such an old chestnut that it is becoming laughable.

There is no doubt that many Chinese schools harp on about rote-learning, but that seems to be the only way to learn the thousands of Chinese characters.

So is with Japanese and in medical schools and under few hundreds other situations still not creating some tape recorders out of majority of the population.


This proves or disproves your point . . . how? Japanese not human tape-recorders? :???:

Oh, I guess I must have missed your earlier point if my response not clear. Would you explain?

This 'no independent thinking' cliché is just that - a cliché.

No it's not. It is overused perhaps but this is the reality. I am not the only one bitching here about this. It's everywhere starting from the part-time maids to the PhD graduates. If you are oblivious or resistant to it for whatever reason, then good for you.

In your opinion it may be true, perhaps your thinking of it is so rigid that you have placed yourself into this cliché? Part-time

It always can work either way so maybe your thinking is so rigid you cannot get any sense of what I am writing here and trying to force me into something you perceive as cliche? Care to change the discussion style?
I allowed some other options (read the thread) but this is how I perceive it so you maybe right to some extent. I do not suggest this is because of lack of intelligence. It is a conditioning. Is it important how you name it if what irritates is the outcome?


maids? How so? As for PhD grads . . . I'd love to hear your reasoning for this. Oh, and thank you for being able to 'reason' that I am oblivious to something like this. I guess anyone not agreeing with your opinion is in some way 'oblivious' to your perceived reality?

If is sometimes an important word Vaucluse. Did you miss it?

As for ragging on the education system as a whole . . . try living in Malaysia to see how a government can right royally f**k up every possibility of tinkering with it.

And this makes the SG system ....?

I see . . . so your using Japan as an example is quite acceptable, but my using Malaysia as an example is - in some way according to you - not?

I don't know, could be ok could be not, you tell me. Do not like the medical school? :)

x9200, I am not sure if you are making fun of ev-disinfection's English . . . but if you are then I would strongly suggest you rethink this strategy . .

Giving my English skills that would be rather stupid so maybe we both should do some rethinking.

I'd like to do that . . . if I could understand what you are trying to say
Maybe later, we have definitely some more basic issues to solve first.


We had one of our girls in the Singaporean school system and it was anything but pure rote learning, actually, it certainly placed her well above her age group when we left.

And why do you think it is not herself and not her parents for the fact?

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Postby Vaucluse » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 1:48 pm

Yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, we have a rainbow-thread . . . Kumbaya-time everyone!

x9200 wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
x9200 wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
x9200 wrote: At the same time, practically the whole educational system is based on memorization resulting in an average Singaporean Joe with no practical ability to think independently. How is it possible that 40 years have passed and the government has done here absolutely- or close to nothing?


This idea, pre-conception or mis-conception, is such an old chestnut that it is becoming laughable.

There is no doubt that many Chinese schools harp on about rote-learning, but that seems to be the only way to learn the thousands of Chinese characters.

So is with Japanese and in medical schools and under few hundreds other situations still not creating some tape recorders out of majority of the population.


This proves or disproves your point . . . how? Japanese not human tape-recorders? :???:

Oh, I guess I must have missed your earlier point if my response not clear. Would you explain?

Simple question, can you explain what you said as I am a bit lost on that

This 'no independent thinking' cliché is just that - a cliché.

No it's not. It is overused perhaps but this is the reality. I am not the only one bitching here about this. It's everywhere starting from the part-time maids to the PhD graduates. If you are oblivious or resistant to it for whatever reason, then good for you.

In your opinion it may be true, perhaps your thinking of it is so rigid that you have placed yourself into this cliché? Part-time

It always can work either way so maybe your thinking is so rigid you cannot get any sense of what I am writing here and trying to force me into something you perceive as cliche? Care to change the discussion style?
I allowed some other options (read the thread) but this is how I perceive it so you maybe right to some extent. I do not suggest this is because of lack of intelligence. It is a conditioning. Is it important how you name it if what irritates is the outcome?


Yes, it must be MY rigid thinking . . . even though I am not a product of the Singapore school system. Hmm, interesting concept.

maids? How so? As for PhD grads . . . I'd love to hear your reasoning for this. Oh, and thank you for being able to 'reason' that I am oblivious to something like this. I guess anyone not agreeing with your opinion is in some way 'oblivious' to your perceived reality?

If is sometimes an important word Vaucluse. Did you miss it?

Nope, I didn't

As for ragging on the education system as a whole . . . try living in Malaysia to see how a government can right royally f**k up every possibility of tinkering with it.

And this makes the SG system ....?

I see . . . so your using Japan as an example is quite acceptable, but my using Malaysia as an example is - in some way according to you - not?

I don't know, could be ok could be not, you tell me. Do not like the medical school? :)

You brought about the example, so I am all ears/eyes as to your feelings about this

x9200, I am not sure if you are making fun of ev-disinfection's English . . . but if you are then I would strongly suggest you rethink this strategy . .

Giving my English skills that would be rather stupid so maybe we both should do some rethinking.

I'd like to do that . . . if I could understand what you are trying to say
Maybe later, we have definitely some more basic issues to solve first.


We had one of our girls in the Singaporean school system and it was anything but pure rote learning, actually, it certainly placed her well above her age group when we left.

And why do you think it is not herself and not her parents for the fact?
I see . . . so if an example to the contrary is given, from personal experience as opposed to pub-talk then there must have been other factors involved.

If SMS says you're ok then I won't belabor the point. I just don't believe that the Singapore education system is as bad as many think and that you'd be hard-pressed to find other school systems in this region that are even a smidgen as good.

At times I believe that Singaporeans tend to talk their country down too much when it really is a good example of how one can do something well despite situation one finds oneself in
......................................................



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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 2:32 pm

He's okay. I've actually spent the better part of an evening with him and 6 other esteemed member of this board a couple of weeks (month?) ago. I think a good time was had by all. You are in good company. He's also not what you would expect in person either! :wink:

All school systems have their good and bad points. Singapore's is okay as long as the parents are actively involved with their child's education in order to temper the rote learning penchant (which is rapidly becoming a thing of the past) with lateral thinking as well learning that there often is more than one "right" answer.

I put both of mine through the entire system with mixed results but that was because of the musical inclinations of one of them. (Alternative music - Caracal - launched their first album at The Substation last Saturday night).

Shameless plug: check facebook or Utube for Caracal [Bear.Shark.Wolf]

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Postby x9200 » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 3:10 pm

Vaucluse wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:Yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, we have a rainbow-thread . . . Kumbaya-time everyone!

Me thinks we gonna be disappointed.

We had one of our girls in the Singaporean school system and it was anything but pure rote learning, actually, it certainly placed her well above her age group when we left.
And why do you think it is not herself and not her parents for the fact?
I see . . . so if an example to the contrary is given, from personal experience as opposed to pub-talk then there must have been other factors involved.

No-lah, it only means there may be another possibility you kindly might have overlooked trying to make the discussion more sarcastic and pretending you do not understand more then obvious analogies. Me English bad but not that bad.

If SMS says you're ok then I won't belabor the point. I just don't believe that the Singapore education system is as bad as many think and that you'd be hard-pressed to find other school systems in this region that are even a smidgen as good.

No, it is not as bad perhaps even not bad at all but it clearly lacks something. I was not trying to make it the worst system of the world but pointed out an obvious (to me) weakness. You are not convince it would be better if they teach more thinking than memorizing or you think this is just well balanced? A genuine question.

At times I believe that Singaporeans tend to talk their country down too much when it really is a good example of how one can do something well despite situation one finds oneself in

I am not criticizing for the sake of criticizing and to make Singapore look worse. What may be surprising after all this discussion is that I tend to think this could be the right way for Singapore for the time being. Not that this prevents me from asking some provocative questions.

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Postby Vaucluse » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 3:34 pm

Sarcastic? Me? :o Well, possibly sometimes . . . but not this time

x9200 wrote:[ Not that this prevents me from asking some provocative questions.


Good. You need to


SMS wrote:
He's okay. I've actually spent the better part of an evening with him and 6 other esteemed member of this board a couple of weeks (month?) ago. I think a good time was had by all. You are in good company. He's also not what you would expect in person either!


OI! Where was my invitation!!!! (And I'm not quite sure what you mean by your last sentence! :? )
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Postby x9200 » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 4:07 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:He's okay. I've actually spent the better part of an evening with him and 6 other esteemed member of this board a couple of weeks (month?) ago. I think a good time was had by all. You are in good company. He's also not what you would expect in person either! :wink:

I remember saying this to you about you but completely not remember you saying this to me. Was I already that drunk at the time or you just saved it for another occasion? :)

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 13 Jan 2011 5:40 pm

It took me a couple of days to recollect most of the conversations that evening. I got home a some point after 3 am! (or at least the body did) ksl, I think, got lost in the ozone somewhere an ended up home around 3:30 I hear tell.

V., Would have given you an invite but you're never in Singers anymore. If you do get down here, give us some advance warning. That way we can all disappear! Nah. Would probably be a good gathering. :wink:

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 1:10 am

x9200 wrote:for me WIMH is a true unorthodox. I would not easily guessed she is Singaporean and this is not like she tries to hide anything or turns her back to her country. It is just opposite.

Aw X9200, I know you mean this as a compliment so :kiss:

sundaymorningstaple wrote:ev's English, like WIMH's is NOT native (in the way that we are used to seeing from the 'average' local who come on here). But, having talked (verbally off the board) to both and actually meeting one, I can assure x9200 that both are well and truly Singaporeans who do Singapore proud. :wink:

Ok you get one too, for being nice to both of us :kiss:

sundaymorningstaple wrote:He's okay. I've actually spent the better part of an evening with him and 6 other esteemed member of this board a couple of weeks (month?) ago. I think a good time was had by all. You are in good company. He's also not what you would expect in person either! :wink

X9200 is more than okay; he's an absolute darling. Actually nobody on this board looks like what I expected, but then I naively expect to meet their avatars so that's not surprising.


As for the education system here, I've been through it personally so I would be happy to take questions if anyone feels that their opinions need verifying :)

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Postby longstebe » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 8:32 am

^^^^^^^
So if I was who my avatar shows me to be, would I be a darling too?

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 9:05 am

I've seen better heads on a nickle beer! :P

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Postby ev-disinfection » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 12:56 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
Vaucluse wrote:
x9200, I am not sure if you are making fun of ev-disinfection's English . . . but if you are then I would strongly suggest you rethink this strategy . . .


Actually, I think he is doing just the opposite. ev's English, like WIMH's is NOT native (in the way that we are used to seeing from the 'average' local who come on here). But, having talked (verbally off the board) to both and actually meeting one, I can assure x9200 that both are well and truly Singaporeans who do Singapore proud. :wink:


Guess if i am ever unhappy, i will re visit this post as it will always make my day. :D

I hope that i will be invited to the next meet up... [-o<

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Postby x9200 » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 2:01 pm

WIMH, you are always very kind to me. Yes, it was a complement, an unorthodox one I guess :)

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Postby JR8 » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 4:56 pm

Wind In My Hair wrote:
nakatago wrote:I think he meant connecting ideas, based on his premise that it's knowledge-based and poor problem solving abilities. Just inferring.

Makes sense, and good case in point :wink: 'Connections' has a very specific meaning here, and I notice EV interpreted it the same way I did.

ev-disinfection wrote:We do have connections and networking, more on a "relationship" kind of way.



What a perfectly symmetrical QED! :)

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Postby JR8 » Fri, 14 Jan 2011 6:06 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
Shameless plug: check facebook or Utube for Caracal [Bear.Shark.Wolf]


I think they are rather impressive. They remind me, to quite an extent, of some of the pioneer UK punk bands like The Members, and The Ruts (this is based upon watching only two of Caracal's live vids). The studio album is much more 'west coast' metal, to me. Very polished in the production and mixing, though I recognise a guitar lick or technique here or there that has maybe been 'borrowed'... hehe...

The vids I see on Youtube though just seem to be shot by fans on mobiles (and to be honest the recording quality is pretty damned horrible). They would be doing themselves some favours if they could get a few decent vids of themselves on YT, and get those up the page-rankings.

p.s. The bassist looks a bit curmudgeonly, it's him issit? :wink:


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