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Big Accounting Bonuses

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johnny_pdx
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Big Accounting Bonuses

Postby johnny_pdx » Tue, 27 Jan 2009 6:38 am

Just curious how Big 4 Accounting Firm bonuses are structured in SG. In prior years (last 2-3) how much have they typically been when put in terms of months of salary. I've heard on avg they are about 2-3 months of salary, so just wanted to confirm.

Also, if anyone can chime in, what should one expect to make coming here from the US with 5-6 years of experience?

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 12:44 pm

Coming here now in the middle of a world wide recession with things looking to get even worse? And counting on bonuses no less? Good luck. :roll:

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Postby smayrhofer » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 3:26 pm

I don't think your bonus will be comparable to previous years. Expecting nothing, be happy if you get anything.

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Postby johnny_pdx » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 4:15 pm

I'm aware of the economic challenges and while I don't have any expectations for bonuses this year, I was curious about bonuses in prior years (hence what I wrote asking about the past 2-3 years).

And I don't quite get all the doom and gloom. Business doesn't stop just because of a recession, there's still natural attrition (retirements, voluntary leave, and yes even death) that create a need for employers. I've already received two solid offers to go to SG and am in talks with two more companies. I also know of two people who recently relocated to SG within the past four months. The demand and need for talent is unending, the only limit is the amount an employer is willing to pay!

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Postby durain » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 6:06 pm

why dont you ask the company during your interview? at least it shows your "interest" in the company. :wink:

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 9:30 pm

The answer is simple, one should make what one is "actually" worth. We already know that most high level personnel in the US are grossly overpaid. Hence some of them having to return their obscene bonuses. Here, about the only way that's going to happen (obscene salaries) is if your company sends you over here or you are in Parliament here.

Also, you have to factor in the low tax rate here but on the downside also the 87K limit on income earned abroad exclusion with uncle sam. Add the fact of changed tax laws in the US requiring the excess over the 87K will be taxed at the rate it would have been taxed at without the exclusion and the new treatments for housing allowances and you might be hard-pressed to maintain. Additionally, if you are keeping a home in the US with a mortgage on it, those payments still have to be made as well. Housing allowances have been cut heavily in a lot of cases recently - some are still there but for how long is anybody's guess. If you have school aged kids, figure you will need 20K/year/child there as well. If you sent you kids to public schools in the US, this will come as a shocker.

Business doesn't stop just because of a recession? I'm not sure how old you are but I'd talk to my grandparents if I were you. Or at least somebody it their 80's who still has it together and can remember the '30's and the Great Depression. I've got load's of stock certificates today that were left to me by mother's 2nd husband that are worth more today than they were in the '30's when they went belly up overnight. Today, they have value as collector's items. Welcome to the real world.

One final thing to thing about......

Once you uproot and come over here. What happens when, because you are the newest kid on the block, due to the recession you are made redundant in a couple of months?

sms

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Postby quidsin » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 10:30 pm

In addition to SMS's comments, I've discussed the current economic climate with quite a few old folk in the UK and they reckon this is the worst recession they've ever seen.

So back to your bonus, it is what it say's on the tin, a bonus to have a job and food on the table

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Postby Zeenit » Wed, 28 Jan 2009 11:30 pm

durain wrote:why dont you ask the company during your interview? at least it shows your "interest" in the company. :wink:


Well said and I have bitten my tongue on this post......
All I can say to the idiot is read the post and think again.
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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Fri, 30 Jan 2009 12:56 pm

Well, it would seem the local big 4 companies are prepared to stick their necks out on the chopping block anyway. Seems that today in one of the local morning broadsheets they claim that they will be hiring but only at about 80% of normal. They did indicate that it would be probably due to compliance and restructuring audits. They also indicated (3 of the 4) that it would only be lower entry positions and a few senior positions. Not too sure what that means, but I read it as they might be looking to get rid of a few overpriced seniors to put the companies in line with everybody else. They will probably be picking up replacements from those already shed by other companies and only if they're willing to negotiate. We'll see.......

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Postby johnny_pdx » Tue, 10 Feb 2009 11:36 am

Zeenit wrote:
durain wrote:why dont you ask the company during your interview? at least it shows your "interest" in the company. :wink:


Well said and I have bitten my tongue on this post......
All I can say to the idiot is read the post and think again.


To the idiot who posted this, please read the post and think before replying! I've said I heard it was about 2-3 months, it should be obvious where I got that information from (the companies duh!). However, it's a range and I'm not entirely confident in their answer so I wanted to get some real responses from real people. Look, if you can't read or you can't comprehend the English in my post - fair enough, but if you want to reply, at least write something worth reading!

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Postby johnny_pdx » Tue, 10 Feb 2009 11:47 am

Business doesn't stop just because of a recession? I'm not sure how old you are but I'd talk to my grandparents if I were you. Or at least somebody it their 80's who still has it together and can remember the '30's and the Great Depression. I've got load's of stock certificates today that were left to me by mother's 2nd husband that are worth more today than they were in the '30's when they went belly up overnight. Today, they have value as collector's items. Welcome to the real world.

One final thing to thing about......

Once you uproot and come over here. What happens when, because you are the newest kid on the block, due to the recession you are made redundant in a couple of months?

sms[/quote]

I'm not so young that I haven't experienced a fall-out (I worked for several dot-coms in the late 90's through the boom and bust), but to put it in perspective, unemployment even at the height of the Great Depression in the US, was 25-ish%. A huge number by itself, but it means the other 75% or so of the workforce was gainfully employed doing something. I'm not being facetious, just stating some facts. We could argue all day about recessions and what not, but I truly believe that a good company can't just shut its doors even when it's in a downturn. And if you want to compare worthless stock, bring it on! I'm sure I have amassed a collection far greater than you of worthless paper (unfortunately).

As a result of the dot-com crash I had a career change, so I am staring in my current field a bit green with only about 5-6 years of experience, although I have a few more years under my belt doing something totally un-related.

One thing of note is that a recession does not impact every company the same, nor every person. For one, if you are a debt collector or bankruptcy lawyer then you are practically in heaven right now! Those are extreme examples, but just saying that there are opportunities in every market. I'm in a field that actually experiences an uptick during financial turbulence (enterprise cost management) so I've been fortunate that there is a demand for this kind of service either in big-box consulting, independent consulting, and even within many enterprises within their Op-Ex groups. While it's likely I could move there and be among the first to go, I don't think so at the moment, and even so - nothing risked nothing gained!

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Postby johnny_pdx » Tue, 10 Feb 2009 11:52 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Well, it would seem the local big 4 companies are prepared to stick their necks out on the chopping block anyway. Seems that today in one of the local morning broadsheets they claim that they will be hiring but only at about 80% of normal. They did indicate that it would be probably due to compliance and restructuring audits. They also indicated (3 of the 4) that it would only be lower entry positions and a few senior positions. Not too sure what that means, but I read it as they might be looking to get rid of a few overpriced seniors to put the companies in line with everybody else. They will probably be picking up replacements from those already shed by other companies and only if they're willing to negotiate. We'll see.......


Really? Quite the opposite of what I read. I'll have to find the link as I was quickly browsing and I saw one of the Big 4 was actually cutting management salaries (not sure what this actually means) from 5 to 8%. No word about any staff cuts, but I would assume that it would trickle down to them via very low raises, if any, and slashed bonuses, if any. The firm, KPMG, said it believed those reductions would be enough to stave off any retrenchments and that it predicted revenue growth to resume next year. Anyways, scary stuff when I think about it, but it's not unlike other industries which seem to be implementing the same strategies of pay cuts, forced furloughs, and then of course lay-offs!

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Tue, 10 Feb 2009 1:34 pm

johnny_pdx wrote:
sundaymorningstaple wrote:Well, it would seem the local big 4 companies are prepared to stick their necks out on the chopping block anyway. Seems that today in one of the local morning broadsheets they claim that they will be hiring but only at about 80% of normal. They did indicate that it would be probably due to compliance and restructuring audits. They also indicated (3 of the 4) that it would only be lower entry positions and a few senior positions. Not too sure what that means, but I read it as they might be looking to get rid of a few overpriced seniors to put the companies in line with everybody else. They will probably be picking up replacements from those already shed by other companies and only if they're willing to negotiate. We'll see.......


Really? Quite the opposite of what I read. I'll have to find the link as I was quickly browsing and I saw one of the Big 4 was actually cutting management salaries (not sure what this actually means) from 5 to 8%. No word about any staff cuts, but I would assume that it would trickle down to them via very low raises, if any, and slashed bonuses, if any. The firm, KPMG, said it believed those reductions would be enough to stave off any retrenchments and that it predicted revenue growth to resume next year. Anyways, scary stuff when I think about it, but it's not unlike other industries which seem to be implementing the same strategies of pay cuts, forced furloughs, and then of course lay-offs!


I cannot post the link here due to copyright issues however I've found a link to an online article which is the same one as was in a local business paper. As I cannot post the link here I've sent you a PM for your reading pleasure...... :wink:

sms

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Postby Strong Eagle » Tue, 10 Feb 2009 4:08 pm

<RANT>BONUSES?? The accounting firms and the partners that allowed this financial fiasco to happen ought to be put in jail.

Bonus for what? Earning very large accountancy and consulting fees for looking the other way at high risk investments, questionable transactions, outrageous executive compensation, ludicrous ratings, and off books investment vehicles that transferred no risk at all?

The accounting companies have the fiduciary and legal responsibility to insure that the investing public is not mislead by cooked books. Seeing the literally trillions in lost equity lately, I'd say the bastids are part of the fraud.

The accounting firms are at least as culpable as the ratings firms and the companies that perpetuated the fraud. No bonuses... now or ever.


<RANT>


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