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National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

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maxumfx
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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby maxumfx » Mon, 21 Sep 2015 2:04 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:6) should be:

On or before the 13th birthday send a registered letter, with postcard return receipt for yourself, to ICA and MinDef/CMPB declaring intention to renounce child's citizenship at age 21. Include a photocopy of your child’s birth certificate, citizenship certificate (if applicable), proof of foreign school enrollment / attendance, proof of departure date from Singapore. The addresses for this notification are as follows:

Central Manpower Base
3 Depot Road, #02-07
Singapore 109680
Tel# +65-6373-3132

ICA Renunciation Unit
10 Kallang Road, #06-00
Singapore 208718
Tel# +65-6391-6316


But as this information, you might want to reconfirm the addresses via the telephone contacts listed for safety's sake. If you find the addresses need to be updated, please let us know and we will correct the entry to reflect the updated information. It's you, our readers, who have provided all this information and collation into an almost one-stop shop.

Good Luck to you and your family.

sms


Yes. Thank you SMS. In fact, I intend to make a call to both the CMPB and the ICA Renunciation Unit to verify the addresses. After I have done this, I will confirm the information here.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby maxumfx » Mon, 21 Sep 2015 3:29 pm

I just called CMPB (Tel#: +65-6373-3132) to clarify certain things with regards to my son's NS liabilities, and this is what I got from them:

- If your son is below 13 years old, then you need not do anything until he reaches 13 years of age.
- Upon reaching 13 years old, you are to write to CMPB at this email address "cmpb@defence.gov.sg" to indicate request to defer your son's NS responsibilities. Basically to inform them that you have migrated and wish to remain overseas, and also your son's intention to renounce the SG citizenship at 21 years old.
- So, they will assess on a case by case basis, and if your son is successful, he will be granted a defer for his NS from 13 until 21. CMPB will send you a deferment package with forms to fill and submit.
- But if your son is not successful, then you will have to apply Exit Permit at the different stages i.e. 13-18 years old, and then at 18 years old ask to defer until 21 years old.
- I've also checked with them if we should also inform the ICA, and she told me we need not to. ICA only comes into the picture when your son is 21 years old and above. For age 13 to 21 years old, the CMPB is in-charge.
- I've talked to the lady. The earlier you migrate the better chance you have for your son's deferment to be successful.

Policies may change and we could end up being screwed if we are not careful.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 21 Sep 2015 3:43 pm

Thanks for the update and now you have a very clear outline of what and when straight from the hoss's mouth! ;-) But what she didn't say apparently, is whether you not your own citizenship will hamper the deferment chances. This I leave up to you, but anecdotally, it would seem that it does have a bearing on the chances as if you are migrating, it would make no sense to retain citizenship in Singapore. That is one of the reasons we've been told in the past. And, as you have noted in you last sentence, Policies may change. This is why I suggested the phone call.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby Diy » Sat, 26 Sep 2015 10:44 pm

Is it true that ex-singaporeans who left Singapore when they were below 16 because one parent is a non-Singaporean, cannot ever be allowed to work in Singapore? I don't understand how is it that foreigners are allowed to work in Singapore but not these ex-Singaporeans in this time and age? Is it because they didn't do NS in Singapore ?

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby the lynx » Mon, 28 Sep 2015 8:29 am

Diy wrote:Is it true that ex-singaporeans who left Singapore when they were below 16 because one parent is a non-Singaporean, cannot ever be allowed to work in Singapore? I don't understand how is it that foreigners are allowed to work in Singapore but not these ex-Singaporeans in this time and age? Is it because they didn't do NS in Singapore ?


Doesn't matter. Even with both ex-Singaporean parents (or both Singaporean parents - depending on whether they renounce theirs together with yours to avoid you doing NS), you'd still get a hard time with MOM/ICA in the future.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby Diy » Mon, 28 Sep 2015 9:06 pm

Thanks. But I don't understand the logic behind this: Ok, by all means, penalise ex-Singaporeans who knowingly left Singapore so they did not have to serve NS.

But why penalise those ex-Singaporeans with dual citizenship whose "crime" was to be born in Singapore at the time their father was working in Singapore and left Singapore when they were babies because of the father's job? Singapore is so multi-racial now with many marrying foreigners. What happens when the foreign fathers finish their contract here when the child is still a baby? He brings his family back to his country. Ultimately these children will have to choose the citizenship of that country. These kids together with their sisters will grow up to profit another country, not us. Singapore shows it doesn't want these children to come back?

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby Diy » Mon, 28 Sep 2015 9:21 pm

Can a male who had renounced his Singapore Citizenship years ago, visit Singapore just for holidays? I mean, will he be stopped or fined at immigration?

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Mon, 28 Sep 2015 10:04 pm

If a male who had renounced his Singapore Citizenship years ago? Sure can visit, can work even, IF he can qualify for an employment pass. However, as a Singaporean male cannot renounce his citizenship unless he has done his NS OR has followed the proper protocol in exiting Singapore (e.g., left before the age of 13 AND all the proper protocol was followed). Then it's no problem, except they will be treated as normal tourists of job seekers without any special privileges.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby WiganMick » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 3:27 pm

My son was born in Singapore in the 1980 to a English father and Singaporean mother he left Singapore as a three year old child, he as never held a Singapore passport, I enquired as to what are the rules if he returned to Singapore to visit his Singaporean family and was told this



2. Under the Enlistment Act, all male Singapore citizens and Permanent Residents are liable for National Service (NS). he is a Singapore citizen and is liable under the Enlistment Act. He has committed an offence under the Enlistment Act for remaining outside Singapore without a valid Exit Permit. Offenders shall be liable, upon conviction, to a fine not exceeding $10,000, or to an imprisonment term not exceeding 3 years, or both.



3. In order not to prolong his default period, he is advised to return to Singapore to resolve his offence. To minimise any inconvenience that he may encounter at the immigration checkpoint upon his return, please inform me of his return date and details via email at cmpb@defence.gov.sg.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 4:29 pm

Yep, exactly right. What did you expect? Special dispensation because his father was British? Same rule applies to any son born to a Singaporean mother in Singapore. The are citizens by birth and certain obligations come with that. They can be avoided if the proper protocols were followed from the time the child reaches 13. After that, he's outside the country illegally as he doesn't have an exit permit. As a mother, it was your responsibility to ensure that the rules were followed. As a Singaporean, you almost had to be aware of the National Service obligation for all Singaporean males.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby WiganMick » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 6:52 pm

No I dont expect any special dispensation because his father is British, we registered him as British when he was born and his passport was British.

I just think its a very harsh way to treat anyone who just happens to be born in Singapore and just say $10,000, or to an imprisonment term not exceeding 3 years, or both.

I wish the Singapore government would look at this law and get it changed, have they ever thought if my son returned at the age of 18 and was conscripted how good of a soldier he would make, and what about all the Thai, Malaysian and Indonesian children who just happened to be born in Singapore would they want to fight for Singapore if there was ever a war.

Another harsh law that Singapore has is dual nationality, my wife was on a Singapore passport with a stamp inside it saying that she had British partiality that was OK until we wanted to travel from England to places like Italy, Spain and France they would let her travel with out having a visa.

So we asked the Singapore government about having dual nationality, they said no , so she decided to cancel her Singapore citizenship and when she returns to visit her mother and brothers and sisters she is on a tourist visa.

Also a very harsh way to treat a Singaporean family.

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Re: RE: Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby ecureilx » Sat, 31 Oct 2015 10:48 pm

WiganMick wrote:Also a very harsh way to treat a Singaporean family.


Harsh ? Not so, when you consider how the uber rich could have played the system, if there were loopholes.

And Singapore doesn't lack super rich.

I know more than a dozen children with one parent being Singaporean, who, rather than burn bridges, put their kids to study here and sent them to NS, and not kidding, am very sure all ended up in police or Civil defence. It wasn't a hardship posting.

And one of the kid's father has a few businesses back home, worth more than 100 million $ or much more, but instead of placing a bond, he too chose to get his son back to Singapore when he reached 12 years of age.
Last edited by ecureilx on Sat, 31 Oct 2015 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby WiganMick » Sun, 01 Nov 2015 12:24 am

I can understand why they have the law in place to stop Singaporean draft dodgers, but my son isnt a draft dodger and he will never want to be a Singaporean so this law shouldnt apply to children who just happened to be born in Singapore.

Like I said before would Singapore want all the Thai, Malaysian and Indonesian children who just happened to be born in Singapore and are now living in a different country.

It would be funny if the Singapore authority's ever did arrest a grown man who just happened to have chosen Singapore for a holiday destination, at the airport because his passport says he was born in Singapore 40 or 50 years ago.

It would be even funnier if it made the world news and through the internet social media got many more adults who where born in Singapore to travel back to Singapore on the same day to give them selves up.

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Re: RE: Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby ecureilx » Sun, 01 Nov 2015 1:14 pm

WiganMick wrote:I can understand why they have the law in place to stop Singaporean draft dodgers, but my son isnt a draft dodger and he will never want to be a Singaporean so this law shouldnt apply to children who just happened to be born in Singapore.


ignorance of the law is NOT an excuse in Singapore!!

Forgot about NS, or dodged NS, it's the same.

I am sure the mother being a Singaporean knew all of it and to claim otherwise is incredible.

At almost every gathering of Singaporeans the common topic is mostly about PSLE and NS, apart from COE and such.


Like I said before would Singapore want all the Thai, Malaysian and Indonesian children who just happened to be born in Singapore and are now living in a different country.


If one of their parent was a Singaporean they have to fulfill their national service obligation.

It would be funny if the Singapore authority's ever did arrest a grown man who just happened to have chosen Singapore for a holiday destination, at the airport because his passport says he was born in Singapore 40 or 50 years ago.


It happened, more than a few times, and it wasn't funny when a few grown men were made to cry.

And the authorities refuse to budge from their stand point. As much as they hang drug smugglers and cane rapists and molesters and vandals, including foreigners, international opinion will not sway Singapore's firm stance on NS Dodgers to change the law. Exemptions may be made but the law will remain.

See, you are missing the point, it's not about being in Singapore, it's about a parent who was Singaporean.

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Re: National Service Deferment Procedure in Singapore.

Postby sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 01 Nov 2015 2:26 pm

WiganMick,

Your problem is one of your own making. Trying to blame the Singapore Government just makes you look stupid. If you actually read my first response to you, I told you that had you followed proper protocols, e.g., at the time the boy turned 13, inform the authorities of his intent to remain outside of the country in the UK and either a bond could have been posted or he could have been given an exit permit which would have had to be renewed yearly until his deferment was given. Then at the age of 21 he could have renounced his Singaporean Citizenship. Hell, all you had to do is read our sticky thread on this subject and it takes you through it by the numbers. The information is out there. All Singaporeans know about the NS laws and I'm sure the mother knew about it as well, but "Oh well, out of sight, out of mind, the Singapore Government won't care" But guess what, all the Government's databases are interlinked today and each ministry has access to all the others. If he should come through immigration with a passport showing a Singapore birth, it will be checked automatically. How many births on any given day in any given year who haven't yet done their NS and don't show up in the deaths register or legally migrated categories will there be for that date? Sounds like additional questioning time to me. Gotcha.

It's not the government, it's the parents.


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