Tenancy agreements/leases and your rights as a tenant

[UrbanNomad]

Im just wondering if agent in between is acting like an ass?

[x9200]

Im just wondering if agent in between is acting like an ass?

Not only possible, but also pretty likely (what translates - yes, it happens VERY often). Esp. if the rent would be on a low side.
The trouble is, you normally are not in a position to quickly figure out who is the ass, the LL or the LL's agent.

[UrbanNomad]

Rent is 4k. Not that low i suppose?

Trying to see if i can get in touch directly with the LL too.

[JR8]

Rent is 4k. Not that low i suppose?
Trying to see if i can get in touch directly with the LL too.

Indeed it's not.

The landlord's agent will not like that at all, oh mama! And the problem is the LL won't expect nor probably welcome your call.

I've let property as a 2nd career, doing so via lettings agents. Once or twice I've made the decision to also have a direct channel to the tenant. This is usually after they've been in place for a long while, and I've got a feel that they're mature and responsible and that 'we're cool'.

Unfortunately one time this morphed into a veeeery convoluted, long, and tedious side discussion. On discovering that I was discussing/negotiating complex matters on the side directly vs the tenant, the agent was justifiably pretty displeased. a) I was muddying the established channels b) how could they act for me, their legal duty, when they didn't know what I was doing/saying?

Lesson learned: I've not indulged direct tenant comms again. In fact I've learned attempts by tenants to establish a direct comms-channel generally seems to precede an impending $h*tfest of trouble. So if a tenant now somehow manages to figure out how to contact me directly, I simply very politely refer them to my agent, since 'time-zones, ignorance of current new legislation, I pay my agents to do this, I only check this e-mail once in a while, I travel extensively and often have no e-mail access' - take your pick, all apply for me...

[JR8]

Im also finding it odd: i have requested for a second viewing before i sign the TA and the LL's agent has refused. Says can arrange second viewing only once the TA is signed. Which looks fishy to me. Was there something in the unit that i missed seeing initially and that they now want quickly to gloss over and get going?!

I also did not specifically see the clause on initial 30 day time period to report any issues which i have insisted is included.

To be concise. You've had enough advance warning flags and my suggestion is to now run!
A 2nd viewing is entirely expected and often a positive IME. The danger for the keen tenant-to-be is they're mentally already beyond the up-front detail, paperwork, and negotiation, and they've often mentally visualised themselves within said apartment; how they'll sort out their furniture, what the neighbourhood is like, how they'll commute to work etc.

Viewing again 'only once the TA is signed' is clearly bollocks, bordering on the cynically disingenuous.

It might feel wrenching to have got this far and yet not be able to proceed, and I've been in those shoes. The irony seems to be, that now you're more knowledgeable as to what you want and can afford, what a TA looks like, your rights, etc., starting again from scratch might well (IME) pay dividends.

[UrbanNomad]

Thanx JR8 and x9200 for the amazing input and feedback. Appreciate it.

Noted the comments on directly contacting the LL. Wasnt aware of that bit here.

[UrbanNomad]

Thanx jr8 & x9200 for amazing input & feedback. Appreciate it.

Noted the comments on directly contacting the LL, wasnt aware of that bit here

[x9200]

Thanx jr8 & x9200 for amazing input & feedback. Appreciate it.

Noted the comments on directly contacting the LL, wasnt aware of that bit here

I don't want to contradict JR8 too strongy, but I believe his perspective may be a bit specific - he is a professional LL. If I were one, I wouldn't like to have the tenants directly contacting me neither. But from my experience, all the LLs I dealt with while in Singapore were just people owning one or two properties as some asset location and not as their income source.

I believe it is not that uncommon to talk directly to the LLs. I always do. With my current one, where his agent is a typical AH agent, I cut it short in one point to speed up communication and solve some issues. No harm at all, my current LL seems a very reasonable person. We even go out dining together from time to time when he visits Singapore.

If the LL is reasonable (and not the professional LL) and intending to rent out the place for longer time (s)he actually would prefer to contact the tenants directly (sooner or later) becuase this is the way he may save some money on the agent's comission at the TA renewal.

[amazeprabu]

Hi All,

I am in need of some advice, I have gone through this topics and comments.

I have rented a house in October 14, due to current oil price done my company has removed few people and I found a new job in my home country. My HDB contract with owner is for 1 year. I paid 1/2 month agent fee.

As I resigned, I informed my owner agent on 22nd Feb saying that I have resigned due to the possibility of losing my job and found a new and leaving Singapore by March last week, as I rented the house on 18th, so I pay my rent on 17th of each month.

As we discussed I understood as per agreement my advance will be fortified and I said ok for that, still the owner agent says that I have to pay the owner extra apart from my advance. She says that I have to the owner agent fee on pro-rata basis, now I have served only 5 months, so 1000$ agent fee/ 12 X 7 = around 550 $.

Kindly let me know if this is a part of agreement, also a dressing table glass fellow down due to rusting when we were not at home during Jan 1st week, we informed my agent and he wrote to her agent and they never cared about it, now as I am leaving they are asking me to fix it, I told you bring the experts and check it, if it is my fault I will pay, but they are keeping quite and my agents says it will take only 100$ so let us fix it and close the case.

I am restless because of this tension, can someone advice me whether their demand is correct, if not how to handle this case.

Regards

Prabu

[sundaymorningstaple]

Hi All,

I am in need of some advice, I have gone through this topics and comments.

I have rented a house in October 14, due to current oil price done my company has removed few people and I found a new job in my home country. My HDB contract with owner is for 1 year. I paid 1/2 month agent fee.

As I resigned, I informed my owner agent on 22nd Feb saying that I have resigned due to the possibility of losing my job and found a new and leaving Singapore by March last week, as I rented the house on 18th, so I pay my rent on 17th of each month.

As we discussed I understood as per agreement my advance will be fortified and I said ok for that, still the owner agent says that I have to pay the owner extra apart from my advance. She says that I have to the owner agent fee on pro-rata basis, now I have served only 5 months, so 1000$ agent fee/ 12 X 7 = around 550 $.

Correct.

Kindly let me know if this is a part of agreement, also a dressing table glass fellow down due to rusting when we were not at home during Jan 1st week, we informed my agent and he wrote to her agent and they never cared about it, now as I am leaving they are asking me to fix it, I told you bring the experts and check it, if it is my fault I will pay, but they are keeping quite and my agents says it will take only 100$ so let us fix it and close the case.

Fix it.

I am restless because of this tension, can someone advice me whether their demand is correct, if not how to handle this case.

Be thankful that is all you have to pay. How to handle? I'm sure the landlord would have let the mirror (I think that what you are talking about as your spelling is atrocious) go had you been there for the full term of the lease. But with less than half of the lease gone, he's out of pocket 7 months income AND would have to fork out the money to fix the mirror as well. There are two sides to every coin. Instead of trying to get something over on somebody, treat them as you would want to be treated. After all, it's you who is on breach of their valid contract.

Regards

Prabu

[amazeprabu]

"sundaymorningstaple"

I think this place is for expats, your answer is rude Like LL.

Hope you are not an English teacher to check my spelling, anyone can make mistakes in sentences when typed through mobile.

Moreover I thought this is a friendly forum to expats who is lacking of knowledge on tenancy agreement. All I am asking is that whether the demands kept by owner agent is correct or not, no where I mentioned they are bad or I am not willing to pay.

I am seeking for a friendly advice from people about the current policies, not from a rude ppl who wants to remind me about my contract.I know I am breaching the contract that's why I am here.

Be nice to ppl while you answer, if u cannot control, it is better for you to keep quite

[x9200]

You got the answer already, the best of the answers you could have gotten without us having a crystal ball to see what is in your TA.

[ecureilx]

"sundaymorningstaple"

I think this place is for expats, your answer is rude Like LL.

Hope you are not an English teacher to check my spelling, anyone can make mistakes in sentences when typed through mobile.

Moreover I thought this is a friendly forum to expats who is lacking of knowledge on tenancy agreement. All I am asking is that whether the demands kept by owner agent is correct or not, no where I mentioned they are bad or I am not willing to pay.

I am seeking for a friendly advice from people about the current policies, not from a rude ppl who wants to remind me about my contract.I know I am breaching the contract that's why I am here.

Be nice to ppl while you answer, if u cannot control, it is better for you to keep quite

why would you equate expats=being blunt=rude ?

beats me

Now, you came here, possibly on a very good package, read and signed the agreement, and now looking for sympathy when you have to leave, is that right ?

Tell you the truth, when you breach a contract, what do you expect people to say ? that you are right, fight for it ? or support you to take the risk of ditching and hoping the LL/Agent dont file for action ? or ?? a shoulder to cry on ? life is tough, and in my little experience, I would have given anything for people who give blunt and direct advice, and instead all I got was super coated words I wanted to hear .. and left my in lots of problem. .. (one - same as your situation .. years ago .. )

what you signed over rides, and you may prove the terms were bad, but then, you have to be here to fight and prove yourself, something I am sure you can't afford to.

PS, SMS as English teacher ? well, i find that quite possible among the many hats he has worn in his life ..

[amazeprabu]

Sundaymorningstaple,

I feel pity for myself for writing here.

When did I asked for sympathy or shoulders to cry????

I thought of not arguing but the way u r understanding the things is atrocious. ......

I just asked whether my LL/Agent asking is right as per rules, you replied saying correct....that is all I expected instead of giving me lectures.

As a moderator you should be with more sense, I am not a known person to you, u cannot handle everyone in ur own way, being in virtual discussion does not mean u can write whatever u think.

Let us end it up here, I got my answers...yes I have to respect my owner demands.

Note* this forum will develop if u behave like a moderator instead of behaving like an anonymous person.

Cheers and thanks...

[JR8]

As a landlord of many years, I'll add that SMS is spot on, and that you should be thankful for him taking the time to reply for you, rather than scornful that is wasn't what you wanted to hear.

You're being offered an unusually generous settlement of 1", but still want to get a mile. Do you not understand the concept of 'settling a dispute' for net mutual benefit, i.e. before recourse to lawyers?

I've been in this position a few times before vs a tenant, and my starting point is usually to make things as simple and mutually equitable as possible, especially for a longer term tenant.

When a tenant leaves I could usually write a 20+/++ point list of deductions, and indeed the professional inventory clerk has also done precisely that and e-mailed it to me:- a cracked window pane, a gouged timber floor, a broken appliance, etc. etc. I can overlook a lot of these things if I have a good relationship with the tenant, we respect each other's position, and getting closure suits both parties.

My starting point might be say 6" ['Without prejudice' i.e. to any following legal proceedings, in the case a simple agreement isn't reached], but if the tenant wants to pick a fight and go for the full 20"+, then it's 'game on'. I don't enjoy it one bit, but it's net-net better for my soul than having a tenant try and egregiously take the p*ss.

If you will listen: Beware invoking the storm that looms just out of view.