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Credit card fraud

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dbenne22
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Costs

Postby dbenne22 » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 7:39 am

Trouble is the overseas cards charge around 3% extra for overseas transactions, and they give you a pretty ordinary exchange rate, so it could end up costing say 5% extra for every purchase made - a big number over the year.

Our bank allows us to reduce our credit card limit down to as low as $500 - we think we'll make it $1,000, use NETS as much as possible and keep the Aussie card handy in case of emergencies.

I'm amazed none of my friends that have been here a long time haven't complained - maybe after a while you just get used to being treated like this...

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Re: Costs

Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 9:15 am

dbenne22 wrote:Trouble is the overseas cards charge around 3% extra for overseas transactions, and they give you a pretty ordinary exchange rate, so it could end up costing say 5% extra for every purchase made - a big number over the year.

Our bank allows us to reduce our credit card limit down to as low as $500 - we think we'll make it $1,000, use NETS as much as possible and keep the Aussie card handy in case of emergencies.

I'm amazed none of my friends that have been here a long time haven't complained - maybe after a while you just get used to being treated like this...


I almost never use my US credit card in Singapore. I use it to buy online... often in the US... no exchange rate hassles. And if I am traveling it really doesn't matter whether a Sing or other card... all are subject to the exchange rate hit. And given that I have no annual fee, unlike Sing cards, any exchange rate hit is somewhat offset by no fee.

And, I can't get whacked for more than $50 US.

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Postby Nath21 » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 10:35 am

Im pretty sure you can get cc insurance here in singapore to cover you its just an extra cost. I just use my oz cc which has limits on exposure, exchange rates they use is actually very good but you do get hit with a transaction fee however its more like about 1.5% not 3%. Its pretty low they dont cover you automatically over here but western countries only recently moved to change the law on exposure due to all the outrage and also the competitiveness for market share. I guess you just have to keep causing a fuss over here until they change.

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Re: Costs

Postby jpatokal » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 10:57 am

Strong Eagle wrote:And given that I have no annual fee, unlike Sing cards, any exchange rate hit is somewhat offset by no fee.

I don't think I've ever heard of anybody actually paying the annual fees in Sg -- if you use the cards at all, they're waived with no question asked.
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Re: Costs

Postby ScoobyDoes » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 1:09 pm

jpatokal wrote:
Strong Eagle wrote:And given that I have no annual fee, unlike Sing cards, any exchange rate hit is somewhat offset by no fee.

I don't think I've ever heard of anybody actually paying the annual fees in Sg -- if you use the cards at all, they're waived with no question asked.


Right, and so many people do it that UOB's request is now fully automated like;


Press 1 to request free annual fee
<Bleep>
Thank you, an SMS will be sent to you within a few days advising of the request status.

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Postby dazzlebabe » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 2:07 pm

Never paid any annual fee. Always call to dispute. Having said that, cancelling a credit card here is harder than trying to get a new one!
Just me

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Re: Costs

Postby Strong Eagle » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 2:13 pm

jpatokal wrote:
Strong Eagle wrote:And given that I have no annual fee, unlike Sing cards, any exchange rate hit is somewhat offset by no fee.

I don't think I've ever heard of anybody actually paying the annual fees in Sg -- if you use the cards at all, they're waived with no question asked.


Proof positive I've never had a Sing CC. I didn't know that!

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Re: Costs

Postby ScoobyDoes » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 4:44 pm

jpatokal wrote:I don't think I've ever heard of anybody actually paying the annual fees in Sg -- if you use the cards at all, they're waived with no question asked.



Actually, going back on that one....... usually credit cards with an airline affiliation (for example the Cathay Pacific Card) don't waive fees at all. What they do is credit you miles or points to your frequent flier program, maybe 5000.

The PremierMiles card, or one of them here, gives you the option of no fee and no bonus miles, or pay the fee and get the bonus miles. It's a very transparent clause.

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Postby durain » Wed, 26 Aug 2009 6:22 pm

ok, here's a rough guide to the VISA exchange rate. all VISA credit/debit card goes thru this exchange rate regardless of which bank it was issued by. it is the banks that take a cut from the "load" or "bank fees" on top of the exchange rate.

therefore it is always a good idea to find out from your bank what are their fees, especially when the range is from 0% to 5%!!! (yes, there are banks that do 0% fees!)

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Postby cbavasi » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 7:06 am

I'm really surprised by the info in this thread - who knew??? I had my wallet stolen 2x in Jakarta - credit card used like mad in a span of about 1 hour and HSBC didn't blink an eyelash assuming the loss. They were also the ones who called us when someone used our card overseas. Same thing in London... guy steals wallet in supermarket - charges 1pd and takes out 50pds and goes to Sainsburys down the road and does the same thing about 10 minutes after he nicked wallet! HSBC still assumed charges... I'm shocked that here in Singapore they wouldn't do the same. It's a bit unnerving to know you'd be liable.

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Postby QRM » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 10:26 am

cbavasi wrote:I'm really surprised by the info in this thread - who knew??? I had my wallet stolen 2x in Jakarta - credit card used like mad in a span of about 1 hour and HSBC didn't blink an eyelash assuming the loss. They were also the ones who called us when someone used our card overseas. Same thing in London... guy steals wallet in supermarket - charges 1pd and takes out 50pds and goes to Sainsburys down the road and does the same thing about 10 minutes after he nicked wallet! HSBC still assumed charges... I'm shocked that here in Singapore they wouldn't do the same. It's a bit unnerving to know you'd be liable.


Is that a HSBC singapore or UK credit card that got stolen?

I just called HSBC Singapore and they are very vague about liability, saying each loss will be investigated but if the card is stolen I am liable for all transaction. There is an insurance option ( they never did offer you have to ask for it) called card protection plus the rep will contact me with quotes to cover fraudulent loss.

It is an eye opener, and people should start getting their protest placards out and camp outside the local credit card offices to complain, the insurance should be part of the credit card package.
Last edited by QRM on Thu, 27 Aug 2009 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby cbavasi » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 11:07 am

QRM wrote:Is that a HSBC singapore or UK credit card that got stolen?

I just called HSBC Singapore and they are very vague about liability, saying each loss will be investigated but if the card is stolen I am liable for all transaction. There is an insurance option ( they never did offer you have to ask for it) called card protection plus the rep will contact me with quotes to cover fraudulent loss.

It is an eye opener, and people should start getting there placards out and camp outside the local credit card offices to complain, the insurance should be part of the credit card package.


It was UK one... they were ever so good both times it happened (once in Victoria Station and someone used it within minutes - and that card had my picture on it!). The UK branch also called us in Indo to inform us someone had tried to cash a check... we would have never known b/c we never used that particular account so never checked up on it.

I'm going to call as well about the protection only b/c I just assumed it would be the same here in Singapore. Thanks for the heads-up!

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Postby jpatokal » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 1:46 pm

Here's DBS on protection:

http://www.dbs.com.sg/sg/personal/cards ... fault.aspx

Basically, all card holders are covered for the first $1000 of fraudulent claims in Singapore, and also overseas if and only if they bought their tickets with the DBS credit card. (Took the bus to Malaysia? Too bad!)

But that's it -- I even can't find an option to buy insurance for the rest of your credit limit, the "Lifestyle Protection Plan" only covers stuff like armed robbery.

RBS is even worse: their T&C explicitly disclaims all liability for charges before notification. If you pony up $52/year for the Card Protection Plan, they'll graciously cover the first $3000 only. There's also a bullshit figure of "$500,000" after notification, which is pointless since the standard T&Cs say that all charges after notification are RBS's problem.
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Postby ScoobyDoes » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 3:38 pm

QRM wrote: There is an insurance option ( they never did offer you have to ask for it) called card protection plus the rep will contact me with quotes to cover fraudulent loss.



I just had an email circular this morning from HSBC offering the very same.

For the first $5000 before reporting the loss of the card, at "as little as S$0.15 a day" and you can even cover cards issued by other banks but only up $300.

SG rules don't cover what you otherwise get elsewhere, so they charge you more just to get the same.

HSBC is playing with fire if their Premier clients are not covered as they/we would otherwise expect!

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Postby QRM » Thu, 27 Aug 2009 5:43 pm

ScoobyDoes wrote:
HSBC is playing with fire if their Premier clients are not covered as they/we would otherwise expect!


In the US and UK there are regulations that protect the consumers. Like you said, international premier customers will just assume that the HSBC credit card is the same the world over. OK they can get all legal and say you signed the T&C, but who actually sits down and reads the fine print for a international bank credit card? Its like suddenly discovering all these years your car has not been insured.

HSBC and other guilty banks knows there is no consumer protection and takes advantage of the passive population who will not all stand up and complain.

ScoobyDoes wrote:For the first $5000 before reporting the loss of the card, at "as little as S$0.15


Its not the first 5k I worry about it the rest of the credit limit, should be the other way round, you are liable for the first $5k, insurance will cover any loss over that amount!!


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