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Cote d'Azure - Security Guard

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EastCoastFun
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Cote d'Azure - Security Guard

Postby EastCoastFun » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 3:41 pm

I don't normally post to forums but my wife and I were so utterly shocked that I have to ask if anyone has had a similiar experience.

We were meeting our real estate agent at Cote d'Azure to view some apartments there. Unfortunatly my wife and I were running late and didn't have our IDs with us. The guard told us we needed on to get in. No worries. We called our agent and asked him to come help (we were sure he had his!) The guard said we needed one per car.

Once our agent showed up the guard started arguing with him. We weren't there for why but quickly went over to ask what was up. The guard turned to us and said that we were not allowed on the property. We asked why and he said because we didn't have IDs. We asked if the agent could use his but the guard said no and that we had to leave. We explained that he had just said we only needed one per car and as the agent hadn't driven, he could 'ride in with us' and provide his ID. No luck. Needless to say things got heated.

Finally I said I would be talking to the managment about this and he said "I knew you would complain since all Europeans are babies! So shoo, away with you!" We were shocked! What's strange is that our agent is Singaporean and a great chap... I was the only European looking guy there so I was obviously the problem. I dont' know the guard's issue is but even today, my wife went back to give the managment a letter complaining about the situation and the gaurds refused to allow her in and refused to give her the phone number of the managment office!

We've lived in Singapore for almost 4 years and have never experienced anything like this. Is this a completely 'one-off'?

The 'all Europeans are babies' part wasn't as bad as the 'shoo, away with you'. We were totally embarrassed by this. Really, we'd showerd and everything so we weren't unclean or dodgy looking.

Disappointed on the East Coast!

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Postby ksl » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 4:29 pm

What is the point of having rules and regulations, if visitors are allowed to call the shots? The security were probably within there rights to ask you to leave. You are a security risk?

If you had have accepted the issue at hand, you would have returned for your I.D's inconvenient yes.


If a general approaches the camp gates, with no I.D and the security guards know him.

The General is likely to say, " You know who I am, so let me in" what do you think happens to security if they let him in? A severe reprimand or a fine or both could occur, because the rule is no one is allowed in without I.D. it could cost them their jobs.
Think about it and it will ease your suffering, it's nothing personal, yet he's probably right that Europeans would whinge like babies. I would too, but it's not going to help one little bit!

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Postby EastCoastFun » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 4:46 pm

ksl - absolutely agree with you on why it is necessary to have the rule and to enforce it. No argument.

If he had said 'Sorry, even with one ID we can't let you in, you all must have IDs.' Then we would have understood and left.

But he said we only needed one per car. I specfically asked him if we had 5 people in the car, would we need 5 IDs. He said no, just one.

We had one, our agent's. So we did have an ID. So it was something else.

That still doesn't justify saying that all Europeans are this or that and treating us like something that needs to be cast out. If I'd said that all Indians (he was an Indian man) are 'insert some Indian habit' I'd have been out of line. I've never been shoo'd away like a dog before. At least he could have given us a biscuit or something!

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Postby Saint » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 4:49 pm

The normal complaints on forums about Security Guards are that they let just about anyone in without checks etc.

No excuse for the rudness, very petty not allowing you to drop off the letter or giving you the Management's number.

There is at least one person who posts on here that stay at the condo so maybe she'll be able to advise/help

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Postby EastCoastFun » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 5:04 pm

Thanks for the reply. Don't want to whine too much as it was just a one-off.

We love the east coast. We've always lived either downtown or over by the american club. Now we're able to get a good morning run along the coast without melting. Wish we were here earlier. The weather feels cooler and getting outside often is great.

I've got a few employees that come to Singapore a few times a month for a few days and I was looking for a good place to get an extra apartment. I wanted something close to our place (Makena - we love it) but walking distance to a shopping complex - and the Cote d'Azure is next door to one. Any recommendations?

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Postby Addadude » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 5:07 pm

From the way you describe it, the guard was being an arsehole. It would appear that he has had some kind of run in with other Caucasians and this was his way of getting back. I am sure that your agent will be telling your woud be landlord about this incident. If I were the landlord I would not take it very well if the security guards were actually preventing me from finding tenants.

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Postby Saint » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 5:10 pm

The Seaview which is the new one opposite on the roundabout?

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Postby sierra2469alpha » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 5:25 pm

ECF - how unfortunate for you and your partner, and your agent.

It's always ugly to see blatant racism, and even if the guard was having a bad day, his comments alone are offensive to anybody.

You might want to approach the security firm and maybe pursue a complaint.

Interestingly, in our complex, the guards are great, if a little "too" casual on occasion. We've had friends come around and not even been asked for ID, even when they've parked cars here! Same goes for deliveries.

Also, when we were being shown various places by our agent back in JAN08, he usually got a wave through and only in one complex, 8 @ Mt Sophia, all he had to do was leave his drivers license.

Sorry you had such a bad experience.

P & C

[edit:corrected language]
Last edited by sierra2469alpha on Tue, 05 Aug 2008 11:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Vaucluse » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 8:21 pm

sierra2469alpha wrote:
Interestingly, in our complex, the guards are great, if a little "too" casual on occasion. We've had friends come around and not even been asked for ID, even when they've parked cars here! Same goes for deliveries.

Also, when we were being shown various places by our agent back in JAN08, he usually got a wave through and only in one complex, 8 @ Mt Sophia, did he have to leave his drivers license.


Define 'Great'. And you think this is better - your place gets robbed by people who were given carte blanche to roam freely?

addadude:
If I were the landlord I would not take it very well if the security guards were actually preventing me from finding tenants.


Mate, it is not the security guard's job to help find tenants. It is his job to provide security, and that means only allowing people into the grounds that meet the criteria set by the condo management. The guy seems to have been ajerk, but I can't quite believe he said what was written . . . these guys always get caned for everything and don't invite trouble.
......................................................

'nuff said Image

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Postby ksl » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 10:17 pm

Eastcoastfun:Thanks for the reply. Don't want to whine too much as it was just a one-off.

You have every right to whine, i would have whined myself, probably much more than you, however jerks you find every where, In fact it has happened to me by one security guard, while I was picking stuff up on a sunday, from a condo.

He also didn't want to let me in, because he thought i was a commercial driver. He wouldn't listen either and I had to ring to the condo owner to come down and let us in.

Jerks are every where, but don't let it ruin your day, some of them have probably chips on their shoulders, because of the way some Europeans treat them, it's a little like revenge is sweet. Complain and request a verbal apology if you believe him to have been disrespectful hopefully something maybe done about it.

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Postby sierra2469alpha » Tue, 05 Aug 2008 11:06 pm

Vaucluse - if you're searching for an argument, look elsewhere from us.

It simply will not happen.

We used the word "interestingly", because it is interesting that one property uses different security. Did we say we were happy with our security? No. Did we say they were nice guys - Yes. Slightly different.

If you require everything spelled out for you, then fight your fight elsewhere and with someone else. Some of us won't give you your entertainment.

C & P

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Re: Cote d'Azure - Security Guard

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Wed, 06 Aug 2008 12:47 am

EastCoastFun wrote:I don't normally post to forums but my wife and I were so utterly shocked that I have to ask if anyone has had a similiar experience.

We were meeting our real estate agent at Cote d'Azure to view some apartments there. Unfortunatly my wife and I were running late and didn't have our IDs with us. The guard told us we needed on to get in. No worries. We called our agent and asked him to come help (we were sure he had his!) The guard said we needed one per car.

Once our agent showed up the guard started arguing with him. We weren't there for why but quickly went over to ask what was up. The guard turned to us and said that we were not allowed on the property. We asked why and he said because we didn't have IDs. We asked if the agent could use his but the guard said no and that we had to leave. We explained that he had just said we only needed one per car and as the agent hadn't driven, he could 'ride in with us' and provide his ID. No luck. Needless to say things got heated.

Finally I said I would be talking to the managment about this and he said "I knew you would complain since all Europeans are babies! So shoo, away with you!" We were shocked! What's strange is that our agent is Singaporean and a great chap... I was the only European looking guy there so I was obviously the problem. I dont' know the guard's issue is but even today, my wife went back to give the managment a letter complaining about the situation and the gaurds refused to allow her in and refused to give her the phone number of the managment office!

We've lived in Singapore for almost 4 years and have never experienced anything like this. Is this a completely 'one-off'?

The 'all Europeans are babies' part wasn't as bad as the 'shoo, away with you'. We were totally embarrassed by this. Really, we'd showerd and everything so we weren't unclean or dodgy looking.

Disappointed on the East Coast!


Interesting state of affairs. On the one hand, the comments he made were abysmal and you should have rightly been teed off about them.

On the other hand, I would have to agree somewhat with the security guard (there are a few who are actually reasonably creditable in their duties - they are rare though). Had I been a security guard who is used to being the butt of all complaints as they normally are here, and I had somebody 'try' to wiggle past the requirement set out by the management, I might have gotten a bit vindictive as well. The guard said one ID was need per car. What he probably assumed, and rightly so, is arriving together in one car. Which you did not do. In the days of hightened security due to terrorism, theoretically you could have been carrying a bomb in your car. Couldn't get in and called anybody to come and provide an ID. This isn't really one entry per se but two entries.

So, I'm afraid, it this case, I would have to err on the side of what appears to be relative logic under the situation. Westerner or not, He was probably doing what was instructed and may well have been ad libbing a bit but doing it with good reasoning (course it may have been just BS and he lost his last girlfriend to a westerner). Maybe, like myself even after 26 years here, you misinterpreted what he was saying. Then again, maybe not...... :-|

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Re: Cote d'Azure - Security Guard

Postby Wind In My Hair » Wed, 06 Aug 2008 5:56 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Maybe, like myself even after 26 years here, you misinterpreted what he was saying.

This was my first thought. From experience, it's the most probable explanation.

sundaymorningstaple wrote:The guard said one ID was need per car. What he probably assumed, and rightly so, is arriving together in one car. Which you did not do.

This was my second thought. It's the most logical explanation, especially since the argument started only when the agent, a totally unrelated person as far as the guard is concerned, turned up and tried to get you in.

sundaymorningstaple wrote:it may have been just BS and he lost his last girlfriend to a westerner).

This was certainly not in my thoughts! It was very possible though that he has been threatened before by caucasians peeved at not getting their way, and was sick and tired of it. Minority groups here, including Indians, and those in poorly paid occupations like security guards, do get a lot of shite and react badly to more of the same. So you got a double whammy there. I know what he said sounds unbelievable, but some people here do speak that way, and many more think it even if they don't say it to your face. :P


Personally I don't see why he didn't just take down your car number. If it was a privately owned vehicle, that would have been ID enough. Or use his phone and take your photos as ID. Or requested a drop of blood or a strand of hair for DNA ID. Obviously I'm exaggerating but I really wish service personel in Singapore were more creative and solution-oriented, rather than just going by the book.

Still, this was a guy doing his job and you gave him unnecessary grief. You acted like it was your right to enter based on what you thought he'd told you earlier, and if you had misunderstood him as SMS pointed out, that's enough to put anyone off. I've also never heard of a visitor to a condo, someone who's not a resident or guest of a resident, wanting to lodge a complaint about the condo. I'm not sure if your motive is vengeance or 'improving' the condo. If the latter, this sounds like one of the safest condos in Singapore already and if I were a resident I would want to keep it that way and thank the guard for doing his job rather than rap him on the knuckles because he stood up to some unknown visitor loudly insisting on being let in.

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The Update

Postby EastCoastFun » Wed, 06 Aug 2008 9:02 am

Here is the update on our wonderful Cote d'Azure experience -
It seems that maybe our security gaurd was mad at the agent and not us?

He had planned to let us in with the agent coming (that is why he let us wait for the agent) but 'didn't like the agent's attitude' so denied us entry.

My wife did go back with a letter from us for the managment and the gaurd was there again. He refused her entry in and also refused to give her the managment office phone number saying that unless she had an appointment, he couldn't provide her with the number. She asked if he would notify the managment that she was there and he said that was her own problem, not his. That's just stupid.

He was obviously just trying to be difficult.

I understand being at the front of any sort of customer/guest job can be challenging. You get the good and the bad and sometimes the worst. But still, you need to be consistant. You represent the community and our impression of Cote d'Azure is not very good. We've told a number of friends and one of them said that they found the guards there snobbish and too full of themselves. They said we should have apologiesed profusely making the gaurd feel powerful and we would have been let right in.

1 ID per car is 1 ID per car and shouldn't matter if the agent wasn't nice or not. The gaurd told us if we had a single ID then we could come in and the agent, having not driven, could provide his as we were a single group there to view apartments.

At the very least - a simple: the rules are x, y, and z so you can't come in. No need to get personal and no need to cast us out. I think the guy needs a new line of work. I am not happy he was so rude to my wife (of course this time round she had her ID) but he probably knew he was out of line and was just trying to make things difficult.

We're looking at other apartments now!

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Postby Addadude » Wed, 06 Aug 2008 9:04 am

Vaucluse wrote:

addadude:
If I were the landlord I would not take it very well if the security guards were actually preventing me from finding tenants.


Mate, it is not the security guard's job to help find tenants. It is his job to provide security, and that means only allowing people into the grounds that meet the criteria set by the condo management. The guy seems to have been ajerk, but I can't quite believe he said what was written . . . these guys always get caned for everything and don't invite trouble.


Vaucluse, for a guy who often makes perfect sense, you are being remarkably obtuse. Where on earth did I say that it was the security guard's job to help find tenants?

I simply put myself in the prospective landlord's position. He is looking to rent out his apartment. Something that I'm sure is quite common in a condo like Cote d'Azure. And any prospective tenant is obviously going to want to come in to view these places. The one ID per car rule is perfectly reasonable and the OP fulfilled that requirement when the housing agent offered his ID. But (if I were to go according to the original posting) because this particular security guard was in a foul mood, they were prevented from doing so. Which in turn means that the landlord lost a potential tenant - and a source of income. So, if I were the landlord, I would not be pleased. Do you understand my point now?

A complaint from a general member of the public will probably not be taken seriously by the management. But a complaint from an owner is different matter.

I must say that my personal experiences with condo security guards has been overwhelmingly positive and I've stayed in both large and small condos. Even when visiting friends at other condos I have (to my memory) always found them to be polite, helpful and often friendly. And I would agree with Vaucluse that these guards often get the shitty end of the stick for relatively little pay. The OP's experience seems to me to be completly out of the norm.


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