Question about accommadation for indians...

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gowrip
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Post by gowrip » Sat, 17 May 2008 1:31 pm

thanks for the responses folks. i guess i get a clear idea now.

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They cook with Ghee, cooked over a small charcoal burner that is often the favoured method for meal preparation by a lot of Indians and has a tendency to create lots of ghee ladened greasy smoke that permeates everything it touches
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sundaymorningstaple, i have to agree yours was the most interesting response so far :-). Maybe I should explain my cooking methods when I post my profile in the sites in the wanted ads. :-).

The last time I have seen charcoal in my house is when I was a little kid and we used it on the backyard to heat up water for bathing. And ghee isn't really much used in Tamil houses (atleast in Tamil nadu, India) for cooking. but i guess that would be because people in indians in singapore are probably richer on average and use ghee more - or it is some style of cooking i am not used to from my family background. and ghee does have long lasting effects (the smell of which many people love here).

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My feeling is that you won't be rejected if you seek out the interaction, people just won't really try to include you unless you express interest. I'm sure if you wanted to join a sports team or supporter's club they won't say no Indians allowed. Same with going out to bars and clubs, people won't start avoiding you if you try to talk with them. It's not that they want to exclude you or don't want to see you, it's more like people are used to racial groups staying together, i.e. they would think you wouldn't be interested in talking to them either, unless you initiate it.
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Turtle, i think i am getting a pretty good idea. thanks. but somehow i just didn't quite expect racial segration (by default) in singapore - one of the reasons why i chose to do my studying in singapore to begin with. but then again, as someone once said... "if anyone thinks that the borders only exist on the manmade maps and none in the real world, let me assure you... the borders of the real world are much thicker than they appear in the maps, even within countries - it is the way people live".

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Post by dumbovader » Wed, 21 May 2008 12:01 pm

There is definitely racist undertone in Singapore.

I came back to singapore afer a month in hanoi. This morning on the way to work walking to the LRT , a kid most probably in kindergarten with his grandmother goes "eee apu neh neh*". I was like wtf.

I have lived in singapore for about 14 years now, which includes 2.5 years stint in the army. What i have noticed incidents like the above more frequently in recent times. Growing up i lived in expat enclave of east coast / katong most probably why i dont recall such incidents in my earlier years.

*its derogatory term for Indians.

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Post by ksl » Fri, 23 May 2008 4:39 pm

dumbovader wrote:There is definitely racist undertone in Singapore.

I came back to singapore afer a month in hanoi. This morning on the way to work walking to the LRT , a kid most probably in kindergarten with his grandmother goes "eee apu neh neh*". I was like wtf.

I have lived in singapore for about 14 years now, which includes 2.5 years stint in the army. What i have noticed incidents like the above more frequently in recent times. Growing up i lived in expat enclave of east coast / katong most probably why i dont recall such incidents in my earlier years.

*its derogatory term for Indians.
eee apu neh neh*".
Well I'm totally dumbfounded, that you have lived 14 years in Singapore, and don't know what "eee apu neh neh" really means!

My wife is Taiwanese and her mother is hakka, and my daughter uses, this expression quite often, when she was a child, neh neh is refering to milk, or breasts...and is also quite often said by children, they find it quite funny, that some women have bigger neh neh's than others.

In fact because i have pumped weights all my life, I also have developed muscle in that area, of which my daughter also says, why have you got neh neh pop ha! It's nothing more than harmless fun...apu is grandmother, so all the kid is saying is "grandmother big tits or breasts" there is nothing derogatory at all! In fact it was probably a compliment!

Although my Chinese may also be wrong, but i doubt it!

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Post by yankee_ibanez » Sat, 24 May 2008 1:44 pm

dumbovader wrote:There is definitely racist undertone in Singapore.

I came back to singapore afer a month in hanoi. This morning on the way to work walking to the LRT , a kid most probably in kindergarten with his grandmother goes "eee apu neh neh*". I was like wtf.

I have lived in singapore for about 14 years now, which includes 2.5 years stint in the army. What i have noticed incidents like the above more frequently in recent times. Growing up i lived in expat enclave of east coast / katong most probably why i dont recall such incidents in my earlier years.

*its derogatory term for Indians.
What do you mean by "eee apu neh neh" ??? it could be some funny childish slang. How can you ascertain that its derogatory??

"Growing up i lived in expat enclave of east coast / katong most probably why i dont recall such incidents in my earlier years."
Here are we trying to distinguish between east and west of singapore. didnt get the co-relation of this context.

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sat, 24 May 2008 3:19 pm

yankee_ibanez wrote: Here are we trying to distinguish between east and west of singapore. didnt get the co-relation of this context.
That's okay yankee_ibanez, we don't have a clue what you are trying to say either. #-o

pot. kettle. black. :roll:
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Post by Flutterby87 » Sat, 24 May 2008 4:36 pm

ksl wrote:
dumbovader wrote:There is definitely racist undertone in Singapore.

I came back to singapore afer a month in hanoi. This morning on the way to work walking to the LRT , a kid most probably in kindergarten with his grandmother goes "eee apu neh neh*". I was like wtf.

I have lived in singapore for about 14 years now, which includes 2.5 years stint in the army. What i have noticed incidents like the above more frequently in recent times. Growing up i lived in expat enclave of east coast / katong most probably why i dont recall such incidents in my earlier years.

*its derogatory term for Indians.
eee apu neh neh*".
Well I'm totally dumbfounded, that you have lived 14 years in Singapore, and don't know what "eee apu neh neh" really means!

My wife is Taiwanese and her mother is hakka, and my daughter uses, this expression quite often, when she was a child, neh neh is refering to milk, or breasts...and is also quite often said by children, they find it quite funny, that some women have bigger neh neh's than others.

In fact because i have pumped weights all my life, I also have developed muscle in that area, of which my daughter also says, why have you got neh neh pop ha! It's nothing more than harmless fun...apu is grandmother, so all the kid is saying is "grandmother big tits or breasts" there is nothing derogatory at all! In fact it was probably a compliment!

Although my Chinese may also be wrong, but i doubt it!
I know this website might not be entirely credible,

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... pu+neh+neh

But the meaning is essentially there. Just the other day in psych class we talked about racism and my friends said how when they were younger their grandmothers/mothers warned them about the "apu neh neh" if they did something wrong. Having heard the term used by kids countless of times while growing up in Singapore, yes, it does have a racist meaning. Whether it was used as such by the boy in the LRT, well, who knows? It would have to be a pretty big coincidence though, if it wasnt actually used by the boy in a racist way.

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Post by yankee_ibanez » Sat, 24 May 2008 4:51 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:
yankee_ibanez wrote: Here are we trying to distinguish between east and west of singapore. didnt get the co-relation of this context.
That's okay yankee_ibanez, we don't have a clue what you are trying to say either. #-o

pot. kettle. black. :roll:
hahaha... OK i had confusion on 2 points...
1. How can a child saying "apu neh neh" or whatever can be considered as racist?
2. How does staying in expat enclave in east coast/katong be significant in not seeing any such incident there.. ? :???:
so was abit inexplicable to relate the above two things.

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Post by dumbovader » Sat, 24 May 2008 8:04 pm

ksl wrote: Well I'm totally dumbfounded, that you have lived 14 years in Singapore, and don't know what "eee apu neh neh" really means!
....
KSL

In this instance have to disagree with you.

The right word for Indians should be in Mandarin "Indu ren" or in Hokkien "Intor lang".

other derogatory term for Indians is "keling kia","mangali" to be frank i am not entirely sure how the terms came about, i mean the historical logic behind it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singlish_vocabulary

yes , neh neh is tits . :twisted:

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 May 2008 1:12 am

Oh, to add my 2¢ worth, I asked my wife (Tamil) and she concurs that yes it has been used as long as she's been around and yes it is a derogatory racist terms often used with regard to Indians by the Uneducated Chinese children (taught obviously by the Uneducated Chinese parents or grandparents).
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Post by ksl » Sun, 25 May 2008 2:00 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:Oh, to add my 2¢ worth, I asked my wife (Tamil) and she concurs that yes it has been used as long as she's been around and yes it is a derogatory racist terms often used with regard to Indians by the Uneducated Chinese children (taught obviously by the Uneducated Chinese parents or grandparents).
It's very strange to say the least, because in Taiwan the phrase is used every day, by babies and they continue to use it when growing up, and there is very few Indians around that i can see...

I'm sure that maybe some other Taiwanese can vouch for this, so I would say, that it has been dragged into Singlish, with no real foundation of a derogatory meaning... Imagine if we are 1000 Taiwanese 2 Indians and 1 Singaporean, that came out with that expression...1000 Taiwanese would not see it, as derogatory and it is hakke language...

That's why I am dumbfounded by it...my daughter is 7 and she says it occasionally, without the grandma bit, because grandma is not here, but the exact meaning of neh neh from a baby would be asking for milk....not tits or breast, but the feeding bottle..It's referred to breast later in life, as a kiddies expression for tits, breast's by adults, to children.

Although and would i could imagine be used very often, if a large breasted woman passed by, more out of envy, than anything else, because Chinese don't have big boobies, which they would all like to have.

Can you imagine when i was in Beijing to study, i went to the pharmacy to buy condoms, and went back to my dorm, it wasn't until i was in a embarrassing position, that i realised i couldn't use them....and American had to come back with me, to explain i needed the extra large ones...everyone turned red and was giggling, crikey i thought, i'm only average, what's the joke that was making me feel so uncomfortable.

So I think the Singaporeans and the Indians, may have bypassed eachother, although I will say most Indian women are well endowed in the breast department, So I can imagine many Chinese kids would say neh neh and possibly point, which of course is rude.

I could only hope, that Indians, can look at the true meaning of the word, and it would be a compliment rather than, a derogatory iin my book, although I'm a Brit, so it does help to here the explanation come from a few Chinese, Mmm I'll have to check that with my Singaporean brother-in-law.

Wikipedia by the way, is not always correct information either! So more that join in on this, the more crystal clear it will become....If any indians are out there are reading this, we are just attempting to educate Singaporeans in the use of Chinese.

No wonder many Singaporeans, go to Taiwan or China to learn Chinese.

dumbovader! Thanks for the link, my apologies, but dumbfounded i am!

Hakka for those that don't know it, where probably here in Singapore in the trading days, too, so it would have been used on a regular basis.

Hakka
The Hakka (Mandarin: Kèjīa) are a subgroup of the Han Chinese people who live predominantly in the provinces of Guangdong, Jiangxi, and Fujian in China. Their ancestors were often said to be from Northern China or Central China centuries ago. Hakkas originate from Southern China. In a series of migrations, the Hakka settled in their present locations in southern China, and then migrated overseas to various nations throughout the world. The Hakka have had a significant influence on the course of Chinese and overseas Chinese history: in particular, they have been a source of revolutionary and political leaders.
FlutterbWhether it was used as such by the boy in the LRT, well, who knows? It would have to be a pretty big coincidence though, if it wasnt actually used by the boy in a racist way.
I guess it look's like coincidence then, because he did say grandma was probably with the boy "a kid most probably in kindergarten with his grandmother goes " In that case it wouldn't have been derogatory, however if a child, without the grandmother being there used the, phrase apur neh neh, then i agree, it is a clear derogatory term.

And it would be if i said, god look at grandma tits.. so no difference, although that's also a great misundertsanding on behalf of many, if grandma is with the child, the kid is saying to grandmother in a nice way, because that's how kids are raised at feeding time, if you can understand the clear difference. the kid is clearly not being derogatory.

However it is easy to make mountains out of mole hills! :lol: which is normally what happens in language. Although I'm sure my brother in law, will brief me, on the issue.

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 May 2008 10:23 am

ksl,

All that is all fine and good, but who cares. It actual practice in Singapore (not Tiawan) it is a confirmed derogatory remark aimed racially at Indians. Has been for a very long time (the wife heard it when she was a very young child (which is well over half a century ago) :wink: We can confirm it first-handedly, anecdotally and via online reference so it must be factual regardless of it's origin.
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Post by satrap75 » Sun, 25 May 2008 11:35 am

Flutterby87 wrote: I know this website might not be entirely credible,

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... pu+neh+neh

But the meaning is essentially there. Just the other day in psych class we talked about racism and my friends said how when they were younger their grandmothers/mothers warned them about the "apu neh neh" if they did something wrong. Having heard the term used by kids countless of times while growing up in Singapore, yes, it does have a racist meaning. Whether it was used as such by the boy in the LRT, well, who knows? It would have to be a pretty big coincidence though, if it wasnt actually used by the boy in a racist way.
the website has the correct meaning for the term. this term "apu neh neh" is used by those uneducated chinese in the early days to discipline or instill fear in their children. this is so that they will be obedient to their parents. my grandma used this term on me and my siblings before.. well, more than 2 decades ago..

why they make reference to the indians and also the sikhs. generally, they looked fierce to the children. probably that's the reason.

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Post by Matney » Sun, 25 May 2008 1:01 pm

sundaymorningstaple wrote:I would suggest that you take you husband along for the ride as it's too important to leave up to one person if you are married.
Speaking from experience there, SMS?!?!? :o

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Post by sundaymorningstaple » Sun, 25 May 2008 2:48 pm

As many times as I've been married. You better believe it! :P
SOME PEOPLE TRY TO TURN BACK THEIR ODOMETERS. NOT ME. I WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW WHY I LOOK THIS WAY. I'VE TRAVELED A LONG WAY, AND SOME OF THE ROADS WEREN'T PAVED. ~ Will Rogers

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Post by ksl » Mon, 26 May 2008 1:23 am

sundaymorningstaple wrote:ksl,

All that is all fine and good, but who cares. It actual practice in Singapore (not Tiawan) it is a confirmed derogatory remark aimed racially at Indians. Has been for a very long time (the wife heard it when she was a very young child (which is well over half a century ago) :wink: We can confirm it first-handedly, anecdotally and via online reference so it must be factual regardless of it's origin.
hi, I don't doubt the fact, my interest is purely from a linguistic point of view, after a discussion with the brother -in -law it didn't help much, however my wife pointed out a difference in the pronunciation, of which is different, in Taiwanese.

Although at the same time, i thought it a good idea, to explain to the kids...fortunately they are unaware of the derogatory terms, although my daughter told me, that she had heard a different pronunciation of it, when she was playing with a Singaporean Chinese girl..but she didn't know, the derogatory terms, she does now, and will refrain from saying the words.

Hakka is Ah Po for grandmother, quite different in tone, but a word to be careful with. http://www.angelfire.com/la3/mayuko_lai/hakka.html

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