kosmopolitan wrote:When I was in Australia, I see the need to say, "May I have a coke please?". But when I return to Singapore 1 week later, I couldn't make myself say that same sentence at the drink stall becos I know that her eyes will roll at me suspiciously, and so I said instead, "Coke one" (which is on hindsight actually more efficient. lol).
Firstly Japan is a different culture, you might care to read Japanese history, there are some interesting books around although they might take some time to find. 'A much friendlier and pleasant environment?' To foreign visitor and to some extent an expat maybe, but remember superficial differences are often taken to be fundamental.kosmopolitan wrote: "Why can't we be as civilised as Japanese and live in a much more friendlier and pleasant environment?"!
I disagree, you are no Patty Hearst, what you have done is reached a milestone in the Kiasu dependent program, you can now actually see what a lot of the expats have been moaning about, what is all the more impressive is you live here among all the Kiasu-ness and can now stick your head above it and see it for what it really is.kosmopolitan wrote:"software" aspect of this young country has yet to catch up with its infrastructure. ..
...Malacca, Bali, have much better social behaviour than Singapore. Believe me, I was shocked.....
"Why can't we be as civilised as Japanese and live in a much more friendlier and pleasant environment?". I also saw a new definition of queueing at japanese train stations that is new to me.
"Why are Singaporean cashiers mostly dumb ..Singaporean services always stick by the rules whereas counter staff in Australia are empowered to allow "exchange with no question asked" policy.
kosmopolitan wrote:SMS said, "After 33 or 34 years of courtesy campaigns, I've not seen too many changes over the 26 years I've been here witnessing them."
..........having only a few changes is still better than none right? Come on, changes in human behaviour is not an easy task at all as the entire social pyschic is basically at work (like i mentioned how the atmosphere here doesn't even encourage me to say "May I have a coke please?" at a hawker drink stall, tho taxico is rite to point out that I shd/cld insist), Also it's more effective to educate the young than to modify adults' behaviour (e.g. the rush to potty train a puppy), thus prob explaining why it might take more than a generation instead of 26 years to see very significant changes. I frankly do see less people spit now only after MANY YEARS, so those draconian fines for spitting did work even if it was a mechanical behavioural improvement.
Plavt said, "Firstly Japan is a different culture, you might care to read Japanese history, there are some interesting books around although they might take some time to find. 'A much friendlier and pleasant environment?' To foreign visitor and to some extent an expat maybe, but remember superficial differences are often taken to be fundamental."
...........Care to elaborate? I m a little lost here....If the following is what u mean, I find it a little odd to try differentiate the thin line between sincerely feeling the need to be nice versus acting that out with no sincerity. Are you sayin when the japanese say "welcome to the shop", she absolutely only mean it mechanically? How to draw the line to find out in her heart whether it is sincere, n is it practically important to do so (i.e. to find out) anyway if by that act alone, one already feels welcomed and good?
Mmm...that's something new and interesting concept that I learnt today.QRM wrote:you are now suffering from Stockholm syndrome
Do I have to spell it out for you? Politeness good manners showing deference to elders are part of Japanese culture, as I said read Japanese history that may explain why to some degree. However, just how genuinely sincere the Japanese might or might not be is another issue, I have met plenty who rate amongst the rudest b***** in the world. You went to Japan as visitor and people were polite and helpful as most people I have met in Singapore have been on my visits. On the other hand if you live in a country you will be subject to the same problems as you may or may not face in your native. For example their will be crime,kosmopolitan wrote: ...........Care to elaborate? I m a little lost here....If the following is what u mean, I find it a little odd to try differentiate the thin line between sincerely feeling the need to be nice versus acting that out with no sincerity. Are you sayin when the japanese say "welcome to the shop", she absolutely only mean it mechanically? How to draw the line to find out in her heart whether it is sincere, n is it practically important to do so (i.e. to find out) anyway if by that act alone, one already feels welcomed and good?
In fact its become so mechanical they even have a small movement sensing machine that chirps WELCOME when someone walks in, which is odd if the staff cant be bothered to say welcome why bother having a machine to say it? good manners? or centuries of ingrained protocol that has to be done.Plavt wrote:Yes when Japanese say welcome to the shop it is rather 'mechanical' as they say that to everybody.
You only see less spitting because of the fine. It isn't even a Pavlovian response. It only the fear of a fine. Same goes for littering. They don't throw garbage out of the window of their cars here but watch them driving in Malaysia. Soon as they get over the causeway it starts. Why?kosmopolitan wrote:SMS said, "After 33 or 34 years of courtesy campaigns, I've not seen too many changes over the 26 years I've been here witnessing them."
..........having only a few changes is still better than none right? Come on, changes in human behaviour is not an easy task at all as the entire social pyschic is basically at work (like i mentioned how the atmosphere here doesn't even encourage me to say "May I have a coke please?" at a hawker drink stall, tho taxico is rite to point out that I shd/cld insist), Also it's more effective to educate the young than to modify adults' behaviour (e.g. the rush to potty train a puppy), thus prob explaining why it might take more than a generation instead of 26 years to see very significant changes. I frankly do see less people spit now only after MANY YEARS, so those draconian fines for spitting did work even if it was a mechanical behavioural improvement.
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