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Drive Through Surrogacy

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Drive Through Surrogacy

Postby QRM » Wed, 13 Aug 2008 1:46 pm

I read an interesting article in the local rag, about India being the place for drive through babies,

It will solve Singapore baby short fall, just send to a clinic in Mumbai a cheque and your bits in a Häagen-Dazs tub with some dry ice. 9 Months later you get a call saying your baby is ready.

That sound perfect for working Mums, no problems with morning sickness and you can still work, even employers might foot the bill.

I assume you are allowed maternity leave to bond with the kid.

There will be no “where did I come from questions”

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Postby sillingw » Wed, 13 Aug 2008 2:58 pm

Except, in the intervening 9 months, the couple separates and/or gets divorced - would we call this a surrogate orphan? Who would have the fiscal responsibility for supporting the child, I can't see the surrogate mother having the will to take over - I think you are right, I can see the lawyers rubbing their hands with glee.

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Wed, 13 Aug 2008 8:06 pm

sillingw wrote:Except, in the intervening 9 months, the couple separates and/or gets divorced

Reminds me of the movie Juno. I watched it on a plane as there was nothing else I wanted to see - expected it to be a silly teenage flick but it was actually quite good and addresses exactly this situation, except that everyone was within driving distance of each other and not the surrogate away in India.

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Postby Hithnar » Wed, 13 Aug 2008 10:58 pm

Call me morally blank, but I like this idea.. a lot, and I'm a woman :oops: . For a woman's body a pregnancy is a disaster. And it's a natural need to preserve ones genetic factors, as well as it's natural to love a child. If it wasn't for the legal risk of a baby being abandoned by both parents, as they don't "feel" legally responsible for it, I'd say surrogacy is great.

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Postby positano » Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:21 pm

Hi QRM

I did not read the article. It is my understanding (correct me if I am wrong) that surrogacy is illegal in Singapore. I do know that there are Singaporean couples who have had their child carried to full term by a surrogate mother overseas and those children were able to obtain Singaporean citizenship(the citizenship process was somewhat more difficult though because of the surrogacy but certainly not impossible).

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Postby QRM » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:14 am

I did a bit more research on the internet so take what I say with a large bucket of salt.

On the birth certificate it is the parents that provided the eggs will be registered as the parent?! Which in theory means when returning to your own country you just have to say YOUR baby was born in India which is not exactly telling a lie.

The surrogate mother and egg suppliers never meet or know each other.

As to morals, I cant see anything wrong with with it, if there is a system in place to ensure the bulk of the fees goes to the surrogate mother to help her build a new house or pay for education for her existing children.

As SillingW mentioned, lawyers will be rubbing their hands, a lot of legislation has not been developed for unforeseen scenario, death of the surrogate mother, transmission of a disease to the child, divorce of the parents.

So far I am surprised by the lack of moral flag waving to this idea, maybe people have become more open minded theses days. There is more understanding if the couple is having problem conceiving, but is it acceptable if a healthy couple do not want to go through the hassle of pregnancy but want a child to apply for surrogacy?

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Postby Global Citizen » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:45 am

QRM, I actually saw a documentary on this where the Indian women and a doctor were interviewd. Very interesting as a lot of the clients are actually Westerners who not only face legal issues but also prohibitive costs back in their own countries over the surrogacy issue. Unable to carry a child to term or conceive naturally, these couples have found kind of a lifeline with these surrogate women.

Most of these surrogate mothers are mothers themselves, have had healthy babies and offer their services through an agency due to financial burdens they face. None have had any desire to keep the babies after birth so no legal issues of that type have arisen and frankly I see it as a win-win for all.
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Postby sillingw » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:15 pm

I'm afraid I'm not convinced it's a win-win - As the saying goes, everyone has a price, if I offer enough money then I can get my way. As Hithnar says "For a woman's body a pregnancy is a disaster" is it not a disaster for the surrogate mother's body? Just because I have enough money to pay the price, does that make it right. I have to be honest, I don't know the answers to my own questions, but I am uncomfortable and it does raise my moral hackles.

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:32 pm

sillingw wrote:As Hithnar says "For a woman's body a pregnancy is a disaster" is it not a disaster for the surrogate mother's body?

Not as great a disaster as not being able to feed her children. And not as great a disaster as going into prostitution, selling a kidney, giving away or selling a child, or taking older children out of school to start working to supplement the family income... Disasters are relative, aren't they?

I think that as long as all parties are willing, it is a fair arrangement. What would make it wrong is when a woman's husband or family forces her into surrogacy against her will. And from what I understand about Indian culture, this may be a very real danger.
Last edited by Wind In My Hair on Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby sillingw » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:41 pm

Wind In My Hair wrote:
sillingw wrote:As Hithnar says "For a woman's body a pregnancy is a disaster" is it not a disaster for the surrogate mother's body?

Not as great a disaster as not being able to feed her children. And not as great a disaster as going into prostitution, selling a kidney, giving away or selling a child, or taking older children out of school to start working to supplement the family income... Disasters are relative, aren't they?

I think that as long as all parties are willing, it is a fair arrangement. What would make it wrong is when a woman's husband or family forces her into surrogacy against her will.


I guess that is what worries me, women don't often go into prostitution voluntarily, I think similar things will happen in this area, If my wife said to me it would be a disaster for her body and therefore we should pay someone else to submit to that disaster, I would feel really uncomfortable - If my wife could not have kids, it would be more understandable, but I would still feel uncomfortable. I think, unless it's really well regulated, with clear laws, it will become just another way for unscrupulous people to take advantage of unfortunate people - come to think of it, it's probably already happening

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:50 pm

sillingw wrote:I guess that is what worries me, women don't often go into prostitution voluntarily, I think similar things will happen in this area

I edited my post as you were posting, so you probably didn't see my last sentence which I added, that I agree it's a real danger.

sillingw wrote:If my wife said to me it would be a disaster for her body and therefore we should pay someone else to submit to that disaster, I would feel really uncomfortable

I would certainly be very uncomfortable if my wife, or in this case I, felt that the disaster of bodily breakdown outweighed the disaster of giving up the 9 months of bonding with my child in the womb. Also I may be wrong but I think the pain of childbirth in a weird way makes a woman love her child more than if she didn't have to go through any pain at all.

So yes, I think there are grounds for being uncomfortable with such a choice. Clearly the person is not ready to be a mother. Motherhood, as I understand it, means sacrificing herself for the child. If she cannot sacrifice at the beginning of the child's life, how would you know she will make the necessary sacrifices as the child grows older? The whole attitude seems out of whack.

It's more clear-cut when the woman cannot conceive, as you pointed out.

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Postby QRM » Thu, 14 Aug 2008 1:28 pm

sillingw wrote:
I think, unless it's really well regulated, with clear laws, it will become just another way for unscrupulous people to take advantage of unfortunate people - come to think of it, it's probably already happening


Like giving /selling blood, these days you don't get people on dark street corners offering you a fiver for a pint of blood. Once, or if, it becomes an accepted way of producing children, it will be regulated, then the unscrupulous will vanish as there's no easy money to be made. As long as the practice remains in the Moral and Legal Grey area people will take advantage of the situation.

We are of course all assuming it will be only uneducated women who will be the surrogate, there are a number of educated western, middle income women who also offer the service.

WIMH point about women being forced into it is very valid, but everyday women are being forced by the husband or family into taking a second Job.

From what I can gather its not that actual practice that people feel is wrong, its the potential abuse that can result from it, that has people worried.

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Postby banana » Sat, 16 Aug 2008 6:29 pm

Jeebus Harold Christ. Am I conservative for thinking this is a terrible idea? Outsourcing procreation? Really? What next, paying someone off to die on your behalf? Oh wait...

Seriously, the whole "opportunity to feed her family" argument is nothing but weak, consolatory rationalising. There is something wrong with the economic system if someone has to rent her womb out to survive. And the convenience factor. Will these rent-a-wombs be available at the nearest 7-11? Or only the ones in the rich neighbourhoods?
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Postby QRM » Sat, 16 Aug 2008 6:41 pm

banana wrote:Jeebus Harold Christ. Am I conservative for thinking this is a terrible idea? Outsourcing procreation? Really? What next,


Outsourcing procreation happens all the time in orchard towers :lol:

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Postby banana » Sat, 16 Aug 2008 7:05 pm

QRM wrote:
banana wrote:Jeebus Harold Christ. Am I conservative for thinking this is a terrible idea? Outsourcing procreation? Really? What next,


Outsourcing procreation happens all the time in orchard towers :lol:


:lol: that would require quality assurance to swing both ways in one operation.
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