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Tenancy agreements/leases and your rights as a tenant

Discuss about where to live, renting a property, tenancy issues, property trend and property investment in Singapore.
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PNGMK
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Postby PNGMK » Wed, 05 Jun 2013 8:04 am

beppi wrote:Can security guards, together with the condo Management, fire an unreasonably quarrelsome tenant instead?
That would actually do more towards nice living conditions in the condo than firing security guards (and hiring others instead to do exactly the same).
It is probably unrealistic to hope that the OP learns that most issues are best solved in a non-confrontational manner and not by making as many enemies as possible (as he just did on this forum as well).


The management committee can make a tenants life a living hell (via the appointed property manager and the guards) and if inclined enough to do so could obtain a court order evicting the tenant I suppose.

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Re: Where to find this?

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 05 Jun 2013 8:36 am

amoon wrote:
jpatokal wrote:Normally the tenant pays the stamp duty, but it's the agent/landlord's duty to actually handle the stamping, and the tenant should get a copy of the receipt to prove that it's been done.


Is it on any website I did not read it anywhere? I do not know how to pay but owner told me do it. If owner must I need to find it so I can show him.

Thanks


http://www.iras.gov.sg/irashome/page.aspx?id=1808

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Postby JR8 » Wed, 05 Jun 2013 9:15 am

PNGMK wrote:The management committee can make a tenants life a living hell (via the appointed property manager and the guards) and if inclined enough to do so could obtain a court order evicting the tenant I suppose.


Rubbish. This suggests they are a 'law to themselves', and the court is on their side, which is certainly not the case: We are not living in Zimbabwe

'Residents committees' cannot operate outside of the law, never mind wade in re: eviction. They have no ''''special''' legal powers.

What they can be is a force for good within a property development. What they can also be is a complete PITA. In my experience, a lot of property disputes (in Europe) are centred on places where there are retirees who've appointed themselves to run a place, people with a bug 'up their own', and 40+ hrs a week to work it out. Good luck facing them, as they have nothing to lose, not even time (in fact engaging them is like feeding a troll).

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Rental Termination

Postby ap10046 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 1:53 pm

Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby the lynx » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 2:16 pm

ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?


Does your TA have any clause regarding your residency in Singapore terminated against your will?

Your company should be looking into breaking the lease since it is not on your own choice.

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby ap10046 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 2:33 pm

the lynx wrote:
ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?


Does your TA have any clause regarding your residency in Singapore terminated against your will?

Your company should be looking into breaking the lease since it is not on your own choice.


Hello
Thank you kindly for your prompt reply.

The TA does not mention that, if i had even an inkling that something was afoot, I would have acted on it.

I did ask (pleaded) with the employer to help out even for termination charges for cable/tv and all my belongings that would have, now, been heavily excess baggage, but he flatly refused.

Am not in an enviable position...

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Postby PNGMK » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 2:37 pm

JR8 wrote:
PNGMK wrote:The management committee can make a tenants life a living hell (via the appointed property manager and the guards) and if inclined enough to do so could obtain a court order evicting the tenant I suppose.


Rubbish. This suggests they are a 'law to themselves', and the court is on their side, which is certainly not the case: We are not living in Zimbabwe

'Residents committees' cannot operate outside of the law, never mind wade in re: eviction. They have no ''''special''' legal powers.

What they can be is a force for good within a property development. What they can also be is a complete PITA. In my experience, a lot of property disputes (in Europe) are centred on places where there are retirees who've appointed themselves to run a place, people with a bug 'up their own', and 40+ hrs a week to work it out. Good luck facing them, as they have nothing to lose, not even time (in fact engaging them is like feeding a troll).


And once again, asswipe, you bring in your completely irrelevant experience. I am actually on a MC (you know in Singapore - where you haven't lived much) and we can make merry hell with residents. We usually don't tho - it's not to the advantage of the committee in most cases (who are landlords just like you claim to be).

Recent cases though include; wheel clamping (although there's some argument this is illegal), cancellation of access cards without notice (a local MC favourite), outrageous interest on overdue payments and on and on.

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby x9200 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 2:59 pm

ap10046 wrote:Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?


If you really don't have any stance against your employer* then I can image the only thing you could try to minimize the damage is to find people who could substitute you in the rental and other agreements. The odds are probably not that high but it is worth to try.
Unfortunately knowing how many of the local landlords behave you may still lose your deposit.

*) Maybe it is still a good idea to get some legal advice?

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby the lynx » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 3:21 pm

ap10046 wrote:
the lynx wrote:
ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?


Does your TA have any clause regarding your residency in Singapore terminated against your will?

Your company should be looking into breaking the lease since it is not on your own choice.


Hello
Thank you kindly for your prompt reply.

The TA does not mention that, if i had even an inkling that something was afoot, I would have acted on it.

I did ask (pleaded) with the employer to help out even for termination charges for cable/tv and all my belongings that would have, now, been heavily excess baggage, but he flatly refused.

Am not in an enviable position...


I agree with x92 on this.

1. Get someone to take over your cable and TV contract. You only need to change owner's name and address for a fee. Both of you must be present at Singtel (or Starhub?) office with your passports and proofs of address to do this.

2. Get someone to take over your rental. If you're lucky, your landlord will allow you to transfer the deposit to the new tenant, who will take over your rental. Meaning the tenant takes over your deposit and pays you back yours. Even better if the new tenant also takes over your cable/TV contract as well, which means less fee on re-installation, and just on change of owner.

But consider the legal options for this. This is unfair of the employer to pull you out and dump you like that.

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby ap10046 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 3:27 pm

the lynx wrote:
ap10046 wrote:
the lynx wrote:
ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?


Does your TA have any clause regarding your residency in Singapore terminated against your will?

Your company should be looking into breaking the lease since it is not on your own choice.


Hello
Thank you kindly for your prompt reply.

The TA does not mention that, if i had even an inkling that something was afoot, I would have acted on it.

I did ask (pleaded) with the employer to help out even for termination charges for cable/tv and all my belongings that would have, now, been heavily excess baggage, but he flatly refused.

Am not in an enviable position...


I agree with x92 on this.

1. Get someone to take over your cable and TV contract. You only need to change owner's name and address for a fee. Both of you must be present at Singtel (or Starhub?) office with your passports and proofs of address to do this.

2. Get someone to take over your rental. If you're lucky, your landlord will allow you to transfer the deposit to the new tenant, who will take over your rental. Meaning the tenant takes over your deposit and pays you back yours. Even better if the new tenant also takes over your cable/TV contract as well, which means less fee on re-installation, and just on change of owner.

But consider the legal options for this. This is unfair of the employer to pull you out and dump you like that.


Thank you.
That's when I had contacted my agents to find someone to take over the ready apartment, to which they did not assist at all.
I paid over $800 (!!) already to disconnect the TV/cable and received no reimbursement from the employer.

I, ideally, wouldn't like to get into cross-border legal hassles, if it can be avoided..

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby x9200 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 5:29 pm

ap10046 wrote:That's when I had contacted my agents to find someone to take over the ready apartment, to which they did not assist at all.
I paid over $800 (!!) already to disconnect the TV/cable and received no reimbursement from the employer.

Talk to the LL whether he agrees on this approach and if yes, advertise yourself, use classifieds on different websites etc.

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby JR8 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 6:03 pm

ap10046 wrote:The TA does not mention that, if i had even an inkling that something was afoot, I would have acted on it.

I did ask (pleaded) with the employer to help out even for termination charges for cable/tv and all my belongings that would have, now, been heavily excess baggage, but he flatly refused.

Am not in an enviable position...


What's happened here. You got hired and transferred, and then canned after a couple of months?

Kin sucks. But I'm sure some good/help can come from this group...

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby JR8 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 6:05 pm

ap10046 wrote:I was awarded a good position


Come on, tell us the rest (You might as well, since you're completely fuc%ed either way).



p.s. Strange turn of phrase 'awarded a position' .... where you from son?

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby ap10046 » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 6:10 pm

JR8 wrote:
ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?



Come on, tell us the rest (You might as well, since you're completely fuc%ed either way).


Believe me, fact is stranger than fiction..
I was hired from overseas, was literally pushed into getting an apartment within 10 days..moved in, got the EP, etc and in a matter of a few days, was told my services were no longer required.. just like that. When I went to get some more information, the employer was abroad and would return only after I had left..oh BTW, when would you be leaving as we need your EP tomorrow morning...couldn't do anything

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Re: Rental Termination

Postby PNGMK » Tue, 18 Jun 2013 6:30 pm

ap10046 wrote:
JR8 wrote:
ap10046 wrote:Hi all.
My first post here.
Would greatly appreciate all advice.

I was awarded a good position in Singapore in April.
After all the formalities, etc were concluded, I rented out a really, really nice 2 bed condo on the East Coast.
Needless to say, I paid the full brokerage, stamp duty, "good-will" and 2 month's security deposit.

Exactly a month later, my employer calls me to the office and says, things aren't working out as he had planned and that I should deposit my EP, my contract stands terminated and here's a ticket back. Well, it was during the probationary period, so I got no severance, no relocation, nothing and I got left severely short-changed on many other things which I will not get into, and I can least afford to lose.

Shock, would be an absolute understatement. I was flabbergasted!
I had very little time and no choice, but to return home.

Now, naturally I contacted my brokers/agents and requested them for assistance in the matter and they were of no help whatsoever.
So I contacted the owner directly and honestly explained the situation.
He has asked me to pay the current month's unoccupied rent, which I cannot afford anymore, and then will get back to me later..I don't know what to do or what to expect..I know I am most probably going to lose my deposit..but is there any way this may be recovered?



Come on, tell us the rest (You might as well, since you're completely fuc%ed either way).


Believe me, fact is stranger than fiction..
I was hired from overseas, was literally pushed into getting an apartment within 10 days..moved in, got the EP, etc and in a matter of a few days, was told my services were no longer required.. just like that. When I went to get some more information, the employer was abroad and would return only after I had left..oh BTW, when would you be leaving as we need your EP tomorrow morning...couldn't do anything



Ouch - for future reference reputable employers should put you up for a bit longer than 10 days and also carry the rental contract... unfortunately I see more and more doing it cheap - particularly IT types.


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