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On Advertising

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Postby Addadude » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 10:05 am

Superglide wrote:Addadude, you work in advertising, because marketing departments need hands and some brains to outsource it to, no more no less.


Well my friend, if your replies are anything to go by, your marketing department needs a LOT of external brains...

Superglide wrote:If you are convinced advertising is selling, I would never ever hire you to communicate my company's mesaage, but seemingly there are those who do, as I guess you're not jobless.


If you don't think advertising is ultimately about selling then you are clearly at odds with the vast majority of marketing and advertising people out there. And you would NEVER end up working for any of my clients. (In fact, I wonder does your boss know that you believe this?)

But that's all cool: there is always room for mavericks in this industry and you could well be the one to prove the rest of us wrong.

However, you are also clearly at odds with the English language - and that really is something that's not debatable...

Superglide wrote:Ok, I think the time has come for me to leave this virtual platform, I am out!


Until next time...

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 10:12 am

Addadude wrote:
Superglide wrote:Addadude, you work in advertising, because marketing departments need hands and some brains to outsource it to, no more no less.


Well my friend, if your replies are anything to go by, your marketing department needs a LOT of external brains...

I almost feel sorry for SG, but... brilliant reply! :lol:

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Postby cutiebutie » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 2:02 pm

Wind In My Hair wrote:
Addadude wrote:
Superglide wrote:Addadude, you work in advertising, because marketing departments need hands and some brains to outsource it to, no more no less.


Well my friend, if your replies are anything to go by, your marketing department needs a LOT of external brains...

I almost feel sorry for SG, but... brilliant reply! :lol:


I guess we should feel sorry for those 'special needs' people in this world. :-|

Oh, banana - John Holmes is dead!
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Postby Global Citizen » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 8:48 pm

On advertising - I got this from another forum and its on unfortunately placed ads and quite funny. Correct Positioning of your product is everything.


ad positioning

And how about these crazy old ads! We've come a long way baby (remember Virginia Slims?) or then again, maybe not. :lol:


old ads
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Postby banana » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 10:33 pm

cutiebutie wrote:Oh, banana - John Holmes is dead!


John Holmes the UN guy or John Holmes the trouser snake guy?

Global Citizen wrote:On advertising - I got this from another forum and its on unfortunately placed ads and quite funny. Correct Positioning of your product is everything.

ad positioning


heheh...those web ads are the result of automated contextual advertising iirc. human beings are still good for something!
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Postby banana » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 10:54 pm

ksl wrote:
I am amazed at how you managed to read my "lack of military experience" from an analogy that only briefly touches on roles. Maybe I should be in export and you in advertising.
Not quite sure how I should take that, so I'll remain :-|


Exactly what it says. Your interpretation of my analogy is so creative, the best response I can give to it is to make a joke.

ksl wrote:
newspapers, billboards, in between shows
All are welcomed and needed by myself, however cost restricts choice, but building bridges for advertisers, can also mean many things, not quite to the point, or transparent enough, if you ask me, :) much better to come clean if one can, without being penalised! :lol:


Are you suggesting that I am trying to sell my services to you? If so, thanks for giving so little credit. I would have the good sense to get in touch via PM or email if that were the case.

As far as I'm concerned, this is a discussion on the various aspects of advertising - while it is my business and profession, it is also something that carries socio-cultural implications. A company's advertising reflects its values and personality, the state of advertising in general is an indication of a given society's cultural consumption and mindset.
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Postby ksl » Wed, 11 Jun 2008 11:55 pm

Banana:Are you suggesting that I am trying to sell my services to you? If so, thanks for giving so little credit. I would have the good sense to get in touch via PM or email if that were the case
No not at all, quite the opposite in fact! only desperate people would resort to blatantly ignoring the rules and it achieves nothing!

I believe you are putting the information to good use! It's not difficult to know, what you are doing, it's a little more difficult to see why, you are doing it, maybe you are expanding your horizon, multi cultural opinions are worth there weight in gold, and I'm just as interested in the feedback as you are, life is a learning process, even at my age :) my mind is quite open, and split hairs, I can't use for anything, I need to solve problems, not make them :wink:

while it is my business and profession, it is also something that carries socio-cultural implications. A company's advertising reflects its values and personality, the state of advertising in general is an indication of a given society's cultural consumption and mind-set.
Funny enough, I and someone else was discussing the Singaporean socio - cultural implications tonight, it's quite right what you say and a tremendous bonus for you, to recognise the fact!

much better to come clean if one can, without being penalised!
I meant this to be a caution really, because I quite often walk the line myself, with my own discussions on vinegar, simply to get a better understanding of what people think, not that I intend to advertise, it is more of a genuine interest in health, the feedback is useful...although like i say, the line is thin, and I would be reminded by the mods, of the fact! :oops: If you understand my drift. :lol:
Last edited by ksl on Thu, 12 Jun 2008 3:25 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby ksl » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:18 am

cutiebutie wrote:
Wind In My Hair wrote:
Addadude wrote:
Superglide wrote:Addadude, you work in advertising, because marketing departments need hands and some brains to outsource it to, no more no less.


Well my friend, if your replies are anything to go by, your marketing department needs a LOT of external brains...

I almost feel sorry for SG, but... brilliant reply! :lol:


I guess we should feel sorry for those 'special needs' people in this world. :-|

Oh, banana - John Holmes is dead!
:oops: Hello CB this is an advertisement :wave:

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Postby Wind In My Hair » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:26 am

ksl wrote:Hello CB this is an advertisement :wave:

Ah, that must be okay then, because it means you're not selling anything. :lol:

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Postby ukdesigner » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:44 am

This post is still going... excellent.

Thought I'd catch up and follow up on a few comments.

Someone mentioned that advertising is selling. Well that's not strictly true. Advertising is one of the many things involved. There's not point advertising / marketing a product if your staff can't close the deal. So in some respects it's not selling, it's announcing / informing.

Advertising these days is so much more. By using socio-economic figures, race, etc etc you can pin-point your clients. That doesn't mean it'll work but you can narrow down your options, like the so-called recent internet advert target marketing that was done. I noticed that some of the adverts were geographically targeted to me at Singapore. I didn't click as none were of interest.

In my humble opinion, advertising HELPS to sell and doesn't sell on its own. It's such a wide topic, as obviously shown on these pages, that many opinions are varied as we have seen here.

Adding another piece onto the discussion, does anyone think that big images and lots of white space is good in an adverts or would you prefer to see lots of images and text filling up the advert with lots of colour?

Just curious!! :wink:
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Postby ukdesigner » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:58 am

sorry probably rambled a bit on the last post. Am very tired, so if it doesn't make sense, ignore it!
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Postby ksl » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 3:28 am

Wind In My Hair wrote:
ksl wrote:Hello CB this is an advertisement :wave:

Ah, that must be okay then, because it means you're not selling anything. :lol:
:lol: I'm free! :lol: A good job the wife doesn't read these threads! :) Never mind confession is coming up soon!

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Postby Global Citizen » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 6:14 am

ukdesigner wrote:This post is still going... excellent.

Thought I'd catch up and follow up on a few comments.

Someone mentioned that advertising is selling. Well that's not strictly true. Advertising is one of the many things involved. There's not point advertising / marketing a product if your staff can't close the deal. So in some respects it's not selling, it's announcing / informing.



Isn't it also about maintaining a market presence? For eg. take Coke and Pepsi. Both well established and successful brands and keen rivals in the cola market. Both spend millions on advertising in order to maintain their position as top dogs. Pepsi appears to be spending more though, what with their celebrity endorsements.

I'd like to know if any of you think they (Pepsi and Coke) win any new converts to their respective brands with their ad campaigns or is it about staying in the game? A case of 'The more I see, the more I believe or buy into it?'

I'm also curious as to which brand is leading overall. Ad guys if you can furnish some figures, I'd be grateful. My bet is on Pepsi at the moment.
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Postby Addadude » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 8:56 am

ukdesigner wrote:Someone mentioned that advertising is selling. Well that's not strictly true. Advertising is one of the many things involved. There's not point advertising / marketing a product if your staff can't close the deal. So in some respects it's not selling, it's announcing / informing.


Nope. Advertising IS selling. Check the definition of "selling" in any dictionary. (I quoted from Merriam-Webster Online in one of my earlier replies.) The term "selling" is pretty broad. Blame the English language if you like but that's the way it is.

We are all "selling" on this thread: we are each trying to "sell" our own opinions on advertising - and not always succeeding obviously. But we are still "selling".

In fact a great deal human activity can be defined as "selling". By wearing that designer outfit you are making a statement about yourself - in other words you are "selling" how stylish you are or whatever. When you work hard at your job and try to outdo youself every time in the hope that you will gain much deserved recognition, you are "selling" yourself. When you meet the person of your dreams, your body language automatically alters to "sell" you as a possible partner to that person. The, ahem, ladies of 'purchaseable virtue' at Orchard Towers dress to impress and "sell" themselves. It doesn't mean they are going to be bought though...

In more conventional terms, when you step into a retail store during the (so-called) Great Singapore Sale and you see so many 'bargains' proudly displayed with amazing 50% OFF!* tags attached (*Subject to terms & conditions). The store is selling to you too - but it doesn't mean you are going to pay out your hard earned cash for an item of clothing you'll end up never wearing.

So, when I develop a campaign for say, Clean & Green Week, depending upon the brief from the National Environment Agency, I could be "selling" the idea that recycling is good idea and so easy to do. It doesn't mean that Singaporeans are going to really 'buy' that idea and actually change their behaviour - but I'm still selling to them.

Nothing I have said denigrates the rest of the marketing process but fundamentally, advertising is all about selling. And many, many highly influential marketeers (boy, do I hate that term - it makes them sound like buccaneers or something...) including the very highly opnionated Sergio Zyman (I mentioned him in my first reply to this thread) equate good advertsing with good sales results. In other words, if an advertising campaign doesn't result in increased sales (however you define that term), then it is a bad advertising campaign.

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Postby sundaymorningstaple » Thu, 12 Jun 2008 9:31 am

Frankly, from a pure layman who has stayed out of this thread because I know absolutely nothing about it, I'd have to say, from a purely personal point of view, that "Advertising" for me is selling. I'm usually not attracted to Road Shows or special campaigns per se, but the constant exposure to Advertising, provided which, it is something that I am interested in, will get my dollar. I'll usually short-list before I ever go into a store to buy anything and already have a pretty good knowledge of a product from my own research (like buying cameras for instance). I shortlisted what I wanted, needed and would like to have. Then I hunted for independent roadtests/reviews and further shortlisted. Once I get to the POS postion where I actually meet the first "salesperson" I've already sold myself. Makes for easy sales for the person as they generally don't know their products anyway (from experience). Therefore, Advertising, for me, is selling pure and simple.

A rose by any other name is still a rose......


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